Took me awhile to get caught up in here, and I have to say this is one of the best thread discussions I've seen on CP for a long long time, so thanks to all for excellent point/counterpoints w/out degrading to stupidity, which too often dominates this place.

I won't claim to be well studied on draft prospects, just don't watch college fb like i used to anymore. I have seen quite a bit of film clips of Geno, good and some not real good. Many of you are far more informed than I am, so I appreciate the discussion and information!!

Seems to me we need to stop analyzing Geno, or any other QB, in a vacuum or vs each other even, and definitely not vs. Luck/RG3, or Brady/Manning, and definitely not Cassel. Please let Cassel go, it's over. We need to focus on the system to be built by Reid/Dorsey and Co., and who will plug and grow the best. Cause this is precisely how they see it.

I've heard lots of things about how Reid values a strong OLine, but frankly I just don't think this is true. His OLines have always had issues, which is a big reason why McNabb was always on the run improvising outside the pocket. Our new system QB must be extremely proficient in the scripted, quick read, short passing game, with mobility to create and improvise. And, be able to stretch the field, even if the success rate is very low. Reid will call the fly pattern as #1 read, with the very specific intent to keep the defense honest.

Can Geno do those things and be highly successful? I definitely think so. More so than any other imo. He skipped the Sr Bowl and gained ground on all the other QBs. That alone eliminates any other QB from #1 pick consideration. Can Geno fix his mechanical oddities? That's what coaching can do, or at least what coaching is supposed to do. For the 1st time possibly ever, we have a staff which makes absolute premium impetis in developing a franchise QB. And even more so, to always have another project QB understudy in addition to the franchise QB.

I'm on the Geno #1 bandwagon, have been for awhile. I don't need him to throw at the combine, and I seriously doubt he will. He and his team do not care what we think, or how much we want him to prove it. I'm betting he can prove all he needs to at his pro day, and he will be the #1 pick.

Then CP can start the bickering meltdowns once more. :)

Correction: Post #286 - #314 are pure money. Great Discussion.

Brees like anticipation.

not me, it's not like he's a WR or anything. I don't know the extent of why he wears it but good precaution, may as well wear it just incase he does take a hit on his lead leg. Would be better to have then not to have.

"Great discussion!"

"No, YOU made some great points!"

"I enjoy reading this thread with you guys minus BlackBob"

Do you ladies want to sit down, crack open a tube of cookie dough and talk about your feelings?

**** YOU.

I never turn down free cookie dough.


Where's it at, bitch? :)

This is a thread about Qb's on CP. What the hell is going on here? If someone doesn't call someone else a true fan, genobater, or a racist soon I'm going to lose it. **** it you all can die in an aids fire.

lolz
Posted via Mobile Device

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BBz8yVlCUAIW3Wu.jpg:large


IMG Academy IMG AcademyVerified ‏@IMGAcademy

Check out what QB has joined @GenoSmith_12, @Tyler_Wilson8 & @ZDysert4 at #IMGDraftPrep: #USC's @MattBarkley! pic.twitter.com/7Iu4NpeZ

Ban this man.

Yes they have. This is more like what the Planet used to be... and still should be.

I wouldn't worry about that. Now days, pretty much all QB's wear a knee brace on that left knee. After what happened to Brady and how easy it is to get rolled up on, it's precautionary.

I don't see why they don't just spray a little deer antler on there.

Good to see. Barkley must be healthy enough now to compete now.

Look at Geno not even paying attention. Bust.

How now brown cow

Barkley really does intrigue me. I think he's been WAY overanalyzed and beaten up too much.

They all have. It's the Andrew Luck backlash.

Barkley practicing how to squat when he sits on the bench next to all the other USC busts.

He's dialed in to that mans nipples.

Barkley better hope he measures at 6'2. If he's closer to 6 foot like I think he is, he will slide.

I really think he will measure short as well.

very curious about his height and hand size. From what i've heard and read people seem to think he'll be around 6'1" 1/8th. not horrible but i do hope he's closer to 6'2"

Guy behind him..."Heh, I'm not even filming."

Also interesting is Dysert is rated at 6'4", but in the group photo him and geno look the same height, or close to it

When you see Dysert in pads, on the field with other players, like at the Senior Bowl, he doesn't look 6'4"...

I think he measured at 6'3" at the senior bowl.

I disagree with the part in bold because, as you said, accuracy is all about bio-mechanics and repetitious motion. If you lack the ability to throw 10-15 yards accurately, you'll really notice when you stretch that pass out from 10 yards to 20+.

I guess what you are getting at is if it's going to be a crap shoot of a pass at 10 yards why not go for broke and gain chunks at a time, but we all saw what happened when Cassel tried to bomb it away. He either threw incomplete by over-throwing, got it picked or damn near killed his WR by under-throwing it.

He did that on SCREEN passes.

If you're going to throw a pick, it's better that it happens deep in your opponent's territory than on your own 35.

How many screen passes were intercepted and how many "bombs" were intercepted?

You ready to flip out?

Here's Cassel's 2012 splits, charted by how far the ball traveled in the air. ALL of his picks (except 1 aberration) were on short or medium passes.

If you never throw a pass beyond 15 yards until you're down by 20 pts odds are that's where most your INT's will be...

Down by 20 points is irrelevant.

Dude doesn't throw downfield much at all, ever.

Which was precisely DJ's point.

The guy is going to throw picks no mattter where he throws it. Might as well throw it deep. At worst, it's a punt. At best, it's a PI penalty and a 1st down.

I'm not defending the POS I never wanted here.

He threw so many short passes you would have thought this was a WCO and you would have expected not average but extremely high completion percentages...

I know, I'm not suggesting you are.

I'm just elaborating on DJ's point for mdchiefsfan.

Those numbers are misleading if you really break it down:

1-10 yards make up 46% of his pass attempts at a 66% completion rate. He was picked off in this area on 4% of his attempts.

Add in the passes from the LOS and you make up for 66% of his passes which were picked off 3% of the time.

from 11-20 yards which make up 22% of his pass attempts with a 47.5 completion rate has him at a 4% chance of an interception/attempt.

Then add in all passes past 11 yards and you get 34% of his passes at a clip of 6% chance of interception/ attempt.

Obviously, you don't want to throw it out longer than 10 yards with Cassel.

You're completely missing the point.

please elaborate

By compressing the passing game vertically, you increase his completion percentage but you BARELY affect his overall interception percentage.

Furthermore, by compressing it SO much that he can actually complete some passes, you neuter the offense to the point they can't even get a first down.

You'd be better off to chuck it deep more often and see if you could get a PI penalty. At the very least you're stretching the field and decompressing your running game and if he throws a pick, it's basically the same as punting.

The problem is teams didn't start defending the long ball at all because of his poor passing percentages. He constantly couldn't punish teams for stacking the box due to his lack of a vertical pass. They constantly dared him to pass over top and he couldn't do it.

I understand what you are saying, in theory, but you are saying that the defense stacked the box because we didn't pass the ball long. That's not true. Teams stacked the box because he couldn't complete a pass that far.

No, that's not necessarily what I'm saying. I'm talking about probabilities.

While throwing it short decreases somewhat the chances of something BAD happening, when you have a QB like Cassel, it also doesn't increase the chances of something GOOD happening.

And if teams are stacking the box, that improves the probabilities on the long pass. At the very least, you catch the DBs off-guard and they have to hold or PI...

I think the probabilities show that throwing it far means you have less of a chance to complete a pass and just as much or slightly more of a chance of getting picked.

We may have to agree to disagree here, brotha.

A complete pass isn't necessarily a positive - that should be evident from simply watching the games. You still have to get the ball beyond the yard marker...

So he's an extremely timid passer.

And when you consider in his completion percentage he's just dog$#it...

I understand that. But if you take into account that if your chucking the ball down-field with an extremely inaccurate passer all together, when you decrease the chance for a completion by going for a longer throw, the 10 yards is harder to get when you only have two attempts, instead of 3, to gain them.

I'm struggling to find another QB in the NFL that completed less than 70% of his passes BEHIND THE LOS.

You have to factor in the fact that current rules create a situation where PI is called about 1/3 of the time. That's an automatic first down and potentially a HUGE play that, with said QB, you can't get ANY OTHER WAY.

Timid...

Brady Quinn?

I wouldn't want to game plan on an intangible like that because it becomes a 50/50 shot of who gets called for PI

He didn't complete a whole lot of passes anywhere...

Well, we are talking about game planning around MATT CASSEL. :D

No one ever did that when he was a Chief...

Can't wait to see Tyler Wilson's Hall of Fame induction ceremony in the future. Maybe Geno can give a speech.

ROFL

:thumb: Your pretty much ****ed either way you slice it. Obligatory: **** you *****!!! :cuss:

:clap:

Geno will be obliged to give a speech since he'd be paying Wilson back for speaking at his induction ceremony the previous season.

Geno will be joining the Hall of Fame the same year as David Garrard.

1st ballot ftmfw!

...

<-----Doubts sincerity - expects passionate retort regardless...

How ****ed would it be if Mike Glennon ended up being the only good NFL QB out of this class?

I would probably just start watching NFL Europe.

God. Kiper going on and on about "I told you so" would be enough to load a gun with one round for me.

I work with a guy that expects just that.

Wow.

It would be a looooooooooong time before I lived my disbelief in that one down...

Does Kiper have a daughter? I'd probably take my anger out on her. And I am not talking about violence.

Yeah him and Gabbert will be in the same HOF class.

I already made that joke about Geno and another Jaguars QB. Come on guy.

ragebanging ftmfw!!!

I hope a Jaguar eats your face off

LMAO

I'd have to give it bath salts first.

I don't know enough about Glennon to know what the root issue is with his inconsistency, but he seems to play some really solid ball and then go into a rut where he plays very poorly.

When the guy is on, he looks pretty damn good...if Reid and Dorsey think they can fix his inconsistency, I'd have no problem with them taking him, but there is no way for any of us to know what that would take and if they can fix those issues, why not take the superior prospect (IMO anyway) in Geno Smith and try to fix his inconsistencies?

100% his footwork. And by his footwork, I mean he has none.

Not buying it. I can see PART of the problem being footwork, but footwork doesn't make you throw a pass 5 yards into the dirt in front of the intended receiver on a comeback.

I was thinking the same thing.
Though I hope he throws in Indy.

The only thing Geno needs to throw is his big chocolate penii in the faces of raiders donkeys and chargers for years to come.
Posted via Mobile Device

That chart says that his interception rate was:

<11 yards = 2.8%

11-30 yards = 6.9%

>30 yards = 12.5%

Seems like a pretty substantial increase to me.