I'm currently laughing like a ****ing goon during a conference call. Thanks for that.

Just canceled my plans to see them in Wrigley on Monday. Planning to just see them on Tuesday and Wednesday instead. Free tickets so why not. My Cubs friends are absolutely loving the demise of the Cardinal Way.

I'll bet Chip is really questioning leaving Atlanta.

I know these people very well from working in I.T. The arrogance. The absolute certainty that they are always right.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">INF/OF Juan Yepez has been recalled from Memphis (AAA).<br><br>RHP James Naile has been selected from Memphis.<br><br>RHP Jake Woodford (right shoulder inflammation) &amp; OF Tyler O&#39;Neill (lower back strain) have been placed on the IL<br><br>RHP Wilking Rodríguez has been transferred to the 60-day IL <a href="https://t.co/zXOuuqDEzg">pic.twitter.com/zXOuuqDEzg</a></p>&mdash; St. Louis Cardinals (@Cardinals) <a href="https://twitter.com/Cardinals/status/1654577451018715136?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 5, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Countdown to Mo giving a ridiculous Bret Cecil type of contract to some broke dick street FA after JLM or Matz are done for the year.

Maybe this guy is better than some of our current starting pitchers?

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Congratulations to LHP Matthew Liberatore on being named the St. Louis Cardinals Minor League Pitcher of the Month AND the MiLB International League Pitcher of the Month! <a href="https://t.co/KUHJi8cOMc">pic.twitter.com/KUHJi8cOMc</a></p>&mdash; Memphis Redbirds (@memphisredbirds) <a href="https://twitter.com/memphisredbirds/status/1654596087326420994?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 5, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

This team is an absolute abortion with RISP.

{snicker}

I'm not gonna bother with a blow my blow, but one cannot show his ass any worse than Marmol did tonight.

As bad as he routinely is, this was a masterclass in suck. And did, as I'm sure you can imagine, involve another dick measuring contest with the umpires where Marmol has the rules wrong.

He's just such a piece of shit.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/STLCards?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#STLCards</a> manager Oli Marmol affirmed that Willson Contreras will be used almost exclusively as a DH in the coming weeks. <br><br>In an attempt to enhance familiarity with pitchers, Andrew Knizner will do the bulk of the catching over the next two weeks. Tres Barrera will catch some.</p>&mdash; John Denton (@JohnDenton555) <a href="https://twitter.com/JohnDenton555/status/1654888769831534596?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 6, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

lol this organization is a circus

Interesting.

A month into Contreras' deal they just completely removed the most valuable part of his deal. When you stick him at DH his bat doesn't look all that hot any more. He's about league average at DH. Also, you take Gorman out of any sort of regular PAs and he's doing more damage right now.

Solid work.

I wouldn't say it's interesting as much as I'd say it's incompetence.

On the part of Mo and Ollie

Trade off might be worth it if Knizner can actually catch and call a game, but I didn't think defense was his calling card.

Hell, maybe the Cardinals are finally ready to make a trade with a Gorman level player after folding on Soto, seems pretty damn early in the season for anything serious to unfold though.

It also installs another Yadi-like black hole in the line-up.


Too risky. We'll trade for Brad Keller and call it a season.

Just saw this on Twitter and found it bizarre as a non-Cardinals fan. What are they doing here? They just signed him to a 5 year deal, presumably to catch?

They did

The FO is incompetent and flailing now. Organization is a circus and DeWitt needs to clean house. But nothing will happen until asses stop finding seats at Busch.

And I admit, I'm kind of a Hypocrite in saying that since I'm going next month. But it's a sunk cost for me so I kind of have to bite the bullet on this shitty baseball team.

So it's really just sort of a way for the FO to blame Contreras for the struggling pitching? Sounds like a mess.

It's a valid argument. There was a reason the Cubs' only offer to Contreras came 3 years ago to buy out his arbitration years and none of his FA years. He's a terrible catcher. He's also really ****ing bad at calling a game and handling a pitching staff was rumored to be one of the main reasons Hoyer didn't want him and elected to go with a couple of guys that ONLY bring that to the table. Save Stroman, the entire Cubs pitching staff was a full run better throwing to Gomes last year.

The appeal to Contreras was that you could theoretically put him behind the plate and have a really good hitting catcher. Problem is, if you find out your entire pitching staff takes a hit and sucks dick and have to move his bat to the OF/DH then his bat isn't so hot any more.

Wouldn't suprise me one bit. Mo and Ollie are both arrogant dickbags.

But if he's such a terrible catcher such that the pitchers are going to suck that badly with him (which I guess will be proven now that he's getting benched), then why sign him at all? Especially to 5 years?

It all comes back around to the FO anyway.

I ultimately think they are giving him a rest because he might still be injured from that 102 mph fastball he took off the knee. Think someone had a tweet out there saying he was struggling to block balls to his right side and I think it was his right knee that got hit.

lol these umpires are shit

I think the issue is that if you’re going to play Contreras at C, then you need someone who can also play good defense while being OK offensively to carry 60-70% of the load.

Contreras’ offense suffers with more playing time at C. Issue now is he isn’t hitting and his defense is shit at blocking balls (which might also be exacerbated by the pitching).

I didn't pay for MLB.tv and I feel like I'm getting ripped off. They should be paying me to watch this horse shit.

Then why the **** did Mo sign the turd? More proof that it's not just ownership that's the problem

At least they aren't boring. They come up with a brand new way to choke almost every day.

hi Cards fan. I don't usually care about the Cardinals because I'm not a fan to say the least. But I had to stop in and say LOL that your star catcher signing is now a mediocre DH that is no longer a catcher, 1 month into his 60 month deal. It's absolutely hilarious. Already their signing of Contreras makes the Angels signing of Anthony Rendon seem like baseball genius.

What an absolutely hilarious development from someone that roots against the Cardinals. It's almost too funny to really be true!

You might be the most bizarre poster on CP right now.

"Contreras, signed to a five-year, $87.5MM deal in the winter, will now serve as a DH/outfielder for the team, further muddying an already crowded outfield picture in St Louis."

ROFLROFLROFL

:clap::clap::clap:

I'm a Royals fan. So yeah, don't really care about Contreras or how poor the signing was. You're still incredibly strange, though

Umm why do we need a troll in here when we're beating the team up ourselves? Piss off blackbob Vontell

oh if I wanted to troll you boys I certainly could have many times over this season already. But I don't exactly root for an Astros level juggernaut over here myself so I've stayed away from that. This Contreras news is just too epic though. I'm only human Mr. Pasta.

I'm pretty sure we dislike this team more than you do.

I doubt it Mr. Joey Knish. The Cardinals are still a Missouri team just like the Royals. When Royals fans talk trash about the Cardinals it's like one brother talkin' trash to another brother. Sure, brothers relentlessly rip on each other, but everyone knows it's out of love, not hate.

I've never seen you savage the Cardinals at all now that I think about it. Perhaps it comes down to stones. Don't got the stones? You ignorant punk. I play for money. I owe rent. Child support. I play for money, not the ****in' world series on ESPN.

Look at the very first reply to this thread.

How do you sign a FA catcher for big money who can’t even play the position? He has to DH or now take an outfield spot.

WTF is going on in the front office? Arebthe Dewitt’s even paying attention?

Imagine if the Chiefs signed the top LT on the market and moved him to fullback.

So the only off-season move was to fill the hole at catcher and now the hole is still there. Nice work…

How does Mo explain this to DeWitt? Under no scenario could this have been the plan to replace Molina and spend $87 million. And further clog up the team with more outfielders.

He doesn’t have to explain shit until if/when revenue goes down. And he’ll blame that on Bally becoming insolvent.

There's always hope.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Waaaay back onto the grass. <br><br>The <a href="https://twitter.com/Cardinals?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@Cardinals</a>&#39; Masyn Winn, MLB&#39;s No. 43 prospect, hits this Johnny Cueto offering 356 feet for his third homer in his past two games for <a href="https://twitter.com/memphisredbirds?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@memphisredbirds</a>. <a href="https://t.co/JRqTyceoRD">pic.twitter.com/JRqTyceoRD</a></p>&mdash; MLB Pipeline (@MLBPipeline) <a href="https://twitter.com/MLBPipeline/status/1654965659627864064?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 6, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Over the years I've proven my bonfides as a rose colored glasses homer. Yes, we have some top talent not too far from the big show. But...…

as long as Dewitt is stingy with his payroll, Mo is in charge of which players are on the team, keeps picking "yes" men to lead the team...... we are dead in the water with no chance to ever seriously compete for a championship.

With DeJong, Donovan, Edman and Gorman all needing those reps at SS and 2b, there's just no room for Winn.

Logjams man. Just so many logjams. Logjams in the outfield, logjams in the infield. Just so many great players and nowhere to play them. Pitching staff is logjammed and that's why we can't get a look at Liberatore or Graceffo.

If only Tyler O'Neill would hustle or Contreras could block balls to his right. If so, we'd be the best team in baseball. What with all the logjams and all.

They're just TOO good. Mozeliak's put FAR too much talent on this team and it's getting in the way of winning ballgames.

Dammit DJ I don’t really want to laugh right now.

lol

Why do I keep watching this shit

Girsh with a huge sigh of relief.

Why are you quitting on the team with no quit?

I just said I was watching it ROFL

Goldschmidt had a monster day

Cubs post game bringing up the Contreras situation given the Cardinals series starting tomorrow.

Showed the catchers ERA of him vs Knizner. Contreras - 5.27, Knizner - 3.84.

Mo should have already knew this issue. It's not new

He'll be back behind the plate in a few weeks.

Yes, but he's a waste at DH and a liability behind the plate

Good thing we didn’t trade Carlson in a package for Sean Murphy.

Don't remind me...

Was he really that bad as a catcher there?

Leaking out or BS rumors that pitchers were complaining to management about Conteras to management. If so, thats BS. You talk to the player first, man to man.

then Mo has to backtrack after deciding to put him in the outfield. God, this team is a mess.

"We won't have him (Contreras) in the outfield," John Mozeliak told Ken Rosenthal and Katie Woo. "I know that came out yesterday, but after talking with him, it's basically going to be more in the DH role right now. And there's light at the end of the tunnel to get back behind the plate."

****in freak show starting at the top
sec

MLB Power Rankings: Putting Cardinals' putrid start in historic context...

So far in the 2023 season, we've mostly just celebrated the best teams up here in the Official Power Rankings introduction area. Let's shift matters, at least for one week, and talk disappointment. In fact, we'll focus in on one team, as the disappointment has been so extreme.

There are disappointing teams, and then there's what has happened so far in the 2023 MLB season to the St. Louis Cardinals. In looking to examine any historic implications here, I wanted to avoid hyperbole but also actually dig in. The feeling I got was that most disappointing teams that were expected contenders are hovering around .500 or are simply just sub-par. The depths to which the Cardinals have sank this season, to this point, had me wondering if this was one of the worst teams in recent memory -- if not ever -- so long as we framed it as an expected contender.

Now, on the latter point, it's tough to nail down the subjectivity. Lots of people would disagree on what teams might be "expected contenders" in any given season, but I think we could all agree the 2023 Cardinals qualify. They were easily the NL Central favorites (though I'll point out I had the Brewers taking the division), overwhelmingly so in some places.

And they enter Monday with a pathetic 11-24 record. That's a .314 winning percentage which is a 162-game pace of 51-111. In terms of framing just how extreme this is, it would be the worst Cardinals record since 1903 (43-94) and would tie the 1898 St. Louis Browns for the franchise record in losses. The Cardinals haven't lost 100 games since 1908 and haven't even hit 90 losses since 1990.

Still, I'm gonna zero in on the worst starts in relatively recent seasons among contenders. With so many more playoff teams now, it's different than comparing to bad starts back in the '60s or '70s, for example. Plus, the teams that were expected to contend should be more fresh in our memory.

In the Wild Card Era (1995-present), 39 teams have been as bad as the Cardinals or worse through 35 games (list here). I did the legwork for you, though. Among those teams, I come up empty in looking to list the teams that were considered contenders before the season. The closest I found were the 2004 Royals, 2006 Marlins, 2016 Twins and last year's Reds. Each of those teams was coming off an 83-win season. Not one of the 39 teams previously on that list made the playoffs in the previous season. The Cardinals won 93 games and the NL Central last year and were the betting favorites to take the division again.

Through this lens, the 2023 Cardinals are the most disappointing team we've seen in Major League Baseball going back to at least the 1994 strike and maybe a decent bit further back than that.

Even worse news? That list of 39 teams? None of them came even close to the playoffs. None even had a winning record at the end of the season. The 2006 Marlins ended up the best of the bunch at 78-84. Sixteen of them finished with at least 100 losses.

It's getting late early in St. Louis. I'm also 99.999 percent sure this is easily the lowest I've ever ranked them.

https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/m...orioles-surge/

We KNEW he was that bad. We laughed about it.

WE played them for, what, 7 years with Contreras as their catcher? And in the unbalanced schedule era when we were playing them, what, 16 times/season?

We've probably played 100 games against Contreras over his career. And now we're going to claim ignorance?

Nobody in baseball - apart from the team that made no effort to retain his services - should have had a better understanding of Contreras than the Cardinals. And they had the best set of eyes on the planet behind the dish for them over that period to provide a basis of comparison and specific insights.

This is one of those times that the excuses just make it WORSE. Tell me you thought you could make it work and focus on offense over game-calling in an era where pitch trax and possible robo-umps could lessen some the concerns.

Don't dare tell me you didn't know he was a bad catcher. Everyone knew that and you should've known it better than about all of them.

Mo and his Faberge eggs.:mad:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Wonder what the Athletics’ asking price for Sean Murphy was? In December, <a href="https://twitter.com/stltoday?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@stltoday</a> reported on those talks in real time for readers and months later still stands by it.<br><br>A refresher on how the Cardinals pivoted to Contreras, as it was happening … <a href="https://t.co/FLulNjZOsM">https://t.co/FLulNjZOsM</a> <a href="https://t.co/02wjIjClxd">pic.twitter.com/02wjIjClxd</a></p>&mdash; Derrick Goold (@dgoold) <a href="https://twitter.com/dgoold/status/1655597691567570947?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 8, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

And now it looks like Contreras is pissed off at management


Willson Contreras has removed his Cardinals profile picture, and Cardinals from his bio.

Turned off comments on IG as well.

Careful here boys. Highlights like that are apt to make Mo run out and trade for Cueto.

What are the odds that the guy who's track record was clear for anyone to see has taken exception to being blamed for everything that's gone wrong in St. Louis?!?!

And that's despite the fact that he's actually made some strides in pitch framing. He's probably a slightly BETTER defensive catcher than he's been in the past and he's still getting barbecued for things the front office absolutely had to have known about.

Seriously - **** you, Mozeliak, for making Contreras the hero in this story. You're making me support this preening clown. Hated the guy for years and in large part due to precisely the things you're excoriating him for and now because of your little lost lamb routine, I'm forced to back the guy up.

Hell, you should probably just go trade for Javier Baez while you're at it then feign surprise when he strikes out a lot.

Well played sir, well played. LMAO

Braves got him for something similar, maybe even a little more. If that was the offer, then you take it and sign the extension. Braves signed him to 6 years and 73million.

One of the best defensive catchers and game callers right now, who is an emerging stud hitter. Yeah, sounds like a deal Mo would pass up as too risky.

Murphy was my guy all off-season; made too much sense.

Contreras was the one I knew they'd end up signing. They could sell it as a 'splash' and Moe wouldn't have to risk dealing one of his precious prospects and choosing the wrong one. Again.

Remember when we pulled the upset on the Dodgers in the post-season and a big reason we were able to beat them was we could pitch around their big guns and then face Puig (who was mind-****ed) and Mark Ellis?

Then we signed Mark Ellis that offseason?

Yeah, it's a lot like that. The Cubs, at their best, had an achilles heel and it was Contreras being a lousy game caller and his tendency to get himself out via soft contact on the ground. He was a double-play behind their big hitters waiting to happen every time out. And you just navigated the heart of their lineup as best you could waiting for Contreras to GIDP and set you up against the back of their order.

And of course, we went and signed him.

Bernie has a column roasting Mo.

https://www.scoopswithdannymac.com/b...-incompetence/

John Denton tweet:

manager Oli Marmol on the areas where the club wants to see improvement from C/DH Willson Contreras: “I wouldn't say pregame prep as much as … that would be a simplification of it. There's real work to be done. The way I would describe it is truly " .
understanding our internal system of executing the game plan for each individual pitcher. The reality is, it's more than he's ever had to do. Nothing against the way he's done it, but it's very different & it's a lot of work.”

"Everyone is stupid but us. He just doesn't understand that we're a step ahead of the game"

The arrogance that just pours out of every soul in this organization is staggering.

They can't even admit a mistake with any humility. Mother****ers.

Bernie put this gem in his rant:

These victims didn’t approve of Contreras’ pitch selections and went to the manager and the president of baseball ops to with their “Where’s Papa” mewling. As a side note, the idea of Jack Flaherty squawking about Contreras is absolutely history. Ever look in the mirror, Jack?

That was an A+ read

I'd be more impressed if the sanctimonious whale wasn't so fond of writing the 'why are the fans such ingrates' articles whenever he was trying to juice his access within the organization.

There's nothing genuine about Miklasz. **** him, too.

I don't give a shit about Bernie, but every word of what he wrote was true.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The more things change... <a href="https://t.co/GqKZKjjBzX">pic.twitter.com/GqKZKjjBzX</a></p>&mdash; KMac (@MacLikin) <a href="https://twitter.com/MacLikin/status/1655649539997433856?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 8, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I lost any possible respect I could have ever had for Bernie when he insinuated it was Schildt's faul he got himself fired because he didn't give the playing time to who Mo told him to give the playing time.

Yeah, Miklasz is a giant pussy.

He just has some wind at his back so now he's gonna be a bomb thrower. He can eat dicks. He's as bad or worse than Mozeliak; just a different sort of disingenuous twat.

Contreras getting thrown under the bus for being who he is by the front office, seeing pieces of his media today and his attitude at the game tonight…… I’m starting to like the guy….