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-   -   KU ***** Official 2018-2019 Kansas Basketball Repository Thread ***** (https://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=314740)

carcosa 11-06-2018 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lewdog (Post 13874562)
Kansas is good at basketball.

Yip

BWillie 11-06-2018 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TribalElder (Post 13874730)
depends on how much KU spent on their team this year

Mich State could take 3rd

Dude, we spent around a milly easy. That's whats up.

Figure it out.

Dollar signs - Mangino

Imon Yourside 11-06-2018 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWillie (Post 13874743)
Dude, we spent around a milly easy. That's whats up.

Figure it out.

Dollar signs - Mangino

I wonder what Dukes budget it? They got the #1, #2, #3 and #17th ranked players this year. KU needs to step it up and stop being cheap.

Buehler445 11-06-2018 08:30 PM

I'll take that win.

Pablo 11-06-2018 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KILLER_CLOWN (Post 13874759)
I wonder what Dukes budget it? They got the #1, #2, #3 and #17th ranked players this year. KU needs to step it up and stop being cheap.

2-3 million.

Trash schools like mutt u spend 17k and get a blown out knee for it.

O.city 11-06-2018 08:46 PM

Looking like a really good roster. The young guards need some experience but we’ve been spoiled with upper class guards the last few years

CoMoChief 11-06-2018 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 13874863)
Looking like a really good roster. The young guards need some experience but we’ve been spoiled with upper class guards the last few years

This is my main concern. I expect them to be different/better players come March.

Mr. Plow 11-06-2018 09:52 PM

How many minutes did Doke play? Seemed like Self was messing around with the lineup since we were up big.

Reerun_KC 11-06-2018 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Plow (Post 13875187)
How many minutes did Doke play? Seemed like Self was messing around with the lineup since we were up big.

Enough at the end if the game to shit the bed at the FT line..... Again.

Mr. Plow 11-06-2018 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC (Post 13875199)
Enough at the end if the game to shit the bed at the FT line..... Again.

Ok

smithandrew051 11-06-2018 10:28 PM

I’d like to see us roll with Lightfoot at the 4 and Dedric at the 5 at the end of close games.

That eliminates the Poke-a-Doke, but also allows us to still match size pretty well. Lightfoot seems to get a lot of blocks and hustle plays.

BWillie 11-06-2018 11:10 PM

Duke is the best team in the country. They even look it right now - with freshman. They are freaking dangerous. I hate to say it - but Nike musta paid alotta money.

eDave 11-06-2018 11:22 PM

It's all meaningless. Duke wins it all. Could beat a few NBA teams right now.

Mr_Tomahawk 11-06-2018 11:31 PM

It’s one game...

BWillie 11-06-2018 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eDave (Post 13875520)
It's all meaningless. Duke wins it all. Could beat a few NBA teams right now.

Duke would probably go 8-74, but yeah - they could beat some NBA teams when they play out of their minds.

BWillie 11-06-2018 11:44 PM

Les Miles to KU would give me a huge boner.

He's an idiot play caller. But I don't give a shit.

He's as close as a rock star as KU could possibly get or deserve. Whatever it takes.

KC_Connection 11-06-2018 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eDave (Post 13875520)
It's all meaningless. Duke wins it all. Could beat a few NBA teams right now.

Not the last part. Probably not the rest of it either.

KC_Connection 11-06-2018 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWillie (Post 13875575)
Duke would probably go 8-74, but yeah - they could beat some NBA teams when they play out of their minds.

They'd get destroyed by any NBA team. Absolutely annihilated really. The NCAA is essentially a joke in comparison to the level those guys produce at the highest level.

carcosa 11-06-2018 11:52 PM

We will smack Duke in the tourney!!!! WRITE IT DOWN

KC_Connection 11-06-2018 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carcosa (Post 13875619)
We will smack Duke in the tourney!!!! WRITE IT DOWN

Wouldn't be the first time.

carcosa 11-06-2018 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_Connection (Post 13875625)
Wouldn't be the first time.

YES!

CoMoChief 11-07-2018 12:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eDave (Post 13875520)
It's all meaningless. Duke wins it all. Could beat a few NBA teams right now.

Duke looks pretty damn good.

Made UK look like a middle school team all night.

HolyHandgernade 11-07-2018 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eDave (Post 13875520)
It's all meaningless. Duke wins it all. Could beat a few NBA teams right now.

No, this is just stupid.

I'm not saying Duke isn't really good, but let's not overreact.

Teams had no scout on each other because it was the first game. Duke played overseas games together, so they've had more exhibitions and practice time. UK's ranking is based on where they expect them to finish, not where they are today which is largely a team of players who are unfamiliar with one another.

This is a perfect blend for really talented players to shine because the organized defense against them isn't available yet.

If they still do this in conference against UNC, UVA and Syracuse, then I'll get concerned. There is absolutely NO college team that would beat an NBA team. The only team I ever saw that would come close was UNLV and even they wouldn't have done it. Losing at epic clips to other NBA teams is NOT a barometer for how a really good college team would fair.

CoMoChief 11-07-2018 02:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HolyHandgernade (Post 13875686)
No, this is just stupid.

I'm not saying Duke isn't really good, but let's not overreact.

Teams had no scout on each other because it was the first game. Duke played overseas games together, so they've had more exhibitions and practice time. UK's ranking is based on where they expect them to finish, not where they are today which is largely a team of players who are unfamiliar with one another.

This is a perfect blend for really talented players to shine because the organized defense against them isn't available yet.

If they still do this in conference against UNC, UVA and Syracuse, then I'll get concerned. There is absolutely NO college team that would beat an NBA team. The only team I ever saw that would come close was UNLV and even they wouldn't have done it. Losing at epic clips to other NBA teams is NOT a barometer for how a really good college team would fair.

The Dream Team got ran out of the gym by some college all-stars during a practice. Daly was't subbing guys in and some say he threw the game on purpose to teach them how to lose, but point being...unlike the NFL where the physicality and speed of the game plays a major factor, there isn't as big a difference, if any in some cases, when you compare NCAA to NBA players (esp in today's game where nobody plays any defense). I don't believe that it is impossible if you assemble the right group of guys. The NFL vs NCAAF would be impossible in any scenario lol, no matter how bad the Browns suck.

RockChalk 11-07-2018 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWillie (Post 13875575)
Duke would probably go 8-74, but yeah - they could beat some NBA teams when they play out of their minds.

NO, they wouldn't. They would go 0-82 unless one of the NBA teams decided to start a G-League roster instead.

HolyHandgernade 11-07-2018 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoMoChief (Post 13875776)
The Dream Team got ran out of the gym by some college all-stars during a practice. Daly was't subbing guys in and some say he threw the game on purpose to teach them how to lose, but point being...unlike the NFL where the physicality and speed of the game plays a major factor, there isn't as big a difference, if any in some cases, when you compare NCAA to NBA players (esp in today's game where nobody plays any defense). I don't believe that it is impossible if you assemble the right group of guys. The NFL vs NCAAF would be impossible in any scenario lol, no matter how bad the Browns suck.

So, why didn't they send the college team to the Olympics?

Practice? PRACTICE?

You mean when a collection of talent that has never played together before comes together and tries to figure out how they are going to run? That's what you want to go with? Do you really watch pro basketball or do you just imagine completely inane scenarios in your head to score internet points? This is the umtlimate overreaction to a team that comes out on fire vs a team that hasn't yet found itself. Its like saying, the McDonald's All American team could have beat Villanova last year. It completely does away with any idea of "team" and tries to substitute projected talent and believes it will work.

Lzen 11-07-2018 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoMoChief (Post 13875776)
The Dream Team got ran out of the gym by some college all-stars during a practice. Daly was't subbing guys in and some say he threw the game on purpose to teach them how to lose, but point being...unlike the NFL where the physicality and speed of the game plays a major factor, there isn't as big a difference, if any in some cases, when you compare NCAA to NBA players (esp in today's game where nobody plays any defense). I don't believe that it is impossible if you assemble the right group of guys. The NFL vs NCAAF would be impossible in any scenario lol, no matter how bad the Browns suck.

Good Lord, why do you always have to be so wrong? ROFL

BWillie 11-07-2018 12:51 PM

So 8-74 is probably too amitious - but if they play the way they did last night they could win a few games. Williamson, Barrett and Reddish all might be the second best player on a quite a few bad nba teams - so the mere fact they have 3 of them - its possible they could beat a team if they had an off night.

If you took a team of Doncic, Young, Ayton, and Bagley and put some random role players on it. They could do it too. Would they be the worst team? Absolutely. But they could get a few wins.

BWillie 11-07-2018 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoMoChief (Post 13875776)
The Dream Team got ran out of the gym by some college all-stars during a practice. Daly was't subbing guys in and some say he threw the game on purpose to teach them how to lose, but point being...unlike the NFL where the physicality and speed of the game plays a major factor, there isn't as big a difference, if any in some cases, when you compare NCAA to NBA players (esp in today's game where nobody plays any defense). I don't believe that it is impossible if you assemble the right group of guys. The NFL vs NCAAF would be impossible in any scenario lol, no matter how bad the Browns suck.

https://offthedribble.blogs.nytimes....-very-bad-day/

Yeap.

saphojunkie 11-07-2018 04:25 PM

lost by eight in a scrimmage the coach threw...

"ran out of the gym."

CoMoChief 11-07-2018 04:38 PM

Point is...it's not impossible.

It wouldn't be a 77-0 tecmo bowl blowout like it would be in a NCAAF vs Cleveland Browns

NBA team could have a bad shooting night and NCAA could be going 2018 'Nova from the 3 pt line.

I don't think there's any scenario where something of the equivalent could happen in football.

BWillie 11-07-2018 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoMoChief (Post 13877070)
Point is...it's not impossible.

It wouldn't be a 77-0 tecmo bowl blowout like it would be in a NCAAF vs Cleveland Browns

NBA team could have a bad shooting night and NCAA could be going 2018 'Nova from the 3 pt line.

I don't think there's any scenario where something of the equivalent could happen in football.

Agreed.

Prison Bitch 11-07-2018 08:23 PM

This was being said of 2015 Kentucky after a few games. They lost in the Final Four

Pablo 11-07-2018 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch (Post 13877472)
This was being said of 2015 Kentucky after a few games. They lost in the Final Four

Was it the white as shit Wisconsin team that year?

TambaBerry 11-07-2018 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoMoChief (Post 13877070)
Point is...it's not impossible.

It wouldn't be a 77-0 tecmo bowl blowout like it would be in a NCAAF vs Cleveland Browns

NBA team could have a bad shooting night and NCAA could be going 2018 'Nova from the 3 pt line.

I don't think there's any scenario where something of the equivalent could happen in football.

If those exact scenarios happened the NBA team would still win by 30-40 points

KC_Connection 11-07-2018 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWillie (Post 13876515)
So 8-74 is probably too amitious - but if they play the way they did last night they could win a few games.

They'd get blown out in every game they played.

Quote:

Williamson, Barrett and Reddish all might be the second best player on a quite a few bad nba teams
Based on what evidence? Beating a bunch of guys right out of high school last night who have had virtually no coaching or practice time? And it's not like we're not talking about the second coming of LeBron James with any of those Duke guys either.

The NCAA level is a joke in comparison to the NBA and anybody who watches both levels somewhat regularly should be able to recognize that.

I've actually watched both the Mavericks and the Cavs (arguably the worst teams in the NBA in 2018-2019) in person this year and both have enough very solid pros who would absolutely kick the shit out of a bunch of college players.

KC_Connection 11-07-2018 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch (Post 13877472)
This was being said of 2015 Kentucky after a few games. They lost in the Final Four

It was dumb then too.

Chiefspants 11-07-2018 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_Connection (Post 13877549)
They'd get blown out in every game they played.


Based on what evidence? Beating a bunch of guys right out of high school last night who have had virtually no coaching or practice time? And it's not like we're not talking about the second coming of LeBron James with any of those Duke guys either.

The NCAA level is a joke in comparison to the NBA and anybody who watches both levels somewhat regularly should be able to recognize that.

I've actually watched both the Mavericks and the Cavs (arguably the worst teams in the NBA in 2018-2019) in person this year and both have enough very solid pros who would absolutely kick the shit out of a bunch of college players.

I don’t know - could Ronda Rousey beat up Floyd Mayweather?

KC_Connection 11-07-2018 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefspants (Post 13877554)
I don’t know - could Ronda Rousey beat up Floyd Mayweather?

Now that was a good thread here. That may still take the cake for most absurd sports claim on this website.

RaidersOftheCellar 11-07-2018 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TambaBerry (Post 13877538)
If those exact scenarios happened the NBA team would still win by 30-40 points

How do you win by 30-40 when your shots aren't falling and your opponent is hitting all their threes?

Now that takes some God-like talent.

Pablo 11-07-2018 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_Connection (Post 13877559)
Now that was a good thread here. That may still take the cake for most absurd sports claim on this website.

Better than 120 lb Bruce Lee kicking Tysons ass?

MVChiefFan 11-07-2018 09:41 PM

I’ve shared this before, but I remember getting into a massive argument with a dude about how he was positive the UCONN womens bball team back in the day, could beat some of the worst D-I mens bball teams. It was a laughable point, those girls would get absolutely destroyed and it wouldn’t even be close.

smithandrew051 11-07-2018 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MVChiefFan (Post 13877597)
I’ve shared this before, but I remember getting into a massive argument with a dude about how he was positive the UCONN womens bball team back in the day, could beat some of the worst D-I mens bball teams. It was a laughable point, those girls would get absolutely destroyed and it wouldn’t even be close.

ANY of the good boys high school teams would destroy them. Too big of a size, strength, and athleticism difference. It wouldn’t even be close.

CoMoChief 11-07-2018 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TambaBerry (Post 13877538)
If those exact scenarios happened the NBA team would still win by 30-40 points

No, they would not.

smithandrew051 11-07-2018 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_Connection (Post 13877549)
They'd get blown out in every game they played.


Based on what evidence? Beating a bunch of guys right out of high school last night who have had virtually no coaching or practice time? And it's not like we're not talking about the second coming of LeBron James with any of those Duke guys either.

The NCAA level is a joke in comparison to the NBA and anybody who watches both levels somewhat regularly should be able to recognize that.

I've actually watched both the Mavericks and the Cavs (arguably the worst teams in the NBA in 2018-2019) in person this year and both have enough very solid pros who would absolutely kick the shit out of a bunch of college players.

Absolutely agree with all of this.

I hate when people say “well Duke has 7 (or whatever number) NBA players.”

Uhhh...the worst NBA team has 15 NBA players. All sorts of star college players become role players or worse in the NBA. Only the exceptional talents (maybe 2-3 per draft) become stars. Some drafts have even fewer than that.

The worst NBA teams are basically college/international All Star teams with years of development under the best training and coaching that the world has to offer. Additionally, they are full time players. This is their career.

MVChiefFan 11-07-2018 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smithandrew051 (Post 13877636)
ANY of the good boys high school teams would destroy them. Too big of a size, strength, and athleticism difference. It wouldn’t even be close.

My thoughts exactly!

BigRedChief 11-08-2018 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_Connection (Post 13874484)
Also, Vick still has no idea how to play basketball. The hope is that him starting/playing minutes is only temporary. This team has enough depth for him not to play serious minutes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by PHOG (Post 13874685)
Vick passed on that open 3

Quote:

Originally Posted by KILLER_CLOWN (Post 13874676)
Problem with Vick is his jumper starts out hot at the beginning of the year and fades to nothing towards the end. He can rebound but still takes bad shots and struggles to drive to the cup.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_Connection (Post 13874675)
All of this is giving Vick way too much credit and the other 9 players worthy of minutes not enough. He's trash at everything except open threes and the occasional transition basket in this sport.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MVChiefFan (Post 13874623)
Vick is really a waste of space at this point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_Connection (Post 13874580)
Vick is still terrible. No clue what he's doing here still.

glad to see everyone coming around to my 2018 opinion of Vick. There is no reason for him to be starting with the talent we have this year.

TambaBerry 11-08-2018 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaidersOftheCellar (Post 13877589)
How do you win by 30-40 when your shots aren't falling and your opponent is hitting all their threes?

Now that takes some God-like talent.

because they wouldnt need to hit shots when they can get easy layups and dunks

Reerun_KC 11-08-2018 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief (Post 13877819)
glad to see everyone coming around to my 2018 opinion of Vick. There is no reason for him to be starting with the talent we have this year.

But he will save our ass 1 or 3 conference games this year. Seems to happen with guys that take the brunt of the fans jeering.

Mr. Plow 11-08-2018 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief (Post 13877819)
glad to see everyone coming around to my 2018 opinion of Vick. There is no reason for him to be starting with the talent we have this year.

Vick has always been bad. It's not a new Revelation.

BigRedChief 11-08-2018 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Plow (Post 13877830)
Vick has always been bad. It's not a new Revelation.

So why is Self starting him when we have all that talent on the bench? Self should let the talented players riding the pine get a lot more minutes in our "tomato can" part of our schedule. See who deserves to start based on performance in live games.

Mr. Plow 11-08-2018 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief (Post 13877844)
So why is Self starting him when we have all that talent on the bench? Self should let the talented players riding the pine get a lot more minutes in our "tomato can" part of our schedule. See who deserves to start based on performance in live games.

For the same reason he has started someone that shouldn't be starting every year for the past 15 or so years.... he generally values experience over talent at the beginning of the year.

Reerun_KC 11-08-2018 09:05 AM

Besides. It’s NCAA investigation time for KU.

saphojunkie 11-08-2018 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Plow (Post 13877830)
Vick has always been bad. It's not a new Revelation.

Who would you start ahead of him?

sedated 11-08-2018 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Plow (Post 13877907)
For the same reason he has started someone that shouldn't be starting every year for the past 15 or so years.... he generally values experience over talent at the beginning of the year.

That's why I was kind of surprised when Dotson was starting over Moore in that first game.

But it became clear pretty quickly that Dotson is way better.

BWillie 11-08-2018 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief (Post 13877819)
glad to see everyone coming around to my 2018 opinion of Vick. There is no reason for him to be starting with the talent we have this year.

If Grimes is going to shoot like that - you dont need his 3 pt shooting - but I think you'll find that was quite an anamoly.

smithandrew051 11-08-2018 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TambaBerry (Post 13877821)
because they wouldnt need to hit shots when they can get easy layups and dunks

Also, they would be shooting wide open 3’s. Pros won’t miss those forever.

A college team’s defense wouldn’t be able to defend against the passing, driving, and decision making of an NBA squad.

KC_Connection 11-08-2018 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief (Post 13877819)
glad to see everyone coming around to my 2018 opinion of Vick. There is no reason for him to be starting with the talent we have this year.

Hey wait a minute, I’ve been pointing out how bad Vick is for years and actually contested your claim that he would be drafted in the first round last year. LMAO

BigRedChief 11-09-2018 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_Connection (Post 13878725)
Hey wait a minute, I’ve been pointing out how bad Vick is for years and actually contested your claim that he would be drafted in the first round last year. LMAO

You won me over.

BWillie 11-12-2018 05:46 PM

KU getting ready to lay the wood to the Vermont Catamounts. Time to get that #1 ranking back. Dedric should be able to dominate these guys without elite athletes :)

CasselGotPeedOn 11-12-2018 08:41 PM

This shit is hard to watch

Reerun_KC 11-12-2018 09:02 PM

Early season games are brutal.

Uzibookie needs to dunknit or pass it. Dude can’t ahoot for shit.

Reerun_KC 11-12-2018 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWillie (Post 13888316)
KU getting ready to lay the wood to the Vermont Catamounts. Time to get that #1 ranking back. Dedric should be able to dominate these guys without elite athletes :)

Only wood being laid is Vermont laying in on KU.

DJJasonp 11-12-2018 09:14 PM

Nice to see franchilla in mid-season form!

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

Imon Yourside 11-12-2018 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJJasonp (Post 13888669)
Nice to see franchilla in mid-season form!

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

Is he hating again? Lost my internet connection, just came back.

DJJasonp 11-12-2018 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KILLER_CLOWN (Post 13888672)
Is he hating again? Lost my internet connection, just came back.

Not so much hating, but rooting for vermont whenever he can.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

Imon Yourside 11-12-2018 09:22 PM

Took us talking crap all over Vick for him to look good, keep talking smack and maybe he'll be decent.

Reerun_KC 11-12-2018 09:27 PM

So much for CP hating on Vick.

RaidersOftheCellar 11-12-2018 09:27 PM

Nobody talking shit on Vick tonight?

Imon Yourside 11-12-2018 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaidersOftheCellar (Post 13888688)
Nobody talking shit on Vick tonight?

We need to keep it up, I did say he always starts out the year hot then sucks in March.

Reerun_KC 11-12-2018 09:28 PM

Dude. Vick.

RaidersOftheCellar 11-12-2018 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KILLER_CLOWN (Post 13888681)
Took us talking crap all over Vick for him to look good, keep talking smack and maybe he'll be decent.

27 pts, 7-7 from three. Yeah, he's probably decent.

Imon Yourside 11-12-2018 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaidersOftheCellar (Post 13888692)
27 pts, 7-7 from three. Yeah, he's probably decent.

Mad Decent!

RaidersOftheCellar 11-12-2018 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KILLER_CLOWN (Post 13888690)
We need to keep it up, I did say he always starts out the year hot then sucks in March.

Senior year is when the unfocused start focusing. And working harder.

Imon Yourside 11-12-2018 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaidersOftheCellar (Post 13888696)
Senior year is when the unfocused start focusing. And working harder.

Whatever it is i'll take more of that, much more. :)

Reerun_KC 11-12-2018 09:37 PM

KCC will be along shortly.

Imon Yourside 11-12-2018 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC (Post 13888706)
KCC will be along shortly.

for? :D

Imon Yourside 11-12-2018 09:45 PM

Defense! We need to learn how to play it.

Reerun_KC 11-12-2018 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KILLER_CLOWN (Post 13888710)
for? :D

Vick

InvinciBill 11-12-2018 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC (Post 13888706)
KCC will be along shortly.

He hasn’t been owned this badly by one of his own players since Jose Bautista threw to the wrong base three years ago.


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