Dear, Vikings: Thanks for our quarterback; Sincerely, Chiefs
 

Dear, Vikings: Thanks for our quarterback; Sincerely, Chiefs

By Clark Judge
CBSSports.com Senior Writer

I heard someone last week ask if there were any way the Minnesota Vikings could repay Kansas City for dropping star defensive end Jared Allen on their doorstep, and, yes, I said, there is. In fact, they've already done it.

Meet Tyler Thigpen.

He's the Chiefs' quarterback for now and maybe the future, but he wouldn't be in Kansas City if the Vikings hadn't cut him loose a year ago to make room for a reserve tight end.

The move was a gamble, and Minnesota knew it, but it figured it could re-sign Thigpen -- chosen by the Vikings in the seventh round of the 2007 draft -- to its practice squad after he cleared waivers.

Only he didn't clear. Kansas City claimed him.

Now he's playing so well that Chiefs coach Herman Edwards confessed he's considering scrapping the Chiefs' run-heavy offense next season and going with what works for Tyler Thigpen -- a more spread-out, wide-open, two-minute approach that usually has Thigpen operating out of the shotgun.

That can't be good news for someone like running back Larry Johnson, but it is for Thigpen. It means someone has a conviction about the guy, and that someone is Edwards -- with the coach considering a change next season from his offenses of the past just to suit his young quarterback.

If that happens, it means Edwards believes in Thigpen as his future starter. But he isn't there yet, and he emphasized that when I reached him Wednesday.

"We've got four games left," he said. "Let's see what he does. But one thing I do know: He's a No. 2. There is no doubt about that. That we know."

Others within the Kansas City hierarchy admit "cautious optimism" about Thigpen, who produced his first victory last weekend and who has played well for one of the league's bottom feeders. In fact, in a recent four-game stretch, he threw eight touchdown passes and one interception and took, in order, the Jets, Tampa Bay and San Diego to the mat, with all three games decided in the closing seconds.

Now, let's make something clear: Tyler Thigpen is not the next Eli or Peyton Manning. But he is a pleasant discovery in a not-so-pleasant season in Kansas City, and the Chiefs can address those "thank you" notes to 9520 Viking Drive, Eden Prairie, Minn. They wouldn't have Thigpen were it not for the Vikings' gamble.

The common perception is that Kansas City discovered Thigpen when the Chiefs and Vikings held a preseason scrimmage, but Edwards shot down that idea, saying Thigpen didn't play "that much" when the two teams practiced against each other. Instead, he said, Thigpen appeared on the Kansas City radar when he was a star quarterback at Coastal Carolina, with the Chiefs rating him a low fifth- or high sixth-round choice.

He could run. He had a strong arm. He was accurate. He was durable. And he won. Basically, he was everything you wanted from a quarterback, with a couple of drawbacks: 1) He didn't operate in a pro offense, working instead out of the shotgun, and 2) he played at a small school against lesser competition.

Nevertheless, when the team's vice president of player personnel, Bill Kuharich, watched him that summer in the fourth quarter of an exhibition game, he noticed something he liked.

"It was just the way he handled himself and the pressure," said Kuharich. "It reinforced what I had seen on tape. (Team president) Carl (Peterson), Herm and I decided if he ever became available we would claim him."

Which, of course, they did when Minnesota stuck with Tarvaris Jackson and acquired veteran backup Kelly Holcomb. Now, Holcomb is gone, Jackson is benched and Thigpen is playing for Kansas City. Hindsight is 20-20, but it doesn't take a genius to figure out the Vikings erred when they let Thigpen go.

I came to that conclusion last weekend when Thigpen led Kansas City on a 16-play, 91-yard drive that broke a 10-10 deadlock against Oakland. He completed three of four passes and ran for two first downs on that series.

I came to that conclusion again that afternoon when, on third-and-3 with just over two minutes to play, he iced the game by hitting Dwayne Bowe with a 12-yard completion.

"We've got ourselves a pretty good quarterback," said Edwards.

That's as strong a statement as you get from the head coach, but it tells you what he will not: That Tyler Thigpen could be the quarterback the Chiefs envisioned when they drafted Brodie Croyle in 2006. Croyle was supposed to be the Chiefs' quarterback of the future, but those plans have been scrapped because he can't stay healthy.

Thigpen can. He can also win, with last weekend's defeat of Oakland a breakthrough. After close calls against four opponents -- including New Orleans -- he finally demonstrated that he can close a deal, and that's what the Chiefs have been missing the past year and a half.

But that's just the beginning. They rave about Thigpen's mobility. In fact, it was the first quality Edwards ticked off when he listed his quarterback's strengths. Thigpen can throw with accuracy, too, with a string of 161 passes without an interception and a third-down passer-rating higher than those of Brett Favre and Jay Cutler. Plus, he's an outstanding athlete -- the only quarterback in Kansas City history to score a touchdown by running, passing and receiving.

"The question now," said Edwards, "is how will he continue to play and do we want to change the offense? I have to talk to (offensive coordinator) Chan Gailey, but right now I'm thinking we would.

"We changed everything to build the offense around him. It's like we're operating with a three-page notebook, adding a little with each week. Now the question is: Do we stay with this? Because it means you would have to do some things differently, like look at a little different offensive linemen."

The Chiefs have four games to produce an answer, but that they are even considering a change in their offense tells me one thing: They may have found themselves a quarterback.

http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/story/11149961

:popcorn:

Now if only our defense wasn't complete shit.

Dear Chiefs, Thanks for your entire pass rush.


Vikings

First smart thing Herm has said in a while "He's a number 2. We know that for sure."

I think it's great that Herm and Carl have FINALLY located a true QBOTF.

Extensions are probably in order.

Oh baby; that is one laundry list full of Wrong.

You can't handicap the running game by working out of the shotgun all day. I'm a fan of Thigpen, but this is just scary stupid.

This.

I like the fact that having Thigpen has forced Herm to change his offensive philosophy.

Yeah, but if the philosophy is a flawed pile of shit; there's nothing to be happy about.

Again, cautious optimism is a good place to be. However is Stafford or Bradford declare and fall to us in the draft then I could see us pulling the trigger. As for changing back the offense to Hermball, WHY? :mad:
The scoreboard shows the difference Herm! Would we really have to change our players that much? They seem to run this offense much better than Hermball RRPP.

It works, obviously. Not only does it work for us, but it has worked for other teams in the past. Why are you complaining? If Herm says he is willing to change his offensive philosophy permanently, then that's cause for celebration

Dear Chiefs,

Thanks for the Hall of Famer.

The Vikings

With Herm calling Tyler a #2, I have a good feeling that he will draft a Bradford or Stafford in the draft.

You do realize that since we've gone spread we've rushed the ball more, gained more yards and have a higher yards per carry average?

Shuddup Moron!

BECAUSE IT'S COMPLETE ABANDONMENT OF AN EFFECTIVE RUNNING GAME. :cuss:

God, somebody back me on this PLEASE!

If you stick with this current scheme; lining LJ or whoever up behind Thigpen in a shotgun formation, you've lost 3+ yards before the ****ing ball is even snapped!

This is stupid, reeruned, gay, D-D-DEE, Ass clown Offense.
If there were only ONE THING I could point to and say Herm needs to be fired; this would be the one.

now that is interesting stuff

Considering our total ground game, I wouldn't go counting that as a positive.

And if you DO, then know that those yards are coming from outside or near outside runs.

This is utter lunacy.

1) I think you're missing the implication here. He think's that Thigpen is AT LEAST a #2. Meaning, at worst, he knows he has a backup in place. He's displaying some cautious optimism that Thigpen can be the #1, and wants to see how he performs over the last 4 games before they make a decision to permanently change the offense for 2009.

2) And it's going to be hard to take a QB that is already gone (Stafford) and one that is still playing college ball. (Bradford)

You mean our total ground game that is ranked 12th in the NFL? The numbers aren't bad. Pre-spread we were averaging 4.4ypc. Since we switched to the spread we're getting 5.18ypc.

I may garner some shred of respect for Herm if he does change his offensive mindset to fit Thigy. That would be a step out of the play not to lose mentality I would think.

The exact same thing was said about the West Coast Offense when teams started running it. Lots of people said "Yeah just wait till we play a real defense. Then this gimmick offense will fall apart." Well, we played some pretty good defenses, and we still had success with it. Obviously there is still some skepticism, but teams have had a chance to game plan for it, and it's still been successful.

Saying that this is the thing Herm should be fired over is straight stupid.

That could be possible. If Stafford or Bradford are the BPA when the Chiefs pick they just might pick either one?

But, I also think the Chiefs are looking at LBer as well. Moving DJ to the middle gives every indication of that.

We do know, the Chiefs hint to positions for sure:

-LB and QB

why is it we can have R2P2, OR the spread? some people make it sound like those are the only two options. who's to say during the revamping of the offense, chan doesn't find some happy balance? let thigpen get a little more comfortable under center, and slowly get back to a more pro style offense. that being said, i'm wondering how this offense is going to run in december. (i'd like to see how it runs in january more, but thats not happening.)

Holy ****ing crap dude. You probably bitched about R2P2 as well huh? Is there an offense that we can run that would make you happy?

Good point. I never have understood the argument that the spread offense won’t work in the NFL. Maybe that’s because I’ve never heard, or read, a reasonable argument for why. :shrug:

Another piece to this puzzle that needs to be looked at is how the college game is moving more and more to the spread. It may become difficult to find enough "true" pro-style players - especially QBs - after a while.

I don't think we'd necessarily have to sell the run out to adopt this offense next season.

Currently it's about a 60/40 split in favor of the pass.

I'm not looking at the numbers at the moment, but I'd imagine that we've been fairly effective running the ball since the Spread was installed.

And remember, we're not fully operational with it.
Herm said as much in the article.

Wow. Wow wow wow.

Prior to this thread, I thought that overall we had some really good students of the game in here.

Unbelieveable.

Spot on.

He has a chance to play a bigger role next year, but that will depend on his numbers over the final quarter of the season.

I think if he can minimize turnovers he'll win the job.

I'm looking for something like 6-8 TD's with 1-2 picks.
I think that would do it.

Although i didnt notice it last week,

Thiggy has ran a few plays from behind center. He doesnt take 100% shotgun snaps.

Time may prove me wrong, but I'm betting it won't.


Let's find out some numbers that relate to those "pretty good" defenses we've played.

I have never claimed to be a student of the game but your constant bitching is reeruned.

I can almost guarantee our spread is going to be dogshit without Tony catching 10 balls a game.

:clap:

And your bandwagon-jumpery is equaly comical. Let's keep this about the ****ing game, okay Sherlock?

Excellent point.

Band-wagon jumping? Are you ****ing kidding me? I'm just happy that Herm has pulled his head out of his ass and let Thigpen run something that he can. Do I think it will work next season? I don't know. I'm not going to bash the fact that it seems to be working right now.

True, but sadly enough Herm isnt a forward enough thinker to maximize his talent until he is forced into doing something he didnt want to do.

Its not like Herm come out and said you know what guys? This team can not run my historically bad buttsexs offense, we need to look at this type of offense to best maximize our potential... It came out of desperation...

IF Herm was such a prodigy, then the Tampon 2 wouldnt be used, when our LB's and Safetys are blah....

any offense the chiefs will be running will be dogshit with out tony. especially a tony g that is on fire.

Nice Post, but I dont think Herm has the full head out though.... The defense is still bad enough to make GROB look like Buddy Ryan...

:shrug:
http://www.stayingalive.ca/images/fi...inguisher1.jpg

I won't deny that the scheme is working well right now. But the level of play on the part of EVERYONE involved in it needs to up, up, UP Big Time in order to make it work against a Pro Bowl defense.

I'll be plowing through the numbers here shortly, as I want to see how this is truly playing out.

You're a ****ing idiot, and can't see shit right in front of your clown face.

It is good to see, but I think the losing streak may have brought some pressure to bear on Herm.


It is good to see one of these claims go the Chiefs way, many of us have been upset over the Colts claim of Ryan Lilja for quite a while.

And **** you too, mother****er! Back it up with numbers instead of being an asshole( If you can ).

if r2p2 scores you 17 points and the other team 24
or the spread scores you 27 and the other team 34
the outcome is just the same -sav perhaps a little more entertaining

Have you watched the Chiefs play this year? Old offense = worst in league history. Spread = at a minimum, league average. Yeah, let's go back to Herm's vaunted power running game.

yeah..your right. Damn, thought we had something. Back to rrp2

Look, GoSuck, using a different user name does not make you a football genius. You are the same pillow-biting moron no matter what name you sign on with.

Herm had a vaunted power running game? :D

We scored 27 points, had 384 yards of total offense, 201 yards passing, 183 yards rushing against Tampa Bay....and their ranks:

Total Defense: #4
Pass Defense: #3
Rush Defense: #9
Scoring: #4

So your saying we are going to the Big Bowl? Or we might as just as well go Demonpenz and smoke a Big Bowl?

In Herm, Carl, and CarlSatan's minds, he did.

These are the current rankings of our opponents for overall NFL defense:

Tampa Bay: 4th. This was the game where we really opened up the playbook, and had better performance from the Offense after the NYJ and two solid weeks of practicing the scheme. The Tampa D however did what a good D is supposed to do; they made adjustments at the half, and shut the Offense down in the 2nd half of the game.

Tennessee: 5th. Doesn't really count, but WTF.

New England: 9th. Again; doesn't count.

Carolina: 11th. No Count.

Buffalo: 12th. Interesting...

Miami: 18th.

New Orleans: 20th.

Atlanta: 22nd. Shits and giggles only; no count.

Cincinnati: 24th.

Oakland: 25th.

San Diego: 27th.

Denver: 28th.

If I'm wrong, and this scheme becomes the Holy of Holies; great. But until I see a 'W' against a top 10 defense, I will NOT be convinced.

I never said that. What I said, is that the running game in this scheme will fail miserably against an Elite Defense.

CarlSatan, do you really think the Chiefs had a power running game?

See my post above; I knew this was the "ace" everyone was going to attempt to pull.

See #57.

And I guess it was because of the offense that we lost to Indy in 2003? You're th type of guy who would claim a pitcher sucks if he had 1.50 ERA and had a losing record because of a league-worst offense. Your argument is a joke.

LMAO. This.

Hey wait one minute FringeNC, Didnt Herm say that we are losing games because of our circus offense as well? That we needed to control the clock and TOP?

The vikings would be worlds better if they had thigpen starting

Dude...

You're a ****ing idiot.

The offense we're running now is far better and much more effective than the offense that led us to the playoffs in 2006.

The Tampa Bay game he spent the majority of the first half behind center and we had three straight TD drives.

Good thing we have Tony then?

What the **** does a loss from 2003, with a completely different roster have to with this?

The argument is valid; run this Quasi-Spread against a Top 10, and SHOW ME THE ****ING WIN!!!
:cuss:

He most certainly did, and all the Herm lover's conveniently ignore that. This offense has only had success because we have scrapped Herm's power running bullshit, and started throwing the ball again.

And so ignoring it proves your point?!?!?

Gochiefs, you are such an idiot...ROFL

IF we had an average defense we wouldve won most of these games

well it's a good thing the Chiefs aren't going to Hawaii to play that pro bowl defense any time soon

but Hootie, you were so in love with that 2006 offense with Huard at the Helm..

Divorce can be a nasty thing, if you need to talk, I will listen...

This.

We went to the playoffs in 2006 with an offense half as effective as the one we've ran the last 6 weeks with Thigpen.

This offense has been playoff caliber lately...too bad we have NOTHING on defense.

Right now we just have to take improvment and player development despite certain members of our coaching staff...

It cant be judged on W's and L's when your HC is a proven loser over the course of his pathetic career...

Next year is more of the same as well. All we can hope for is that we have enough of a foundation from Mr Keen Eye for the next GM and staff to work with...

Are we all now going to start defending that article outlining putting LJ behind Tyler in a shotgun, that we were all TRASHING BEFORE?!?!?

Fickle. Will O' The Wisp. As The Wind Blows; these are but a few of the descriptives I can apply to certain members who have now turned a 180 on this.

Or do you just like arguing with me for shits and giggles?:rolleyes:

Supposed Thigpen was 30-40 for 375 yards and 4 TDs and 0 ints against a top 10 defense and we LOST

or Suppose Thigpen was 12-33 for 177 yards, 0 TDs and 3 ints and we WON because the other team had a bunch of fluked turnovers.

This is my last response to this idiocy. Everyone who watches football understands QBs can play well and lose and play poorly and win -- everyone but you evidently.

Jesus Christ...

I liked the Chiefs winning games...and we were better in 2006 with Huard than we were with Green...that was my point at the time...I don't know how people still don't realize this.

Huard is the best QB in the R2P2...that's not a compliment, it's just a fact. I never ONE TIME claimed Huard was a starting caliber QB with starting caliber QB qualities.

Get this team a premium O-Line, and I will be more than ready to buy in to the potential success of this system.