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-   -   Other Sports Lance Armstrong cleared of doping charges (and now drops the fight) (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=141549)

redfan 08-24-2012 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NewChief (Post 8847410)
Not realizing that doping was (and is, though the regulators have reduced it) a routine and necessary part of competitive cycling over the last 20 years is like not realizing that professional wrestling is fake (this according to a good friend of mine who raced with Lance pre-cancer and is very involved in cycling to this day).

Kind of a sad day for the sport, nonetheless. The curtain has been pulled away, revealing the old man at the controls.

Rausch 08-24-2012 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock (Post 8847553)
Yeah, whatever. The French don't control the USADA.

The French don't control anything. They can't even control france.

But the pressure is from the Europeans. Always has been...

vailpass 08-24-2012 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redhed (Post 8847555)
Kind of a sad day for the sport, nonetheless. The curtain has been pulled away, revealing the old man at the controls.

Not at all. This is a non-story. Lance still won all of those tours and that will never change for Americans. What else matters?

Chest Rockwell 08-24-2012 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donger (Post 8847509)
And a group which doesn't have the power or jurisdiction to strip Armstrong of his TDF victories.

Actually, they do. USADA works under WADA rules/authority and according to those waiving the hearing means USADA gets to make a "reasoned decision" based on the evidence they have and submit a "reasoned decision explaining the action."

UCI has to await this, then issue the formal notice. If they fail to do this, they're in non-compliance with WADA code.

UCI could take USADA's ruling to CAS, but that would come at significant cost and it seems that USADA is chomping at the bit to present the case, while I really doubt UCI want the full details of the entire conspiracy case (It's important to remember Lance isn't the only one implicated here, just the highest profile; he is, however, the only one who seems to be taking his ball and going home (heh).) to see the light of day. They have enough issues with their credibility as it is.

Donger 08-24-2012 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chest Rockwell (Post 8847571)
Actually, they do. USADA works under WADA rules/authority and according to those waiving the hearing means USADA gets to make a "reasoned decision" based on the evidence they have and submit a "reasoned decision explaining the action."

UCI has to await this, then issue the formal notice. If they fail to do this, they're in non-compliance with WADA code.

UCI could take USADA's ruling to CAS, but that would come at significant cost and it seems that USADA is chomping at the bit to present the case, while I really doubt UCI want the full details of the entire conspiracy case (It's important to remember Lance isn't the only one implicated here, just the highest profile; he is, however, the only one who seems to be taking his ball and going home (heh).) to see the light of day. They have enough issues with their credibility as it is.

I know. Perhaps I should have been clearer: USADA can't, by itself, strip Armstrong of his TDF victories. UCI can.

Rausch 08-24-2012 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redhed (Post 8847555)
Kind of a sad day for the sport, nonetheless. The curtain has been pulled away, revealing the old man at the controls.

It's been that way for years.

The only real argument is that with 2 decades of roids, blood transfusions, and IV's an American can completely dominate.

redfan 08-24-2012 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vailpass (Post 8847563)
Not at all. This is a non-story. Lance still won all of those tours and that will never change for Americans. What else matters?

Like someone said before, you can't erase the memories. I suppose its symbolic if nothing else. In a sport where all of the top contenders are using PEDs, the playing field is level. It's not like all those other riders on other teams weren't trying to beat Lance.

Phobia 08-24-2012 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saulbadguy (Post 8846830)
This is a top shelf post.

I don't think so. I was loaded when I made it. I do mean loaded.

alnorth 08-24-2012 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donger (Post 8847578)
I know. Perhaps I should have been clearer: USADA can't, by itself, strip Armstrong of his TDF victories. UCI can.

This is correct, but its a formality at this point. The UCI has only two options: accept the USADA findings and impose the mandated punishment, or take the USADA to the world court of arbitration for sport. If it went there (unlikely), Armstrong has almost zero chance.

Armstrong is giving up because he knows that the USADA has him absolutely dead to rights now, and he's made the calculation that he'd rather travel the path of the angry martyr for the few who still believe him for some odd reason, rather than endure the public humiliation of this arbitration hearing.

alnorth 08-24-2012 11:41 AM

The tragic thing here is that Armstrong probably would have won most or all of those titles if everyone wasn't cheating. He was in a dirty sport and could either do what he had to do, or play it honest and sink into failure and obscurity as all the cheaters passed him by.

It would be fine to be sympathetic with his being put into an impossible situation if he'd just admit the obvious, but right now he's a liar.

vailpass 08-24-2012 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redhed (Post 8847597)
Like someone said before, you can't erase the memories. I suppose its symbolic if nothing else. In a sport where all of the top contenders are using PEDs, the playing field is level. It's not like all those other riders on other teams weren't trying to beat Lance.

True. And in the US cycling was not a viewed event before Lance, and it stopped being a viewed sport the second Lance was gone. Whatever they do today is on the "who cares" list. 99.9% of sports fans are much more interested in pre-season football than this year's Toure de Frog.

Graystoke 08-24-2012 11:43 AM

Let me preface this by saying I am not a Lance Armstrong fan. When he was coming up from the Junior ranks I did a couple races with him, and IMO he is a arogant prick.
All the evidence is there to anybody that will open there eyes. The mid 90's and early
2000's were the EPO era. They should just vacate those 7 years and not award anyone the victor. He just shoulda came clean like Barne Riis and admitted he doped, (like all the top 20) during those years. But instead he played that same old broken record about being tested 500 times. **** that. When the UCI became Armstrongs puppet it was game over, advantage Armstrong. Watch the 2003 Tour on Youtube...funny as hell, the grupetto hitting the brakes going around mountain bends. Gimmie a break.

vailpass 08-24-2012 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graystoke (Post 8847613)
Let me preface this by saying I am not a Lance Armstrong fan. When he was coming up from the Junior ranks I did a couple races with him, and IMO he is a arogant prick.
All the evidence is there to anybody that will open there eyes. The mid 90's and early
2000's were the EPO era. They should just vacate those 7 years and not award anyone the victor. He just shoulda came clean like Barne Riis and admitted he doped, (like all the top 20) during those years. But instead he played that same old broken record about being tested 500 times. **** that. When the UCI became Armstrongs puppet it was game over, advantage Armstrong. Watch the 2003 Tour on Youtube...funny as hell, the grupetto hitting the brakes going around mountain bends. Gimmie a break.

Yeah those grupetto's braking around mountain bends always crack my shit up.

Donger 08-24-2012 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alnorth (Post 8847599)
This is correct, but its a formality at this point. The UCI has only two options: accept the USADA findings and impose the mandated punishment, or take the USADA to the world court of arbitration for sport. If it went there (unlikely), Armstrong has almost zero chance.

Based on what?

Donger 08-24-2012 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graystoke (Post 8847613)
Watch the 2003 Tour on Youtube...funny as hell, the grupetto hitting the brakes going around mountain bends. Gimmie a break.

Huh?


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