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-   -   Chiefs Lesson Learned: Clark is Right to Land HC First (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=268322)

htismaqe 01-01-2013 12:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevieray (Post 9264292)
add Orange Juice
Too late now... :banghead:

Chief Faithful 01-01-2013 01:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FAX (Post 9264238)
Hmmm ... I must be operating under a set of inaccurate assumptions, Mr. Chief Faithful. It is and has been my understanding that Dr. Evil himself has made the personnel and drafting decisions and that our "scouting department" is primarily responsible for number-crunching only.

If true, what kind of system is that? That's no "system". I don't even know what that is ... a feudal system, maybe.

I fear that any efforts to identify redeeming qualities in Dr. Evil are wasted on me, Mr. Chief Faithful. I cannot force myself to even be reasonable about it.

FAX
Read the book War Room if you are interested in the scouting system used by the Patriots, Falcons and Chiefs. It is a great system the problem in KC is the Al Davis type dysfunction not the system. Get a HC with a strong personality who knows what is needed on the field reporting to the owner and that dysfunction will end.

Don't misread me, the NFL is a results business and Pioli has failed with the football operations. Too much turn-over in the coaching staff, lack of team personality and the wrong 53 on the field. As a team administrator he has been successful.

Maybe Pioli has failed because he has been asked to do too much. Let Pioli or the new GM run the scouting system and administrate the cap and let the HC run the football operations. I believe if the Chiefs find a strong personality for HC that knows what is needed on the field then maybe Pioli could excel in the same role he filled in New England. Jay or Jon Gruden, Cowher, Saban, and Billick all have that strong personality the Chiefs need. I don't know much about Kelly or Shanahan, but they sound good.

Just my opinion, all of this, but I strongly believe what Hunt has done so far has been brilliant and a good sign of things to come.

Marcellus 01-01-2013 01:15 PM
I think I have this figured out-

CP- I am tired of KC emulating other teams and trying to do it the Steeler way the Patriot way etc.... I want a KC WAY.

Clark - I am changing the structure and the GM and HC will report to me I will fnd a coach and build from there.

CP- That will never work look at Pittsburgh and NE etc...you dont build a team that way.

Sound about right? Seems like it.

OnTheWarpath15 01-01-2013 01:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcellus (Post 9264391)
I think I have this figured out-

CP- I am tired of KC emulating other teams and trying to do it the Steeler way the Patriot way etc.... I want a KC WAY.

Clark - I am changing the structure and the GM and HC will report to me I will fnd a coach and build form there.

CP- That will never work look at Pittsburgh and NE etc...you dont build a team that way.

Sound about right? Seems like it.
I haven't seen anyone say it won't work.

I can only speak for myself when I say this "model" really shrinks the candidate pool - see post #22 for example.

I also find it comical that this place has spent the last 2 months pining for guys like Gamble, Ross and Dorsey - but now that common sense says that's not happening, everyone is cool with a retread.

As pointed out - you would have to think that Clark already h as his guy, otherwise he's taking an enormous risk.

I'm betting Bill Cowher and Omar Khan will be announced once Clark's done ****ing around with this Pioli nonsense.

Tombstone RJ 01-01-2013 01:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoover (Post 9263833)
I think it’s very wise of Clark Hunt to put a priority the selection of the next head coach and not the general manager. Hunt put a priority on selecting the GM in 2009 and he landed his man, but by the time Pioli was in place all of the top coaching candidates were gone forcing the Chiefs to reach on Todd Haley. When you miss out on the top head coaching talent, it impacts the quality of the entire coaching staff.

The Chiefs have talent, but without the right coach to focus that talent and lead the team, one doesn’t get the most out of the investment in a high profile GM. While many here believe the presence of Pioli deters high profile free agents, I would say the lack of a legitimate coach with substantial control is what drives them to other teams instead of the chiefs. Would you rather play for a coach who makes the decisions for the team, or a coach who get’s vetoed by an all-powerful GM?

I think teams like the Chargers who are going to focus on the GM search before looking at head coach replacements run the risk of missing out on the best coaches. A GM first strategy also adds an unneeded variable to the coach selection. Say we went out and grabbed a Ross or a dude from GB or SF. I’d be happy, but who are they going to get for a HC? Likely a coordinator they have ties to, which means a repeat of the Haley fiasco.

I love the fact that Clark is going to get his coach and then sort out the GM stuff. I’ve become a big advocate of Reid and Heckert. Herkert has a long time scouting background and Reid is a QB friendly, franchise type coach we have not had since Marty.

Clark is on the right track. Now get it done Mr. Hunt.
yes and no. The teams who are in the playoffs (like the Broncos) have coaches that will be HC candidates. Those coaches are not going to interview until their season is over. So getting a GM lined out first is not necessarily a bad thing.

Hammock Parties 01-01-2013 01:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by htismaqe (Post 9264266)
I drank 4 bottles of champagne.

I would have rather had the scotch at this point...
ROFL

Didn't figure you for the type.

htismaqe 01-01-2013 01:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58 (Post 9264406)
I haven't seen anyone say it won't work.

I can only speak for myself when I say this "model" really shrinks the candidate pool - see post #22 for example.

I also find it comical that this place has spent the last 2 months pining for guys like Gamble, Ross and Dorsey - but now that common sense says that's not happening, everyone is cool with a retread.

As pointed out - you would have to think that Clark already h as his guy, otherwise he's taking an enormous risk.

I'm betting Bill Cowher and Omar Khan will be announced once Clark's done ****ing around with this Pioli nonsense.
I'm inclined to think its not nonsense, it's probably some kind of legal issue.

htismaqe 01-01-2013 01:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cassel's Reckoning (Post 9264412)
ROFL

Didn't figure you for the type.
Then you haven't been paying attention.

OnTheWarpath15 01-01-2013 01:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by htismaqe (Post 9264417)
I'm inclined to think its not nonsense, it's probably some kind of legal issue.
I agree, just wondering why Clark wasn't working on this months ago. this should have been wrapped up by the end of the season, IMO.

Marcellus 01-01-2013 01:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58 (Post 9264406)
I haven't seen anyone say it won't work.

I can only speak for myself when I say this "model" really shrinks the candidate pool - see post #22 for example.

I also find it comical that this place has spent the last 2 months pining for guys like Gamble, Ross and Dorsey - but now that common sense says that's not happening, everyone is cool with a retread.
I think Clark is planning on taking his shot at being a GM coupled with a strong coach.

If he hires the right coach, no reason it wont work, big IF, I know.

Pioli was neutered because Clark figures with the right HC he can make Pioli powerless for a year, be the GM in the meantime and decide to bring in another guy next year if he sees the need. Or not if things go well.

Outside of the draft and picking a HC what does a GM do anyway? Clark is going to pick a coach with personnel background. They Have Mark Donavon to run the business side already.

Clark gets a coach he trusts to run this draft and there is nothing for a GM to do short term anyway.

whoman69 01-01-2013 01:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58 (Post 9263844)
Myth: By the time Pioli was hired, all the good HC candidates were gone.

Fact: Pioli was hired on January 13th. Pioli waited three more weeks to hire Todd Haley on February 6th (IIRC)
Pioli was given a mandate by Hunt to consider the job status of Herm Edwards. If he did that over a weekend it wouldn't have worn well with his new boss.

I'm not going to give Hunt kudos for hamstringing the organization then and won't do it now. Any coach that comes in here is going to want to know if the deal comes along with Pioli. It shows Hunt does not want to make the big decisions for the organization. He is going to take the safe move every time, the one that allows him to make the least input. Hunt is only interested in counting the money that comes in. If you'll notice he doesn't say he is considering Pioli's status for the good of the organization, but instead what is in the best interests of his family.

Marcellus 01-01-2013 01:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58 (Post 9264427)
I agree, just wondering why Clark wasn't working on this months ago. this should have been wrapped up by the end of the season, IMO.
If its the legal issues with the lawsuits by former employees its not as simple as just wrapping it up. He has to be concerned Pioli wont just make it a Hunt issue and throw him under the bus. Once Pioli is no longer employed by Clark Pioli has no reason not to turn on him.

Tin foil hat shit I know.

Chief77 01-01-2013 01:30 PM
It stinks that Pioli hasn't been axed, but I am really excited to see what Clark does. This team needs a smart and strong willed headcoach. Gruden,Cowher,Ried would all be big names. I have a gut feeling that Reid is a strong possibilty. I think he feels like he has lots to prove, and that first pick might real inticing to him. Getting a good DC would be vital. Let Reid build an exciting offense around the new rookie.

OnTheWarpath15 01-01-2013 01:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcellus (Post 9264440)
I think Clark is planning on taking his shot at being a GM coupled with a strong coach.

If he hires the right coach, no reason it wont work, big IF, I know.

Pioli was neutered because Clark figures with the right HC he can make Pioli powerless for a year, be the GM in the meantime and decide to bring in another guy next year if he sees the need. Ot not if things go well.

Outside of the draft and picking a HC what does a GM do anyway? Clark is going to pick a coach with personnel background. They Have Mark Donavon to run the business side already.

Clark gets a coach he trusts to run this draft and there is nothing for a GM to do short term anyway.
If Clark's plan is to "neuter" Pioli and keep him in the building, he'll lose this fanbase regardless of who he hires.

And Clark has no business in a Jerry Jones/Snyder role.

htismaqe 01-01-2013 01:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58 (Post 9264427)
I agree, just wondering why Clark wasn't working on this months ago. this should have been wrapped up by the end of the season, IMO.
Well, the team is currently being sued by former employees that allege Pioli fired them due to their age...


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