To your question:

Jarrod Dyson is having a nice season and provides the great D and baserunning you'd expect from him, when in the game. Cain is on pace for 4.4 bWAR or 3.5 fWAR, both impressive totals that establish him as a well-above average CF. It's unlikely Dyson could reach those totals in a full season, because some of his flaws would get exposed if playing every day (like his inability to hit lefthanded pitching).

No one evaluates trades the way you're trying to, because it becomes a convoluted exercise that tells you nothing about the trade itself. You can't track every breadcrumb that eventualizes from a trade. How would you track the value KC gets out of Odorizzi?

There's really nothing to support your assertion it was a salary dump. And there's really nothing to support continuing to blast on the trade. The Royals got two valuable, cheap, controlled, above-average everyday players back for Greinke, and another piece was used as collateral elsewhere.

Like I said, Moore has made plenty of mistakes. Hammering on the Greinke deal is just dumb, really. There's nothing wrong with the return received there.

Wins tell you about as much about how good a pitcher actually is as his eye color. It was a little bit different when starters often pitched complete games, but in today's baseball setting, wins are next to worthless.

See: Roger Clemens 2004 season, in which every stat except wins made it clear he was the best pitcher in baseball, but he only won 11 or 12 games (for a team that was a contending team, no less).

Exactly. The win totals for a lot of good pitchers has started to decrease over the years because they pull starters so much earlier. The last 25+ game winner was Bob Welch 23 years ago. Cy Young voters have also changed their opinions on pure wins and losses.

Glass loves you... You're the stat he counts on...

Seriously, you guys making lemonade out of lemons, thinking people don't understand how you're making it, is just funny...

So I hope you feel like you have some kind of corner on the market for all things obvious, but alas, you do not.

Well, I'll give you this, some of you have found the silver lining in the storm cloud. And what's funny, he and his wins will be gone long before he gets the support he needs to help this team make a playoff run.

Trading for Shields, given what the Royals sacrificed, was epically stupid. However, one can hold this correct opinion without mitigating the impressive talent of Shields himself.

That's why they reference it as they announce the who the pitchers are... "It's 4-6 Tommy John who has green eyes going up against the 9-2 Tony Johnson who has blue eyes." Yeah, that's what they say...

Yeah, it actually does mean something... It may not tell the whole story, but it's not irrelevant either. And as starters do get pulled earlier it might grow less meaningful.

But one thing's for sure, I'm Shield's 2nd biggest fan now, he totally made this team awesome and a contender. He sure did provide the leadership we needed for the youngs kids to step up and realize their full potential..

:thumb:

He is good, I'll give you that, he's just not playing for an owner that'll surround him with players who will ever pull their load, cumulatively, enough to make a run for anything meaningful.

Won games? I think those are the stats everybody should count on also.

LMAO

This just keeps getting worse.

Here, I'll help you: "I was wrong. I posted something really stupid via screenshot because the point was lost on me. Sorry, I'll quit making myself look more pathetic and try to learn something from my mistake."

There. Better?

I think not... Perhaps I'll say something after his next start when the announce him as "The Royals winning 8 of his last 9 starts" instead and not mentioning the 4-6 stat. Oh, that's tomorrow (unless it rains here), and they might mention what you see below. So far, short of the live broadcast that has yet to air, he's being introduced as being 4-6 and going up against Fister who's 7-5. Interestingly they do show the ERA, but alas, nothing about how many wins they've had in their last nine starts, nothing about any family member who won a pie contest, nothing about having won yard of the month any number of months over the last nine months, and nothing about what their eye colors are. Nope, it's 7-5 Fister against 4-6 Shields and their ERAs (which Shields' is better!)...

I'm happy we've won those games, and that's the common ground we stand on. And that's a good thing...


http://i.imgur.com/Pove4Jt.jpg

I'm glad we have Shields on this team. It's been a long time since KC actually have a decent starting pitcher that's worth a shit, outside of Grienke's unbelievable Cy Young year. Santana as well. I guess some of us have short term memory of shitty pitchers before Shields and Santana was here....

Wins and losses for starting pitchers is a useless stat.

Glory "Clown Shoes" Dayz

I'm glad we have him too, just sorry he probably won't ever have a supporting cast that'll do anything but waste his talent.

LOL, from the guy who's afraid of Bruno Mars... Nice...