McCluster is Kris Wilson so far.

I see him split out wide plenty. He never gets the ball, though.

Remember Wilson's first year? He was out on the field but basically invisible.

I hope I'm right too. Things haven't been what I expected with Weis so far. I think even the folks who had the most apocalypic expectations for Cassel would admit that the production of the offense as a whole so far is an insane disappointment. I can't for the life of me think of any reason while the QBs play would get worse now. Maybe whatever Weis is doing is resulting in even more pressure behind the scenes on Cassel, giving him even more to think about during a play, something else. Hell if I know.

Just been wacky so far.

Assuming Mark Castle continues to put up those freakish efficiency ratings and we start losing games, something will snap, Mr. booger.

Probably Weis' stomach band.

FAX

No, he's a second round pick.

He needs to run a route, beat his man and catch the ball.

KC media reports second hand information from unnamed sources that Charles isn't pleased. Wants ball more. Didn't like being yelled at on sidelines. Unnamed players think there is a double standard because Cassel never gets yelled at/blamed. Plant implodes. Ya know. The usual. :)

Anyway, we're 2-0. You knew some shit had to come down. Stupid ass football town, innit?

So ... more consideration and patience for McCluster?

Meanwhile, Jones, who has done nothing but carry the rock well and with determination gets dissed because he's not Charles? Fans have their favorites, I guess. Meanwhile, it all sounds like a big, fuzzy work-in-progress to me.

I know this much ... if Mark Castle continues to throw to McCluster in the flat with a safety teeing off on his ass, it isn't going to matter much because McCluster will be on IR.

FAX

Exactly. I think a pass fake to Dex in the flat will open a deep ball. If cassel can get it there.

I wonder...has anyone ever seen Cassel pump fake?

I mean, if the safety or corner is playing up in the box to the point where Dex is getting creamed off the snap, couldn't he try a pump fake to get the safety to bite and get it to a receiver downfield? (Assuming that we have a receiver on this team that's capable of actually getting downfield.)

LOL

I just see it as Pioli hopes cassel can start to get things to click. So does Haley. Haley is put in the middle because i imagine Weis has about had it with him and Haley would atleast entertain the thought of pulling him if he knew that Pioli and Hunt wouldn't freak out and they could go with what Haley has said about it doesn't matter who makes how much, etc and the best player plays and they can start applying that to the QB position too.

IMO it becomes much easier, even for Pioli to be willing to pull Cassel being that the special teams and D are so improved and the potential of the playmakers on O if they spread the ball around, run the ball with all the talented backs and play action pass.

Winning is the most important thing for this organization. Hunt knows that. Pioli knows that. Haley sure knows that. I just hope they don't let the loss's pile up before they come around to thinking that letting Cassel play backup for awhile atleast.

2 receptions for 9 yards, actually.

Here's an idea. Well, it's more like a theory type of deal ...

Maybe ... just maybe ... the reason Jones is getting most of the carries is because Haley & Company are trying to get the o-line to gel a little more. That might make sense. Jones isn't a game breaking, take-it-to-the-house-from-your-own-20 kind of guy. He hits the hole that is designed to hit. He's not going to make something happen out of nothing ... at least, not generally.

Charles, on the other hand, made our o-line look a whole lot better than it actually was last year.

Haley has repeatedly stated that he wants a physical football team ... and that starts with the o-line. It could be the reason Jones is getting the majority of the work. Maybe it's more about the o-line.

FAX

I wouldn't recommend mentioning the offensive line around this joint. People seemed to come unhinged at the idea that anything is "more about the o-line." And at Charles' expense? Holy hell...

Exactly.

There could be a million different reasons why Jones is started, but I really don't think a lack of respect or faith in Charles is one of them.

Those aren't options until we can open up the offense. Defenses are taking away the entire short field. It's the same problem for Charles--even when he's getting carries, he's getting attacked right away.

Yeah... if only we had drafted Okung it might be different around here.....

Nice color lipstick on that there pig.

Now, if you could work on the smell a bit more...

I mention the o-line all the time. I don't recall anybody coming "unhinged".

'course I think the problem lies primarily from guard to guard, rather than on the outside, more on the right, and believe that Albert is doing just fine at LT.

Plus I don't have "poo" in my name. That probably helps.

Guard to Guard we're fine. Waters, Wiggy, and Lilja are our strength right now. Our interior O-line is fixed for THIS YEAR.

RT is still a revolving door. Hopefully Richardson can develop in the passing game.

His development would be helped by a guy that actually released the ball a little more quickly.

Cassel had plenty of time to throw this past weekend. Milkman counted off 5 and 6 seconds more than once.

The QB blows.

It's worth noting that he was thrown to in the flat to start the game that went incomplete, he was also thrown to again in the first quarter down the field and lost his footing coming out of his break. There's 2 attempts to him that won't show up in the box score.

Charles has constantly impressed Haley. So I don't think he's not getting enough carries because he's in Haley's dog house. I think it could very well be that he wants to keep Charles fresh for the latter part of the season when teams are tired on tired legs.

If we're going to continue to attempt to play power football, we have the wrong line for it. That's not Wiegmann's game, and Lilja is probably too small, as well. There's a reason Jones ypc is down a half yard from last year, and it's not because he's a year older.

We have the same problem we've had since Wiegmann left after his first tenure here: we need a center. And that will become more and more clear as the year goes on, and Wiegmann's weight steadily drops towards 260. In the same light, Waters' play will continue to decline as he ages. So the reality is that the line is not really "fixed" because this team is not being built for now, it's being built for 2011 and on. Asamoah may (should) be part of that, and Lilja may be part of that, but there's still work to be done.

Something that hasn't been mentioned that I heard repeatedly in the early part of the radio broadcast as well was that the browns intentionally left the grass long to try and slow some of our team speed.

(Seriously, somebody was worried about slowing us down. A chiefs team. When has that ever happened?)

I think the line is better suited for Charles too. But Jones ran effectively on Sunday. The only reason his YPC were down was because a) the Browns were teeing up to stop the run; b) the Chiefs were running out the clock toward the end.

More importantly, the deep ball opens up the pass to Dex in the flat. The Chiefs don't even have to be outstanding throwing the ball deep. They just have to be okay at it. Right now, defenses have so little respect for the deep pass that they're loading their entire defense to stop the short shit.

Maybe this has been answered, but I'm not going through the thread. I have it, have re-watched it and cannot see it. First, it's odd how many 3rd and 6's we had. I never saw any belittling on the sideline and I never saw Charles on the sideline away from his teammates. The only thing that could be speculated about, was that Charles was in on 3rd and goal with 7:50 in the 4th quarter, KC was forced to take a timeout and when play resumed, Jones was in the backfield, but it was an entirely different look. Again, never saw anything on the sideline.

The only thing I ever saw on Charles face was on his last touch of the game, 1st and 10 with 5:20 left for a 1 yard gain. Charles got up walking to the sideline shaking his head, but it looked more like it was in frustration that the play was stuffed.

There were 4 more running plays by KC to end the game, all by Jones.

I never saw anything that was an obvious issue with Charles/Mo.

2nd half TOP KC-20 minutes Browns-10
Charles - 4 touches Jones -15 touches
I'm writing my senator demanding hearings

email sent
awaiting reply

So much for Occam's Razor.

Actually, Keg, the interior of the O-Line has played pretty well thus far, creating seams for Jones, and giving Cassel a pocket to step up into if he had any pocket awareness.

Lilja and Weigman have been upgrades from anyone that played their respective positions last year, and Waters has benefitted from the play to his right.

Albert and Richardson have played better than last year, though I do think there's plenty of room for improvement.
But neither have been the liability that okung'ssacofshit would like us to think they are.

You Missed the Fixed for THIS YEAR part of my post.

And this line was designed to be a light, quick, zone blocking line. Not a "power" line. Just because they are running in the middle doesn't mean they're playing power football. I think the line is fine for this year.

Really.....Matt Cassel is the one true weakness on this team. That and our inability to generate a consistant pass rush.

As far this whole Charles needs more carries thing goes....I agree.

BUT...lets not pretend that Jones isn't doing a good job in there either.

Sac is smoking crack.

Albert has picked up where he left off at the end of last season and Richardson is continuing to make strides. By the end of this season, the tackle position shouldn't even be a question going into 2011.

Think if we had a young developing qb and studebaker turns out like we think he will we could be set and could start adding depth.

I have been impressed with the play of Belcher. He seems to be playing well.

Oh no!!

lol

I agree with this.

On the issue of Charles, while I am in the camp that feels we need to get him more touches, this offense will rise or fall on Cassel.

The Titans were 0-8(?) before Jeff Fisher made the switch to Vince Young at QB, in spite of all the yards that Chris Johnson was compliling on the ground.

Vince Young isn't a very good QB still (yet?), but he did make some big plays that complemented what CJ did on the ground, which helped them to win games.

JC needs more touches, but Cassel needs to produce, or none of it matters at the end of the day.

I'm talking long term - the positions they need to look at in the future are guard and center. I don't think Waters or Wiegmann are going to be here very far down the road. But the idea that they need to replace Albert, or that they should have been dedicating draft picks to tackle instead of the positions they've taken? No way. That kind of crap is why people come "unhinged".

That said I don't think the seams for either back have been all that impressive (thought it was poor against SD, better against the Browns), though I think it's fair to attribute that to the problems with the passing game and not the offensive line. Until Cassel finds some kind of success, we're not going to be able to run the ball as effectively as I think we can.

And I do think we're going to develop problems in the middle of the line this season due to the age and size of the starters.

**** me.

Heh, I think we're all saying the exact same thing, but since it's the planet, we're arguing. LMAO

Barry Richardson isn't Willie Anderson and Albert is not going to be Walter Jones, but they don't have to be. B-Rich can be an above average RT and Albert can be one of the better LTs in the game. That's more than good enough.

If you want to bitch about the OL, bitch about the center play.

But..but Saccopoo says we need an LT?

As long as the team is winning with this setup. I don't think that JC will be getting more touches than what he's getting now.

Funny. People were saying the same thing about Randall Cunningham his first year, too.

Unfortunately, you aren't going to win in this league unless your QB is pass first, run second.

McNabb, Young, and McNair all had great scrambling ability, but only used it as a last resort, and only succeeded once they made running a secondary option.

I think we are agreeing.

The seams they've created are actually pretty impressive given that the defense is keying on the run.

And that 56 yard TD run by Charles against the Chargers was made possible by Waters and Albert sealing the inside, while Moeaki (I think) sealed a LB on the edge, and a great downfield block by Bowe.

As to the question of the future, I think Dane makes a good point in another thread, in which he suggests that Lilja should move over to Waters spot, and Asomoah will hopefully beable to take over for Lilga on the right side.

We do need to address the center position in the draft, but we do have some blocks to work with for the near future.

the problem with our offense is the QB, not the OL



the top 10 problems with this team are all the QB

our QB makes every single player on our offense look worse than they are...OL and skill players...and Weis


Cassel is the QB equivalent of a circus clown

The only thing LJ has to worry about now, is getting shit canned AGAIN!

Dear LJ, clean out your locker and get the hell out!

LMAO

http://nl.dreamstime.com/unemployed-...umb7267085.jpg

On the Charles touchdown, Albert & Pope doubled down on the end, Lilja pulled and took the outside backer, Bowe the strong safety and then Castile blew up the corner.
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-h...for-the-Chiefs


Asamoah should be by next year our starter at right guard for the next decade. Albert, Asamoah, and B-Rich is a pretty good nucleus - get a center and we are in shape on the OL.

I couldn't remember the exact blocks that were made, but I remembered that the left side of the line did a great job of opening a hole for Charles to bust through.

Shhhhhh............ That is Thursday's topic

This is ridiculous, some of you playing this off as though it's nothing. Fax, Hootie especially.

This isn't about Todd Haley first of all. This is about Maurice Carthon. This is also different from the way DJ and DBowe were treated last year. Jamaal Charles, a superstar RB was treated like a 14yr. old Chinese girl in a sweat shop.

All Jamaal did was come off of the field, after getting the team a first down by doing his job, and had a look of displeasure with the situation on his face. This prompts Carthon to "What the **** in your problem? Don't want to come off the field? You're the mother****ing backup RB, it's your ****ing JOB to come off the ****ing field." not only did he say these things, but probably many more as he was said to follow Charles up and down the sideline(this should tell you Charles was trying to get away and end the situation, obviously berated and embarrassed) berating him even more, making sure to make him feel lower than dirt in front of his peers.

Tell me you would stand for this at your place of employment. Tell me you would have no problem being treated like this in front of your coworkers, but some customers as well(Cleveland fans seated right behind the bench). Not cool, especially if you're currently a top 3-5 RB in the league.

Also, for you idiots who think "Jamaal can't get enough carries b/c we go 3 and out all the time". We wouldn't go 3 and out every time if Jamaal carries more, period. The guy averaged 5.9 yds/carry last year, and is averaging 6.4 this year. You could argue that things would become too predictable, but that didn't matter last year did it?

Thomas Jones is doing an OK job, but compared to Charles, he sucks. Best player should be your starter, I personally don't care who starts, but he should at least be the feature back. Jones should take short yardage snaps and maybe a bit more. That's it.

I'd like to see him more involved with the passing game, if we had one. I am not really concerned with how man carries DMC gets at all.

The bucket of grease on aisle 25 -please
we have another one

I haven't been on for a few hours, so I may have missed something, but where did you hear this?

They are NOT the same kind of back...You comparing them to each other is all I need to know about your football intelligence....:loser:

I could REALLY give a god damn about what type of back they are. Jamaal is better period. Jones is on his way out, but is still "productive", good for him. Jamaal Charles is one of the best RB's in the league. PERIOD.

Oh, sweet merciful Tebow, THIS.

Just horrible. ****ing awful. Completely forgettable, and worth two piles of AIDS-Tofu.

Fraz, Nick Wright says a player text with the issue, and he dug deeper, talking with a bunch of players, none of them Jamaal Charles, and this is what they said.

He was MF'ered up and down the sideline. Many players said they "felt bad for him", "were embarrassed for him" and so on.

I applaud you for sticking up for your guy, Mr. aturnis.

I'd rather see Charles getting more carries, too. I don't think I could be more consistent about that. He's a dynamic playmaker and we need him on the field.

My problem has to do with this particular "story" and the source of this information ... or, rather, the unnamed sources. It's pretty clear that Nick Wright is more than willing to doggedly pursue "stories" that wind up going nowhere. Do you not recall last year when Haley started calling him the "DJ guy" or whatever because Wright asked why DJ was not starting at every single presser? He had people convinced that there was a rift so serious between Haley and DJ that it had reached the point that he actually questioned whether or not DJ was going to quit the team and football altogether.

I urge you to take what Nick Wright says with a healthy dose of skepticism and a big glom of rational objectivity. If there's a problem between Charles and Carthon or Charles and Haley that may or may not involve other players, it makes more sense to believe that they'll work it out internally and that it won't come down to the Chiefs "losing" Charles. Doesn't it?

FAX

I think he had a great 7 game stretch, but to proclaim him one of the best in the league is a bit far.

Wright went on to say that he "believes" Carthon will be chastised by Haley and Jamaal will get 18+ touches on Sunday. FWIW.

I too would like to see Charles get more touches however, he is not a 25 touch a game for 16 games is he? That being said, it would be nice to see him some more than we have.........He is pretty damn good at catching too!

If this shit is true, I might shoot someone in the ****ing kneecap until they bleed to death from it.

He is the best player on the ****ing team. Play his ass. Right ****ing now.

No one is a 25 touch a game RB anymore, but him not taking the majority of the carries is completely stupid. He's one of the few playmakers the team has and they voluntarily keep him on the field for most of the snaps.

No, no. We should "save him" for when we're competitive and he's out of the league.

Dumbest shit I've ever ****ing seen on this site. Mind. Bottling.

I agree, FAX, and never once bought into any of the "losing the team" shit last year. This though, is different than what happened to the other guys. Not to mention Carthon has a history of coaching his ass straight into player mutinies as Dane has said. The other guys lost their starting jobs, and that's it. He has a point though. Nobody seems to have bought into this regime as much as Charles, and from the get go. He hasn't said nil about becoming a backup, he's done everything right. Including, seeing his team struggle on offense, knowing there was something he could do to change that, and wanting the ball in his hands. He got verbally raped for wanting to be a winner. Not wanting to be a stat leader, just a difference maker for this team.

The only way I agree with "save him" is if we sneak out a decent record in the first half of the season and put him to it in the second half to try and grab a playoff spot.

Seriously. I'd never even heard of the guy before, but if he's ****ing stupid enough to publicly humiliate our best player like that then he's obviously too ****ing stupid to be a coach.

Lets talk in reality terms right now...this team babies Matt Cassel who is one of the worst players on the roster and takes Charles, it's best offensive player and sits him for the majority of the snaps.

This is why it was an issue that he wasn't listed 1st on the depth chart. This coaching staff didn't want to play him last year, he sat behind a washed up LJ, was inactive for a game. Didn't play till LJ made the decision for them and left them with no one else to use..now that they got another option he's sitting again.

This front office/coaching staff doesn't like Jamaal Charles for some reason, what it is we don't know.

I don't believe in any possible scenario of "saving" a player; the concept simply doesn't exist in the NFL, especially for RBs.

And I'm ****ing sick of trying to dream up hypothetical solutions for why we're not using our best offensive player, meanwhile overlooking all of the simpler explanations that paint our coaching staff (and "Executive of the Decade") as ****ing idiots.

4-7-37. Never forget. Anything is possible.

"He's starting to get it." Haley should shove that quotation right up his ass sideways.

“Jamaal Charles is now calling himself a ‘backup.’ So it’s not an equal sharing (between him and Thomas Jones). He’s the backup.”
Kent Babb, 610 AM

I don't care if he ****ed Clark's wife. HE THE BEST PLAYER ON THE TEAM.

Jesus, even with talent, what chance to we have to get better when idiots run this team? :banghead:

Hopefully the next time Mo Carthon is in a Porta Potty, he jumps in and drowns himself.

I still can't believe this was such a hot button topic two whole games into the season. I guess we needed something to panic about so it would still feel like we were fans of the Chiefs.

I don't disagree with the concept ... what I don't know are the actual facts. I don't understand why Charles isn't seeing the field more. I really don't. It's puzzling and mysterious ... as though there's something going on behind the scenes that no one knows about. Nevertheless, I have to take this "story" with a grain of salt ...

First off, when did the super-secret, Pioli-enforced, Arrowhead Society Fight Club decide to allow players to disconnect themselves from the cone of silence and talk to Nick Wright about jack? I'm a little skeptical of his "sources".

Second off, the whole lead-in to his show was way over the top ... the Chiefs are in danger of losing Charles? Really? Because Carthon is a known ass hole?

Third off, it seems to me that there would be ways to handle something like this internally. If Charles or any of the players feel that Carthon was out of line, there will be opportunities for them to make their grievances known to Haley. Nick Wright isn't their savior or counselor or arbiter.

Fourth off, Charles is a big boy. I have serious doubts as to whether or not he is going to let Carthon break his spirit. He's a tough guy. Hell, he dislocated his shoulder on every third play last year (or so it seemed), popped it back in, and was back on the field before you could say, "Touchdown Kansas City". To me, that doesn't sound like a guy who's going to let Maurice Carthon get control of his head.

I guess I just don't trust Nick Wright to say or do anything that isn't in the best interest of Nick Wright and his ratings. Especially after the absurd manner in which he overplayed the entire DJ issue last year.

FAX

Hopefully, the local media, as shitty as it may be, keeps asking about JC every week.

How do you limit the playing time of your best player? Cant even begin to wrap my brain around this logic.

Uh when the best player on the team calls himself a backup and is treated as a backup, problem.

I don't care what team it is, that's a major problem.

Two games into the season.

Gotta panic about something. Cassel isn't enough.

If we'd scored an offensive TD (or two--dare to dream) in week 2 and Charles wasn't getting half the touches as a back on the backside of his career, it would probably be less pressing.

Right now, we're winning, which is awesome. Though it's not luck that's propelling us, we can see the tracings of smoke rings in the reflection.

What's more surprising is that there is a counter-argument to claims of, "Our best players should start."

Jones is NOT better suited or more skilled than Charles. Not in any fashion, semblance, or manner.

I've now watched the Chiefs look like basically the worst offense in football while the teams best offensive player sits on the sideline...how is this something that shouldn't be talked about as an issue?

What does the guy have to do to play, I'd say when he got his chance to play last year he showed he deserved to be the starter.

From the time he became the starter last year, no RB in the league has outperformed him save Chris Johnson. Thing is, Charles did it when the guys across the line knew he was going to do it. There has been no pass attack. He's had a terrible o line, and basically did it all by himself. Yes, he's one of the very best.

In this case, he'd have to injure Thomas Jones. Shame, but I was afraid of this from the instant I started reading articles on how Haley was having wet dreams over his biceps.

If Charles throws a tantrum and wants out, I support him 100%. We can watch him become a 2,000 yard rusher for another team and blame Haley for it.