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-   -   Chiefs Would it be a mistake to fire Todd Haley? (https://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=253430)

Rasputin 12-08-2011 01:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 8179825)
I think thats a bullshit argument, to a degree.

If you were to tell us 3 years ago that we would take a safety top five and follow it up with a first round wide out, I would LOL @U.

Pioli has shown to be able to recognize and select the talent of the draft the last two that fits what the team needs.

I dont see anything that says he wouldn't take a first round quarterback if one is there that he believes in and sees it as a similar need as most of us do.

The big problem I have with what your saying & IMHO ~ The team has been built backwards from the perspective to build a team around the QB & not force a QB into a system just because we drafted a HOF TE in the first round. Get my point?

The Lions year after year drafted the best WR in the draft and still ended up with a 0 -16 record. Maybe they should have went out of there way to draft a QB & then found the WRs that the QB would be comfortable with. Now they drafted a QB with that first pick and suddenly even tho Stafford has the injury bug they have become a team to recon with and as long as Stafford stays on the field he can be around long enough for them to fit the rest of the pieces together yearly to improve what he has at his disposal for a threat at a Super Bowl.

I bet the Panther fans are extatically exited for next year and the years to come knowing that they get to watch a young tallent QB develop and all they have to do is find the rest of the players that best fits his streangths for success.

Dr. Johnny Fever 12-08-2011 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omega (Post 8179881)
What are you referring to?

Nothing GoChiefs... doesn't matter. It was a long time ago and I left for nearly 3 years since and have been back for months. Maybe you remember having a Welch's grape juice avatar for a while after you didn't honor the promise you made. If not, doesn't matter... just dumb internet business.

-King- 12-08-2011 01:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 8179886)
Id love to see Haley be able to call an offense similar to the one he called in Arizona in 08 and have a quarterback that could execute it...and have this defense to compliment it.

Yeah I'd like the defense to compliment the offense too.

Defense: ” Hey offense, you're doing great!”
Posted via Mobile Device

chiefzilla1501 12-08-2011 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 8179886)
Id love to see Haley be able to call an offense similar to the one he called in Arizona in 08 and have a quarterback that could execute it...and have this defense to compliment it.

I agree. People keep saying Haley's a horizontal guy. No, he's not. He was an aggressive playcaller in Arizona. It's clear he's going horizontal because he thinks the best opportunity to win with our QBs is to not ask the QB to make plays.

Now, you can make the argument that Haley should build a system around the QB. That's what McDaniels does. He designs a 1-read offense. I don't want that shit. I want a pro offense and if Cassel can't run it, then find someone who can't. People blame the playcalling, but what is really the problem? How many times have we seen that Cassel had an open man, but was staring down his primary read? How many times have we seen Cassel misdiagnose a blitz? How many times have we seen Cassel throw the ball 5 yards over an open receivers' head?

Give Haley a real QB. A QB that can spot the blitz, can make pre-snap adjustments, and can go through his progressions. We're not even asking for Aaron Rodgers. That's QBing 101.

chiefzilla1501 12-08-2011 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC Tattoo (Post 8179891)
The big problem I have with what your saying & IMHO ~ The team has been built backwards from the perspective to build a team around the QB & not force a QB into a system just because we drafted a HOF TE in the first round. Get my point?

The Lions year after year drafted the best WR in the draft and still ended up with a 0 -16 record. Maybe they should have went out of there way to draft a QB & then found the WRs that the QB would be comfortable with. Now they drafted a QB with that first pick and suddenly even tho Stafford has the injury bug they have become a team to recon with and as long as Stafford stays on the field he can be around long enough for them to fit the rest of the pieces together yearly to improve what he has at his disposal for a threat at a Super Bowl.

I bet the Panther fans are extatically exited for next year and the years to come knowing that they get to watch a young tallent QB develop and all they have to do is find the rest of the players that best fits his streangths for success.

Yes and no. It's an oversimplification. The goal is to become a Super Bowl team, not a good enough team. Cassel doesn't get us there, but I'm not convinced that Flacco, Sanchez, or Freeman do either. I'm also not sold at all on Cam. They're better, but guys I can rest my franchise on...?

That's why I just don't get why people are so hung up on the "first round or bust" argument. I still believe we need to draft a first round QB and give him a very competitive option. It's why I've brought up Peyton and Matt Flynn. Neither are long-term solutions (Flynn would only be a long-term solution if he proved he was a franchise QB).

BossChief 12-08-2011 02:00 AM

Also, I wish it was illegal to type "McDaniels" on this forum.

**** that POS, cheating little weasel and what he would bring with him....a lot more of Cassel and Orton.

People should stop talking about him.

please.

chiefzilla1501 12-08-2011 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 8179903)
Also, I wish it was illegal to type "McDaniels" on this forum.

**** that POS, cheating little weasel and what he would bring with him....a lot more of Cassel and Orton.

People should stop talking about him.

please.

So help me God if Haley is fired and that POS is our head coach.

Rasputin 12-08-2011 02:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 (Post 8179895)
I agree. People keep saying Haley's a horizontal guy. No, he's not. He was an aggressive playcaller in Arizona. It's clear he's going horizontal because he thinks the best opportunity to win with our QBs is to not ask the QB to make plays.

Now, you can make the argument that Haley should build a system around the QB. That's what McDaniels does. He designs a 1-read offense. I don't want that shit. I want a pro offense and if Cassel can't run it, then find someone who can't. People blame the playcalling, but what is really the problem? How many times have we seen that Cassel had an open man, but was staring down his primary read? How many times have we seen Cassel misdiagnose a blitz? How many times have we seen Cassel throw the ball 5 yards over an open receivers' head?

Give Haley a real QB. A QB that can spot the blitz, can make pre-snap adjustments, and can go through his progressions. We're not even asking for Aaron Rodgers. That's QBing 101.


That's why I believe it is important to draft a guy who has the potential to develop into long term form of a player your asking for. However need to play to the QBs streangths in developing that matter and adjust to his abilities with players that fit the mold. This can be a wich came first the chicken or the egg argument. I like the idea of watching a young QB or any drafted player for that matter grow into the player we expect them to turn out to be or even exeed expectations for long term success. The QB has been the most neglected position on the roster for this franchise working the draft. It shows the most when it comes to not winning playoff games or being a contender year after year for most of 40 years.

OzarksChiefsFan 12-08-2011 02:15 AM

Playing offense to limit mistakes is yesterdays football. Any coach can win with a "real" QB (excluding Norv). When Aaron Rodgers went down last year the Packers didn't play any differently and the Lions lost Stafford and threw it downfield as much or more.

Haley makes mistakes and repeats them and stop blaming Muir. Haley is calling the plays and has for the most part since he's been here. How people think bad clock management and play calling is okay is beyond me. Why did the Ravens kick our tail in the playoffs? Sideways offense, they dared the Chiefs to throw downfield.

Joe Montana against the Oilers in the playoffs, anyone remember that game? Montana threw the ball downfield deep without connecting and forced the Oilers defense to play them honest. Without completing a pass! I'd rather have Jimmy Ray calling dive plays into the line(at least a north south gameplan) than watch the crap Haley calls. Trick plays for no reason out of the blue? Let's flea flicker the Bears because we haven't ran that play all year? Really against a team that plays cover two. I'm done with Haley. I didn't like the hire and he's been exactly what I thought he'd be.(Kudos to Dennis Green)

Hammock Parties 12-08-2011 02:16 AM

I don't think there's a chance in hell the Chiefs hire McDaniels.

Would be suicide with the fans.

BossChief 12-08-2011 02:19 AM

If McDaniels is hired as the HC, I would have to find another hobby.

Clark might even get some sporting KC fans.

Rasputin 12-08-2011 03:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 (Post 8179901)
Yes and no. It's an oversimplification. The goal is to become a Super Bowl team, not a good enough team. Cassel doesn't get us there, but I'm not convinced that Flacco, Sanchez, or Freeman do either. I'm also not sold at all on Cam. They're better, but guys I can rest my franchise on...?

That's why I just don't get why people are so hung up on the "first round or bust" argument. I still believe we need to draft a first round QB and give him a very competitive option. It's why I've brought up Peyton and Matt Flynn. Neither are long-term solutions (Flynn would only be a long-term solution if he proved he was a franchise QB).

I bet the Panthers win a playoff game before we do.

Tribal Warfare 12-08-2011 03:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNR (Post 8179771)
Haley doesn't deserve a good QB the way he's handled the Ricky Stanzi situation.

If he doesn't deserve a good QB, then he needs to get fired.

FYP

Titty Meat 12-08-2011 03:11 AM

Yes he should be fired. To say he shouldn't wouldn't be holding him accountable and last time I checked thats not the "Patriot Way".

Results do matter and this guy has been blown out 14 times in 3 years.

The team clearly wasn't ready to start the season.

He's ran Chan Gailey and Charlie Weis out of town only to hire Bill Muir and produce the worst offense in Chiefs history.

Has made bad personal moves see: Jarred Gaither.

Horrible in game coach with bad clock management.

Hasn't developed or improved a QB.

Rasputin 12-08-2011 03:25 AM

I'd like to see Stanzi start out in the shotgun formation giving him full view of the field, we run the draw play mostly anyways with McCluster. P Manning and Tom Brady practilly live from the shotgun and have had great success running there offense. We don't have shit for a running attack with JC gone so IMO shotgun formation with Stanzi at the healm just might be something to consider.

Never mind dumb ****ing coach that is ****ing dumb. PalKOed.


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