Sometimes two beaters are better than a used escalade

I agree. Let the Browns or Panthers over pay for this guy

He's a 5 time first team all pro...

It prefer develop the young guys. This ingredient to be "impossible to stop" is not needed.

Mahomes is so good at processing and buying time that he throws to open guys.

Compared to the other HOF QBs, Mahomes does not require his receivers to make contested catches.

And Kelce makes decisions on where to go during the play. If Hopkins were on team and healthy, I am sure he could be productive, but he deserves to be paid a lot and Chiefs may not need him.

And Hopkins personality is like a hard-working Alpha that competes hard as hell but does not show much joy. Maybe he would not be a great fit.

Under what circumstances?

And are you actually saying DHop is an Escalade?LMAO Try Porsche 911 turbo.

We're not going to hit on every pick or keep every player, you weigh risk assessment here in your windows.

It’s funny, because just a year or two ago some of us were saying how we really didn’t want to end up with Mahomes having to carry the offense a la Rodgers/GB, due to the lack of top-tier weapons, and most on here agreed that we didn’t want to put Pat in that situation.

Now we have people actively wanting that.

It's weird to because it's not like we have a metric shit ton of huge contracts, we aren't the Eagles or 49ers.

Mahomes is the one footing the maintenance bill on that used 911 turbo

Recency bias.

In no way shape or form is it a good idea to do what Green Bay does. It worked for us this year but it's not a great strategy because honestly your margin for error becomes razor thin. The end of the Bengals game when Marcus Kemp is out there speaks to that.

Right.

All this season proved was that Mahomes CAN win with a bunch of middling guys.

That doesn't mean this season proved it was a good idea going forward.

This team should always be looking to improve, no matter what. Thankfully, that's Brett Veach's MO so we're all good.

My exact thought process...

Like guys he would be the BEST WR he has ever had. Why the **** not, yes will we lose some guys? Sure but we have already LOST guys because of contracts.

What I think Hopkins can potentially provide is 2-3 year window of TRUE dominance on the offensive front.

We HAVE to capitilize on not just Mahomes window (Bigger) but Kelces window. We have 3-5 year left of top tier TE play.

Does ADDING HOPKINS allow Kelce to dominate a little longer?

Derek Mason? ROFL

It really is about maximizing Kelce's window...... And if adding a future HOF X-WR to take double off of him helps add to his longevity I want it.

I wonder if the Bucs would entertain trading Mike Evans?

I wish Goodwin didn't get injured because I would have love to chase him

Was just thinking that Mike Evans could do some things that Kelce does to like you said help add longevity to him.

I've been thinking about this lately, wasn't sure how to really quantify or express it, but you guys did a good job here.

Ideally, yeah, you keep drafting and having great drafts. It's just that it isn't feasible to continue to constantly hit like we did. If you get 2 or 3 starters out of a draft, that's a hell of a hit.

We also can't just keep asking Mahomes to be all time great kinda player every season. He's gonna likely do it, but at some point, you just have to keep weapons around him.

You'd also like that if he plays at an all time level the players around him make that a historic season like 5800 yards and 60 TD's.

I also like having a vet WR in the WR room. Hopkins has never had beef with players to my knowledge.

Mentoring guys like Toney/Sky is something we need. MVS/JuJu don't have the same ability to pull those young guys in like Hopkins will.

j

Shit, we all want Toney to eventually be the WR1? No better mentor than a true WR1 like DHop, who just happens to have many of the exact same attributes/skillsets.

But nah, let’s not have Toney/Skyy learn from one of the best to ever do it, let’s just squander these formative years learning from MVS and the like. Makes sense.

Until Toney shows he can play a full season you can't just mark him down as reliable.

So we don’t even try to maximize his potential/capabilities until we know for sure he’s going to be reliable? Really?

That's not what I said, you just can't count on it being there. It's basically a bonus because at this point you have no idea.

Of course we try to maximize his skillset. But if he can't stay healthy (and history has shown so far that he can't) none of that even matters.

You can pencil him in as a starter but just to assume he's eventually become a #1 WR is a big reach right now.

That's assuming Hop would even be a good mentor. He might take the Rodgers/Big Ben route and say "It's not my job to show these young guys anything." I think that happens more often than we hear about it.

So the issue with KT mostly lies with his injury history, right?

Go back and take another look at that DHop video I posted. Notice how he tries to maximize his YAC, but when he’s out of options, he protects himself and gets OOB/goes down? Wonder how he avoided a major injury until last season?

Think KT might need to learn from someone who plays like he does, but avoids injuries? That worth anything?

Pick 63? Ugh, no thanks.

It doesn't always come down to yardage numbers. If it were that simple.

Only reason I used Derrick Mason and Gary Clark is that they have a higher PFR HOFm than DHop. PFR HOFm takes into account a lot more than just receiving yardage.

For the numbers on HOFm

Derrick Mason - 61.58
Gary Clark - 60.20
DeAndre Hopkins - 59.84

The avg numbers for all WR in the HOF is 103.63

Which one would argue that is one of the reasons why DHop's receiving yardage numbers are higher than both Mason or Clark.


The whole point is that DHop is no where near a lock for the HOF. Like what was claimed.

This

I actually think its fair and would also feel we will need to add in either MVS or CEH to get it done.

Exactly.

Win 2 more with Kelce and go from there.

I mean no way to a second for a guy coming off two shortened seasons. I dont think anybody is doing that... Mebbe a desperate team, but not us. That being said, you bring that price down - A third and another pick? I would do that.

You guys need to forget about this.

There's a cap, and if you start doing shit like this, you will have to say goodbye to the good young core of players we're developing.

Not gonna happen. Move on.

Veach is a young aggressive gm. They’ll make a move for someone

They're gonna be saying goodbye to several of those guys anyway...

Given the Chiefs past couple drafts and the depth of talent this year, which round pick are you comfortable trading for Hopkins?

2nd: Creed, Bolton, Moore, Cook
3rd: Chenal
4th: Kaindoh, Williams
5th: Gray, Powell, Kinnard
6th: Smith
7th: Watson, Pacheco, Johnson

Which players would you swap for DHop? Maybe a 5th, since that may be our weakest spot? I sure as hell ain't sending them a 6th or 7th!

That, along with the fact that we seem to find/develop the guys we need when we need them. Kemp was, somehow, critical in both the AFCCG AND the Super Bowl (incredible blocks on KT's return).

Whatever happens, I trust Bert to make the right decision. I just don't see him watching this combine and thinking shedding picks is the way to go.

Yes every draft will be like that never trade picks

Are you suggesting that what we've done the past TWO drafts isn't sustainable?

So the Patriots, Chiefs and Giants are going after him.

Bill Belichick and Andy Reid the two greatest coaches of their generation and the reigning NFL Coach of the Year and brilliant offensive mind in Brian Daboll.

Im gonna go ahead and trust them that the juice is worth the squeeze.

1st priority: extend Jones
2nd priority: sign OBJ to a contract (honestly don't see a better option to replace him) or if we don't sign him then trade him.
3rd priority: If we manage to do both of the first two priorities then I would be open to trade a 3rd for Hopkins if we can comfortably fit him in under the cap.

Jones and a LT are the main needs as far as I'm concerned. Anything else is gravy.

He's worth a lot more to teams with shit QB's that can't score points.

He makes little difference on a team with Mahomes that is already the #1 offense.

I don't know why you guys can't understand this. There is literally ONE football to distribute.

If we're going to spend that kind of money, I'd much rather spend it on OT's so we can actually watch a healthy Mahomes in the Super Bowl for a change.

O.City never met a pick he didn't want to trade for an over thirty, top of the market player.

Agreed across the board.

This offense doesn't require Mahomes to lob up a ton of 50/50 balls. They scheme people open and Mahomes is excellent at throwing with anticipation to where they will be. He doesn't really need a 50/50 guy.

I call BS. This is not a move our current staff has ever made. His contract, age and injuries in the recent years say he's fools gold and we are not a team of fools. His cap hit is 30 mil. Hell no we won't be doing that. Not to mention we need more at WR than one soon to be cooked high paid wr. We heve like 3 that actually played under contract right now.

I enjoy how we have a top 5 OL and the OL obsession still ****ing exists...

I just don't know how one could look at our past two drafts and suggest we trade picks. Young, cheap talent is how you win, along with your superstars. The list I posted should make Chief Fans hard.

(In fact, I'll post it again it's so sexy)

2nd: Creed, Bolton, Moore, Cook
3rd: Chenal
4th: Kaindoh, Williams
5th: Gray, Powell, Kinnard
6th: Smith
7th: Watson, Pacheco, Johnson

Lol are you shitting me? That would be amazing. Skyy Moore was pick 54. But nah, pick #63 way too much!

Lets go ****ing get this guy.

Asking price is two 2nd day picks -Albright
Goodbye

Pick 63 WAS Creed Humphrey. You'd swap him for DHop?

We were damn lucky to play in the SB this year. In the AFCCG Mahomes' receiving core was Skyy Moore, MVS and Marcus Kemp. Why not give Mahomes a superstar and go scorched earth on people. Veach killed the draft last year and acquired a TON of cheap talent. Why not celebrate that and go buy yourself something pretty??

LOL it's not, that is called saying it as a bargaining tactic, it likely ends up as him being traded for a 4.

Yeah, why not totally eschew the strategy that got you there?

If he's soo wonderful his price only goes up for empty stadiums

Have we traded for this piece of shit yet?

Have to check and see what Tyreek did for ticket sales in Miami

Eschew the strategy?? NFL GMs hope and pray they have consecutive successful drafts to put themselves in position to go out there and acquire future HOF players. Lets not act like if the ball bounces the other way in the Cincy games 2022 and 2023 we win the SB with Tyreek in 2022 and lose the AFCCG in 2023. If one play goes the other way in each game everyone would be pounding the table claiming we need a superstar receiver to push us over the edge again.

What cap?

Send MVS with a pick to the Cards for Hopkins....Saves $7M in Cap

Then don't resign JuJu....Saves what about $15M?

According to OTC, Hopkins Cap hit to the team trading for him would be $19.45M.

This means that having Hopkins would be cheaper than having both MVS and JuJu.

The Chiefs have plenty of things they can do to easily open cap space, the cap isn't an issue.

Bring in D-Hop, let MVS & Hardman walk. Draft Tank Dell or see if Raiders want to do business dealing Renfrow.

Juju
Hopkins
Toney
Skyy
Kelce
Dell

You're suggesting cutting MVS?

Absolutely, cutting him saves $7 million in cap space.

Lol, whatever.

Like whether DHop ultimately is a first ballot HOFer 6-10 years from now matters in this particular conversation. What I think vs. what you appear to think about DHop are not the same, but so what?

It's what he can do right now for the offense, for Toney/Skyy, for Kelce, and Pat that's pertinent here. And if you can't see that DHop is one of the best to ever do it, well, i think you're wrong, but let's leave that part out of the conversation. He is still a top-10 WR in everyone's book, and plays a skillset that would be a perfect fit for the offense.

Then there's what he could do for our young WR room in terms of game prep, body/health management, situational awareness, etc. Things that don't currently exist in that room.

There's going to be plenty of years when the Chiefs trot out WR rooms that are populated entirely by JAGs as Pat's cap hit grows, but this next couple three seasons don't have to be a part of that period.

And people really need to stop trying to use the "Patriot Way" as an example of how to maintain a dynasty. Let's not forget that they went ten years without a SB W. And who were their WRs during that period? Can anyone remember who their WR1/WR2 combos were during that time?

How about GB? They had arguably the best QB in NFL history (before Mahomes) at the helm, and chose to populate his WR room with JAGs for most of that span. Their strict adherence to the idea that Rodgers would just carry the majority of the offensive load earned them one Ring. One SB appearance.

All I'm saying is that there could be a huge opportunity here, instead of following a now well-worn path that doesn't necessarily lead to greatness, and has a rather high percentage chance of leading to nowhere special.

At that level?

Look, I don't necessarily agree with O but thinking Veach is going to bat .800 year in and year out is probably not wise. Simple statistics suggest than some years will be better than others.

The good thing about Veach is he's not a guy that only has one way. He's shown a propensity to make moves when they need to be made while still drafting well in the meantime.

And what money are you using to pay for JuJu and Hopkins at the same time? We’re currently over the cap.

Until he gets here and wants to be paid like a top WR again.

Many on here forget that you don't get a prize for additional cap space, the cap is just a means to an end.

What you want to do is not pay mediocre players so you can afford difference makers.

This is all a moot point anyways. If the Cardinals are getting offered 2nd round picks higher than ours…then we won’t be getting him.

That’s where I look at Frank Clark’s contract or maybe create over $25 million in cap space by converting Mahomes’ contract into a signing bonus. We have options, let Veach work. It’s definitely not “wishful thinking”.

Of course not. But let's be realistic here. Not every year is pick 63 gonna be Creed Humphrey. Just like not every year pick 32 is going to be CEH or 46 is going to be Breeland Speaks.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that Veach is bad or anything. I'm just saying that the last couple of years are statisical outliers right now. He's had some bad picks. His AVERAGE year is not going to be hitting on 6 of 8 picks or stuff like that.

Again, the good thing is that Veach isn't locked in to any one strategy. The year we traded a first for OBJ, we got Bolton and Creed. It's possible to do both and WIN both.

You've built your entire offseason wish list on getting rid of every player you don't want.

MVS will be back. So will OBJ. Sure, they could still do a Hopkins deal even with those but the scenarios you're throwing out only exist in Madden.

And? Everyone knows that Veach will make some moves and presto! we'll have some workable cap space. I saw one hypothesis last week that described an option that would create about $20M in cap space.

And didn't Veach find a way to extend CJ, Travis and I think Frank or whoever, when we literally had $77 in cap space the week before?

I mean, Veach has been talking about keeping OBJ, extending CJ and somehow keeping Frank (something I still highly doubt, but whatever), and still having room to make some moves in FA.

Not sure why anyone's worried about the cap at this point. Obviously Veach isn't.

MVS isn't going anywhere and Hopkins is going to want a new deal. His current cap numbers are likely irrelevant.

I also think that Reid really likes to have as many stud WRs as he possibly can.

Philly he had Owens, DeSean and Maclin.

In KC he started with Bowe then went after Maclin and then hit a home run with Hill but still brought in Sammy Watkins to pair with the two pro bowlers in Hill and Kelce.

I think this past year was a year Veach and Reid crossed their fingers and hoped for the best(almost crapping themself in the championship game). I think both still want a star at WR just not $30M worth a star like Hill.

I Could very easily see them going after Hopkins or even OBJ/Michael Thomas to try and get that stud WR at a better cost than Hill.

I agree with this. Let Veach work.

That being said, you need to be somewhat realistic in your expectations. People are acting like we should get rid of Juju, Clark, MVS, AND OBJ and turn that into Hopkins.

That's not going to happen.