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RyFo18 02-18-2013 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bowser (Post 9413093)
How is it strange?

Name the next most pressing need on this team as of today.

But if the staff's evaluations of these players determine they aren't going to amount to shit in the NFL, what is still the most pressing need on the team AFTER you've used your #1 overall pick?

htismaqe 02-18-2013 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyFo18 (Post 9413092)
There is the possibility that the Chiefs take Joeckel or Star at #1 and Smith, Barkley, Wilson, and everyone else turn into mediocre quarterbacks. I want Geno as much as the next person, but the QB or bust mentality is a little strange to me.

Even if Joeckel is a perennial pro-bowler, how many games does he win all by himself?

A MEDIOCRE QB will get more wins than Joeckel even if he's an upgrade over Albert.

And of course, it's quite probable that he isn't...

O.city 02-18-2013 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyFo18 (Post 9413092)
There is the possibility that the Chiefs take Joeckel or Star at #1 and Smith, Barkley, Wilson, and everyone else turn into mediocre quarterbacks. I want Geno as much as the next person, but the QB or bust mentality is a little strange to me.

The only negative statement is strange to me.


There is a possibility that they turn out to be all pro's as well. We can't use the fear of a guy busting as the only reason not to take him. If there are flaws that they see and don't think they are fixable, fine, don't take the guy.


But just saying "this guy is risky, he might bust and it could set us back", is no way to do that.

Ace Gunner 02-18-2013 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe (Post 9412698)
Warmack also has tremendous lower body strength and can dominate the guy in front of him physically.

Joeckel is a fine pass blocker. Against the run, or drive blocking, he lacks top end strength.

Eric Fisher is a better all-around LT prospect but Joeckel is being ranked higher because of his pass blocking upside.

Joeckel isn't a complete prospect and isn't worth the #1 overall pick.

He fits what Reid will do with this team -- pass pass & pass more.

htismaqe 02-18-2013 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyFo18 (Post 9413097)
But if the staff's evaluations of these players determine they aren't going to amount to shit in the NFL, what is still the most pressing need on the team AFTER you've used your #1 overall pick?

If they determine ALL of them will be shit, then their evaluations should be in question.

There has not been a draft in the history of the NFL that had ZERO QBs in it.

It's NEVER happened.

These guys get payed to find "the one".

O.city 02-18-2013 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyFo18 (Post 9413097)
But if the staff's evaluations of these players determine they aren't going to amount to shit in the NFL, what is still the most pressing need on the team AFTER you've used your #1 overall pick?

Thats not exactly what you were saying at first.


If they feel that way, yes, find a better option.


But the QB or bust comes from 30 years of finding every reason possible to pass on a first round QB. From, "he's not in our range, he's to risky, he may bust, wait til next year, we have bigger needs etc".

htismaqe 02-18-2013 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buzz_TinBalls (Post 9413102)
He fits what Reid will do with this team -- pass pass & pass more.

We already have a left tackle that fits what Reid wants to do.

As evidenced by the fact that Reid tried to trade up to get him in the draft.

Bowser 02-18-2013 04:34 PM

The Chiefs have never, ever been in this position before in the history of their franchise. Never has it been more clear cut to what the pick should be. I'll readily admit that Geno or any other of the top QB's may not pan out to be Andrew Luck or RGIII, but would you want a guy comparable to Russell Wilson on the team? How about Matt Ryan? Andy Dalton? Would you take Ryan Tannehill over Geno, Barkley, or Wilson?

RyFo18 02-18-2013 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe (Post 9413099)
Even if Joeckel is a perennial pro-bowler, how many games does he win all by himself?

A MEDIOCRE QB will get more wins than Joeckel even if he's an upgrade over Albert.

And of course, it's quite probable that he isn't...

I agree here. The QB is the most important on the field and needs to be upgraded on this team.

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 9413101)
The only negative statement is strange to me.


There is a possibility that they turn out to be all pro's as well. We can't use the fear of a guy busting as the only reason not to take him. If there are flaws that they see and don't think they are fixable, fine, don't take the guy.


But just saying "this guy is risky, he might bust and it could set us back", is no way to do that.

I 100% agree. But they're not going to draft based on whether or not a guy will bust. They are going to trust their evaluations and either say a.) We have to draft this QB, or b.) We don't.

Quote:

Originally Posted by htismaqe (Post 9413103)
If they determine ALL of them will be shit, then their evaluations should be in question.

There has not been a draft in the history of the NFL that had ZERO QBs in it.

It's NEVER happened.

These guys get payed to find "the one".

2007 - Russell, Quinn, Kolb, Beck, Stanton, Edwards, Stanback, Rowe, Troy Smith, Jordan Palmer, Tyler Thigpen, Matt Moore (UDFA)

EDIT: 2002 was another horrid year for quarterbacks. These years do occasionally come about.

RyFo18 02-18-2013 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bowser (Post 9413108)
The Chiefs have never, ever been in this position before in the history of their franchise. Never has it been more clear cut to what the pick should be. I'll readily admit that Geno or any other of the top QB's may not pan out to be Andrew Luck or RGIII, but would you want a guy comparable to Russell Wilson on the team? How about Matt Ryan? Andy Dalton? Would you take Ryan Tannehill over Geno, Barkley, or Wilson?

Absolutely, though I don't see Dalton having anywhere near as high of a ceiling.

Bowser 02-18-2013 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyFo18 (Post 9413118)
Absolutely, though I don't see Dalton having anywhere near as high of a ceiling.

Agreed. And I don't even hate Dalton as a signal caller.

Bowser 02-18-2013 04:37 PM

And quick delete, Dayze. I had the perfect response all lined up, as well. ;)

O.city 02-18-2013 04:38 PM

Lets not get to outta control. Geno, Wilson, and Bark are good prospects. Thats about it.

Dayze 02-18-2013 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bowser (Post 9413123)
And quick delete, Dayze. I had the perfect response all lined up, as well. ;)

i forgot to quote your post lol.

....then it just looked like my post was off-the wall.

RyFo18 02-18-2013 04:41 PM

Put it this way...My opinion has taken a complete 180 on what the Chiefs should do at #1. I was in the QB or bust mentality from the get-go. The more I watch film on these quarterback prospects though, I can't with 100% certainty say I would be ridiculously upset if we ended up with Joeckel or Star and Dysert/Nassib, especially given that we have a coach that I have the utmost confidence in to develop his own quarterback.

Geno definitely sticks out to me in terms of the top talent at the QB position in this draft, but I've finally come to the conclusion that I'm not going to panic if they don't go QB at #1. That's just me, and I want a stud QB as bad as the next person.


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