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-   -   Chiefs Gunther's finger pointing has already begun... (https://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=200785)

lazepoo 01-21-2009 01:52 PM
I'm not surprised. That said, I don't think that Gunther's scheme is bad... he's just not a good judge of talent and a poor motivator. If your only move is to drop 4 f bombs per second in order to get a guy moving, not everyone responds well to it. I don't think he's very realistic about the talent of the guys he has, either. A lot of players in his defenses are playing out of position or utilized poorly. Apparently he made an impression on Schwartz, though.

One positive that everyone's overlooked here is that had we hired Schwartz, Gunther probably would have stuck around. He's moved on, and so should we.

The Franchise 01-21-2009 01:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaWolf (Post 5412808)
That's a fine line. Everyone in the NFL has talent. That's why "on any given sunday" holds true, unless you're the Detroit Lions. The key is to put your talent in a position to be successful, or bring in talent that will help you be successful. Gunther was unable to do either. He had five years of drafts where he was unable to develop anyone of note. In fact, one prime example is Kawika Mitchell, who blossomed once he got away from Gunther. I wouldn't be surprised to see DJ become an all pro now that Gunther is gone. In terms of bringing in talent, it was famously proclaimed by Gunther himself that he personally went to Carl Peterson and gave him a list of players to go get him and Carl delivered on what he wanted. He promised that Kendrell Bell and Sammy Knight and co would turn this defense around, provide the leadership, etc. We still sucked. So to me, across the board, under two totally different head coaches, with two different assistant coaching staffs under him, he failed, and failed spectacularly...
This.

Rooster 01-21-2009 02:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaWolf (Post 5412808)
That's a fine line. Everyone in the NFL has talent. That's why "on any given sunday" holds true, unless you're the Detroit Lions. The key is to put your talent in a position to be successful, or bring in talent that will help you be successful. Gunther was unable to do either. He had five years of drafts where he was unable to develop anyone of note. In fact, one prime example is Kawika Mitchell, who blossomed once he got away from Gunther. I wouldn't be surprised to see DJ become an all pro now that Gunther is gone. In terms of bringing in talent, it was famously proclaimed by Gunther himself that he personally went to Carl Peterson and gave him a list of players to go get him and Carl delivered on what he wanted. He promised that Kendrell Bell and Sammy Knight and co would turn this defense around, provide the leadership, etc. We still sucked. So to me, across the board, under two totally different head coaches, with two different assistant coaching staffs under him, he failed, and failed spectacularly...

Word :clap:

wutamess 01-21-2009 02:11 PM
Gunther is SUCH a fraud for totally changing his scheme to something he wasn't comfortable with. :rolleyes: GTFOH.

We all know/knew Gun loves crushing the QB for you homers to think otherwise because he's saying what really went down is just plain stupid. [/Gaz]

EyePod 01-21-2009 02:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HemiEd (Post 5412730)
I have been one of the most critical, when it comes to Gunther.

But I have to agree with him on this. Herm insisted on his defense, the cover 2, which has been said to be obsolete.

Also, I can't blame him for being a little ticked at losing the only impact player this defense has had, in quite a while.

That being said, I am so glad he is gone!
He wasn't that good when we had JA so I don't feel bad for him at all.

Here's what it said the expectations for Gun when he came in (from Wiki):

"Cunningham was hired again to revitalize a defense that had finished near or at the bottom of the overall rankings since Schottenheimer and Cunningham departed."

He didn't do that. Gun's a bust.

CoMoChief 01-21-2009 02:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefnj2 (Post 5412779)
Do you think the Cardinals defense is really good? If they hadn't made it through the wildcard game would you honestly think they had a lot of talent?
They have better players in certain areas than we have

Berry and Dockett are better than anyone we have on our Dline. PERIOD

Dansby is better than any LB that we have

Their CB's are getting better and better, drafting in the 1st rd for DRC and Rolle have helped them and Adrian Wilson is a top 3 safety in the NFL



WE HAVE NO PLAYERS AT ALL OF THIS TALENT LEVEL, maybe DJ or Flowers

**** I dunno

CoMoChief 01-21-2009 02:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rooster (Post 5412809)
JA didn't want to be in KC. Why is that so hard for some to understand? He didn't like it here. Period. He played his card and the Chiefs then played theirs. Get over it.
JA loved KC (probably why he wanted to open a bar here) wanted to be in KC and get paid as well, Carl made a promise to him, Jared Allen did what was asked of him, and then Carl ****ed him over. Then Jared wanted out.


Why people dont understand this is beyond me

The Franchise 01-21-2009 02:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoMoChief (Post 5412870)
They have better players in certain areas than we have

Berry and Dockett are better than anyone we have on our Dline. PERIOD

Dansby is better than any LB that we have

Their CB's are getting better and better, drafting in the 1st rd for DRC and Rolle have helped them and Adrian Wilson is a top 3 safety in the NFL



WE HAVE NO PLAYERS AT ALL OF THIS TALENT LEVEL, maybe DJ or Flowers

**** I dunno
I believe that Rolle is their FS......so that gives them a damn good set of safeties to work with.

That does happen when you're picking Top 10 for a long time though.

Frazod 01-21-2009 02:30 PM
Another Frank Burns - if the patient dies, it's either God's will or somebody else's fault.

Those poor bastards in Detroit - all that suffering, and no end in sight. At least they have good basketball and hockey teams.

HemiEd 01-21-2009 03:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by frazod (Post 5412883)

Those poor bastards in Detroit - all that suffering, and no end in sight. At least they have good basketball and hockey teams.
Don't forget, Detroit, and a lot of Michigan are dependent on the auto industry.

They didn't deserve to have Gunther put on them.

StcChief 01-21-2009 03:13 PM
as DaBears,Packers,ViQueens all rejoice....

Mr. Laz 01-21-2009 03:15 PM
Gun has sucked under far too many coaches and with far too many different players to not be consider a "common dominator" in this whole cluster ****.


not to mention the fact that he couldn't ever field a defense that could handle the bootleg, disguise a blitz or "would try" to tackle correctly ..... these are COACHING ISSUES.

talent versus premium talent is always a problem but you can see problems beyond that

jettio 01-21-2009 03:17 PM
I would much prefer a defensive cooordinator that teaches his players how to play basic defense and tackle the ball.

Gunther's problem is that he stays up night after night during the season trying to figure out some magical way of calling some wonderful defensive play.

Football is pretty plain and simple. I rather the Chiefs find coaches that can figure out how to coach a team working a 60 hour work week during the season.

If you have a coach that spends 80-100 hours a week during the season trying to think up stupid sh*t, you have an ineffective coach. That is what Gunther is, IMO.

EyePod 01-21-2009 03:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefnj2 (Post 5412779)
Do you think the Cardinals defense is really good? If they hadn't made it through the wildcard game would you honestly think they had a lot of talent?
Yes. I try not to be ignorant of other teams. That team has some really awesome ****ing players.

EyePod 01-21-2009 03:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HemiEd (Post 5412971)
Don't forget, Detroit, and a lot of Michigan are dependent on the auto industry.

They didn't deserve to have Gunther put on them.
That's their own fault. Move somewhere else. Are you telling me that they can't just move overseas where there are tons of these autoplants?


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