Mr. B-

Check your e-mail, you won our satellite system and NFL Sunday Ticket for 2001.

Marty

DAMN - COOL!!!

Congrats, Luz!

Super Bowl party at Luz's House!!!

I'll bring the pork rinds!

------------------
Pants
Texas

Cool! Are you going to have a hot tub there for this shindig?

I am now busy entering every contest I can get my hands on!

By next season I expect to have that Hot Tub installed as well as a new BBQer. If you can win cocktails and cocktail waitresses I'll have those available too!

Seriously, I want to thank Marty and NFLSCOOP.com
Without solicitation I can say that I enjoy their site and find it a great compliment to this one (the free satellite is a great fit, don't you think?).

Luz
party at my place!!!...

There couldnt be a more appropriate gift for Luzap. MAYBE he can come on this board next year and offer some real nfl knowledge instead of guessing. Luzap has the opportunity to see every game and expand his knowledge.

Congratulations Luzap.

I want a Florida recount!! http://www.chiefsplanet.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

Congrats Luzap!

Kennie, you're an a$$hole!

Did you wake up on the wrong side of the bed, Packfan? It's a little early in the morning to be taking cheap shots at Luz.

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It looks I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue!

So Luz, When and Where is this party? Congrats, lucky man. I won a coke in 5th grade, and it has been downhill ever since.

Morphius
wondering if they somehow confused "Packard" for "Luzap".

Congrats, sounds like a good deal.

Leave it to NEEEwman-packfan to try to take a dump on a good thing...You are such an @$$hole.

Luz,
Ken's just jealous because he has to watch games on his 13" black and white with a coat hanger for an antenna(sp). Congrats on your win. Enjoy!

Hey Ken, I actually thought that was pretty damn funny!! Lighten up folks, Holy shit!!!

Looks like X-mas is going to continue in yur house Luz ! Can you say Thank You Santa ! :D

[This message has been edited by ROYC75 (edited 12-28-2000).]

Cory - The thing is that Ken meant it, not as a joke. He always says Luz, Russ,... have no football knowledge. So not that funny.

Same here. When Ken lightens up and can show a little tact and diplomacy, then I'll lighten up also.

Congrats Luz! All I got from NFLScoop.com is a baseball hat...but it's a really nice one...thanks again, Marty! :). Where is this party at anyway...I'll bring the beer!

Pack--
You are such a fuckstick. Get a life, would ya?

MM
~~Jealous of Luz...pities Packfan.

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One of the great things about books is sometimes there are some fantastic pictures.
--George W. Bush


[This message has been edited by Mark M (edited 12-28-2000).]

I'd like to congratulate you, from 1 'all-idiot' member to another. ;)

Too bad Lil' Kenny is on Holiday break. When is school back in session, so we can have our board back?

Nice going Luzap.......

Be careful, those $6.99 and $10.99 movies can add up real fast!!!!!

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Chiefs Rock

watch out for those $7.95 charges for "pb"...we always get those on our bill for the dates the wife and i are out of town.
sec

When someone makes a much harsher crack at me (which happens all the time) none of you guys rush to back me up. I have told Luzap many times to get a dish and follow the rest of the NFL because his comments clearly suggest he see nobody else but the Chiefs. So I am happy for him. He needs a dish and he got one for free. Way to go. Some of you guys sound like a bunch of babies pouting over my comments.

I tell it like it is. Yea, some of you would prefer that I say something like "Luzap is so smart, God I wish I knew as much football as he does. I agree with everything that he says including his prediction that the Chiefs are going to run the table and win their last seven games....." The true football fan probably appreciates my candor and humor more than sugar coating my comments to appease the Dartgods of the bulletin board.

Coryt, thanks for backing me up here. Obviously, some take this football stuff way to seriously.

We don't rush to back you up because most of us don't like you. Not necessarily you personally, because I have never met you in person, but rather your posting style. You have a knack for rubbing people the wrong way. Why do you think very few people agree with you here? (Yeah, I know the answer to that one.)

BTW, Thanks for using me as an example in your post. It makes my appointment to the All-Idiot Team all the more satisfying.

Packfan - People don't rush to protect you because you normally make the first stupid comment or insult, it is hard to stand up for the guy who throws the first blow. Just like when people ask you a question you don't want to answer you just insult them and call them names and ignore the question at hand, it has happened enough times that nobody would stand up for you.

Packfan is so smart, God I wish I knew as much football as he does. I agree with everything that he says including his prediction that the Chiefs are never going to win a playoff game with Elvis at QB!

If you could disagree with a post without insulting people, we'd probably back you up more often. You occasionally have some great points, but can never seem to disagree with someone without getting personal. Seems to me you have some adequacy issues.

MM
~~Wonders why he wastes his time with this guy...

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One of the great things about books is sometimes there are some fantastic pictures.
--George W. Bush

[This message has been edited by Mark M (edited 12-28-2000).]

Take it from me, Packfan, you don't need anyone to back you up.

It's a bulletin board, not a barroom brawl.

You are correct, I dont need anyone to back me up. I back up my opinions with facts. Thats hard to argue. Some try and fail. Case in point: Loyalty of Chief fans. I have statistical evidence to prove my point, yet some of you either try to attack me personally or bring up the Packers without having a clue of their attendance history. When somebody does that, of course I am going to call him on it. Statistical

I have always made a point not to throw the first punch. If you read the entire threads, you will see that somebody has come at me first most of the time. I admit, here I went after Luzap. He and I have a long history. In the past, I have suggested that he get direct TV. I said that because he continually spews comments that are off the top of his head and are usually wrong. Anyone want to dispute me on that?

I don't usually back up Packfan's way of saying things, but I do usually back up some of the points he makes.

He is correct on many points about Carl Peterson and the Chiefs.<BR>

Packfan - So you prove your opinions with facts like when people talk about the Packers stadium being pretty empty on one occasion and all you could say was that they were sold out? And anyone who believes Stats are deciding in all cases is completely off base with being able to prove anything.

The holocost was not that bad, Millions of Jews survived...

Morphius
Bad route to prove a point, but oh well.

Re: #25
Where is Titus when we need him?! I'm sure he has got some good stuff somewhere.

Luz--
Again, congrats!! (Just trying to re-focus this thing on the topic at hand. Isn't it amazing how one troll can change everything away from the actual point?)

MM
~~Doesn't have the time to check every thread.

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One of the great things about books is sometimes there are some fantastic pictures.
--George W. Bush

Packfan comes in here acting like an ******* , bashing something we are all very passionate about, questioning our loyalty, insulting our football intelligence, trashing some of our favorite players and we're supposed to back up the **** he spews? I'm sorry, did I miss something somewhere along this ride?

One other thing Packfool: I have disagreed several times with what Luz says, but he, unlike you, doesn't come here to stir $hit and anger people.

That's why people have such problems with you. And that you are the master of contradictions. And you know nothing about football. Geez, come to think of it Lil' Kenny, I can think of no good that you have done here.

Omigod! They killed Kenny!! You righteous dudes!!

I am not trying to stir things up. I think some of you do that by bringing the Packers into a Chiefs discussion.

Mark M, I am happy for Luzap. I think I made that pretty clear. I am not sure what you are reading that makes you think otherwise.

Yes, I am strong with my words. I fight fire with fire. Again, I have tried to fight fire with fire AFTER being attacked, not before. You guys have a curious way of coming down on me when I fight back, but dont say a word to the person who started it.

I also try to use words like "Most" when talking about Chief fans. I realize that the Chiefs have some hard core, loyal fans. Every team does. Some of those fans are on this board. I also dont come on here chirping about the Packers. I only talk about them if they relate to the Chiefs (pointing out that the Chiefs could have had Brunell when the Packers were shopping him, for example) or when you guys bring it up.

Little details like these make all the difference. SOME people on here suffer from selective memory.

Again for Mark M, Congratulations Luzap. A free dish is great for any fan!

Your consideration has moved me to the point of tears, Packfan.

Of course you don't chirp about the Packers. There's not a whole lot to talk about the last 3 years....

Perhaps you have lightened up, Ken. It's really difficult to notice though because I (and others) have a really negative attitude towards you and rightfully so.

I'll try to clear the tables and have an open mind towards your post from now on. I know that probably means nothing to you but what the hell....

I'm with you Kphobia. I, too, will try to turn over a new leaf. It is the holidays, after all.

Phobia,

I dont mind you guys challenging me. I expect it. But dont come at me with this "negativity" crap. I am sorry, but if a team finishes 7-9 and is stuck in mediocrity for the last few years, there isnt a lot of positives to talk about. Then they go and resign Carl Peterson. What is positive about that?

Yes, the Packers are in the same boat as the Chiefs - almost. They havent won a playoff game in since 1997. Not good. However, I do see light at the end of the tunnel because they have Brett Favre, who I believe is still the best QB in football. You always have a chance when you have him. Plus, the Packers went out and got a runningback in the offseason. No, they didnt break the bank and sign a free agent. They traded a #2 pick for Ahman Green. He rushed for over 1100 yard and caught over 70 balls for 500+ yards. Maybe the Chiefs will pick up Dorsey Levens after he gets cut by the packers.

Packfan--
I guess the backhandedness of your compliment is what pi$$ed me off. But I too will give you another chance (don't know if you care or not, but, since I'm married to a Packers' fan, I guess I kinda have to. I'm not allowed to not like the Packers—even though they've always been my favorite NFC team :) ) I did this at first, gave up after a while, but, now that the season is over, I will start with fresh ideas.

I don't know....maybe it's the DayQuill talking! I just feel a lot of love for everyone right now! (Except BronocFan...he's still an a$$!) :D

MM
~~Willing to forgive and forget.

------------------
One of the great things about books is sometimes there are some fantastic pictures.
--George W. Bush

Thank you all for your congrats! ~ you too Packfan.

As I said, you are all invited to my place for the party.

I would love to take credit for always being singled out by Ken as (apparently) his nemises, but the truth is, it is an honor I never put any effort into.

I have consistently supported Carl Peterson and have always had faith in Elvis Grbac as a Pro Bowl caliber QB. Other than that, I have just asked him a few simple football questions from time to time testing his self acclaimed football knowledge.

Apparently he does not like it when he can't answer these questions (such as the H Back).

Judging from the fact that he posts about 20 times for every single time I post, I'd say it's really getting to him.

Packfan, in the spirit of Christmas, I beseech you not to let your inability to answer questions obsess you. I will also promise not to ask you any other simple football questions.

Luz
hoping to give ken a much more enjoyable new year...

Ken - I think that sometimes you miss out on exactly what drives some of on here. I have always been a Chiefs fan and always will be. I followed them throughout the lean years and when Carl and Marty arrived in ’89 I purchased my season tickets. I have missed only 2 regular season games since then. I was transformed into a very passionate fan. I lived and died with the Chiefs successes and failures. The disappointments finally got to be too much for me after the ’97 playoff loss to the Donkeys and I decided that I needed to quit taking the losses so personally. Today it still upsets me when we fail, but I have learned to take it with a grain of salt. I realize that Peterson has made many mistakes (poor free agent signings and poor draft results) over the years and probably doesn’t deserve the contract extension he got. I realize that our coaching staff is subpar and Carl made another mistake hiring Gunther. I realize that Grbac often has mental breakdowns at the most inopportune moments. The thing is though, I make a conscious effort to look for the good, the positive in Chiefs and I always have hope each and every season that we can make it to the playoffs and ultimately the big show (Super Bowl).

cont.

[This message has been edited by Dartgod (edited 12-29-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Dartgod (edited 12-29-2000).]

I know it may sound a bit misguided, but I am realistic enough to know what our shortcomings are. When I see someone on here (you) harping on the same things with practically every post for over a year and a half, it gets to be too much. I do see the same problems with this team that you do. Unlike you though, I don’t let those problems ruin my day or my love for the Chiefs. The reason is very simple. I cannot do anything about it, short of giving up on them altogether and finding a new team to root for. That would make me a bandwagon fan, something that I cannot stomach. So as a result, I will continue to be a Chiefs fan. I will keep my season tickets as long as I am financially able. And I will always have hope that next year is the one that we finally make it back to the Super Bowl. And if we don’t, there is not one thing I can do about it.

[This message has been edited by Dartgod (edited 12-29-2000).]

Dartgod,

Nice post. Chief failures do not "ruin my day". I like football, know a lot about the Packers and Chiefs, and like being an armchair QB. I think we all do. When guys on here come at me with mis-information, I am going to jump on them and let them know it. Not to be a dick, but because of the demeaner in which they attack me with their mis-information. I am not going to change that. I have learned which guys know their stuff and which dont and respond accordingly.

newman,

what gets my goat about your posting style is that you come off as 'holier than thou' and constantly mention the ignorance of everyone here....and then say you "back up your knowledge with facts and stats....but I rarely actually see them.....seriously.

If it looks like a duck, and sounds like a duck, some people might call it a duck.

------------------
"Anyone who wouldn't cheat for a poke, doesn't want one bad enough."[i] Augustus McCray</I>

OK, maybe it doesn’t ruin your day (it used to do that to me), but why such negativity? Sometimes it seems as if you think the Chiefs owe you a playoff victory or two or even a championship. Why not just enjoy the fact that we have an NFL team here to watch. I’m not saying that we should just accept what they give us, but the truth is there is not much we can do about it short of giving up on them altogether. I’m not prepared to do that, are you?

Dartgod,

The only thing the Chiefs owe their fans is an honest effort to build a champion. I dont think they are giving that. I think the goal of the team is to be profitable first, and win second. They dont not look past two years when it comes to personnel decisions. Even thought this team desperately needs to rebuild from a talent and salary cap perspective, it wont. That would drive the fans away. IMO, the team just spins its wheels of mediocrity on purpose, because it keeps the fans interested. 17 years for a GM with three playoff wins????? Thats nuts! Peterson has had plenty of time to get it done and has failed. Signing him to an extension only validates what I have been saying. Profit first, championships second. The Titans, Saints, Ravens, Bucs, Rams, Vikings all have rebuilt and retooled through savvy drafting and trades. All have had recent success. Meanwhile, the Chiefs continue to reload with journeymen free agents, have a merry go round at running back, have bargain basement coaching staff, and make their first round picks miss camp every year. That is UNACCEPTABLE.

Packfan,

This is an example of why no one gives you much credibility.

Although Carl has just signed a new 5 year contract, he hasn't yet been here 17 years.

It is purposely misleading statements like that that cause me to discount just about everything you say.

Luz
when you know a source to be purposely deceitful, only an idiot would give it credence in the future...

Luzap,

Speak for yourself. I know there are people on here that think I am credible. They have told me. I could care less if you think I am credible or not. You spend most of your time guessing on here anyway.

No, Peterson hasnt had the full 17 years. He has had 12 and only three playoff wins. I doubt that he will get anymore. Like I have said before, the Chiefs are closer to the bottom then they are to the top. At least you can do simple math. Thats a start.

Packfan,

I know that you keep telling me that you know so much more about football than I do (or just about anyone else for that matter), but would you mind clarifying for me just how you figure Carl has had 12 seasons with the Chiefs?

I'm going by memory here, and there is a chance you could be right, but I'm pretty sure Carl just completed his 11th season.

Luz
doesn't this make you wrong twice (on the same issue?)...

1989-2000 is 12 seasons.

------------------
It looks I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue!

mizzou5,

Thanks for the clarification. I guess I've been a season ticket holder longer than I thought!

Luz
it's been 12 years i've thoroughly enjoyed being a fan of the chiefs...<BR>

Luzap,

Well I guess I am wrong about you being able to do simple math.

Ken,
Let me just add my .02 here.
To me the issue isn't credibility. I've agreed with many of your points. It's the insulting, attacking style of your posts.
Whether you see it or not, every time you post, you insult and attack the intelligience of every poster with your generalized "most Chief fans"
Because "most Chief fans" want to look for the positives, even while realizing that there are a lot of negatives, we, almost all of us, fall into that "most Chiefs fans" category. And that category is always assotiated with some type of insult from you.

------------------

Red Eyes
Leading the charge to scalp Goonther MaGoo, The 3 Stooges, and Limp Willie!

Packfan-

Milkman is right.

xoxo~
gaz
hoping this time it sticks.<BR>

Milkman, Gaz,

I dont believe I have ever insulted either of you. Luzap and I go back a long way. Dont take what I say to him as a personal insult to you. In most cases, I am not the one who is the first to insult. I fight fire with fire though. Luzap likes to guess and ridicule at the same time. When he is wrong, which is often, I challenge him on it in the same demeanor that he does. Its OK to be wrong, but Luzap (and a few) others are so obnoxious with their inaccurate information.

Ken,
You have never insulted us personally.
It's your "most Chiefs fans" blanket statement that we find insulting.

------------------

Red Eyes
Leading the charge to scalp Goonther MaGoo, The 3 Stooges, and Limp Willie!

Ken-

Milkman is right again.

You regularly bash "Chiefs Fans" as stupid, brainwashed idiots and then seem shocked when some Chiefs fans take offense. Perhaps if you quit painting with such a broad brush, you might not cause quite so much collateral damage and might not take quite so much heat.

xoxo~
gaz
innocent [okay, not really] bystander.<BR>

Milkman and Gaz,

I never say "all Chief fans". I use words like "most" and "some" or "many". There are always exceptions. Please, what I say to Luzap or Bliss has nothing to do with you guys. You have read some of their stuff, you know what I mean.

Packfan-

I must correct you. The problem is that you do not use words like "most" and "some" or "many." I remember this because you and I have had this exact same conversation before.

xoxo~
gaz
correcting a faulty memory.<BR>

I find the words "most" or even "many" to be insulting. If Ken used "some" or a "few" or "my _______(neighbor, co-worker, sister/wife), the Chiefs fan", I'd be less inclined to take offense.

Gaz,

Show me what you are talking about! Give me an example, ie post topic and #. I respond enough on here that it shouldnt be that hard for you to get many examples. <P>