Don't Chiefs need a 2nd or 2 firsts for a successful 2009 draft?
 

Is just getting Curry and then waiting for our 2nd pick in the 3rd round sufficient for chiefs to be successful in the 2009 draft? I'm curious what others are thinking regarding the draft. Wouldn't trading our 3rd pick for more picks make more sense rather than pay Curry huge guarantee money. I won't be surprised if Pioli does this.

In pioli I trust.
Posted via Mobile Device

I mean trade our 1st round pick for at least a lower 1st and 2nd.

Just relax, Pioli's got the league lubed up and ready for draft day.

im guessing we will get a 2nd round pick some way or another....... piloli just might have to go bitch slap someone.......

If Matt Cassel leads this team to a couple of SB wins in the next ten years, then regardless of any other consideration, it will have been a successful draft.

I think we can have a successful draft without a 2nd Round pick.
It'd be nice to have one though.
Hopefully Pioli can deal on Draft day and get it back.

Big picture... We got Cassel for the #2.

Only the first day picks are any good...the rest of the rounds are worthless. Right? ;)


The more draft picks the better,IMO, assuming we evaluate the talent well and THAT is supposed to be Pioli's forte.

This.

People dont seem to understand that Cassel IS our 2nd round pick and likely will have more immediate impact than any 2nd rounder from the draft this year.

Cassel seems like he has the goods, but my other point is having to pay all that guarantee money to Curry who is an unproven player.

I like getting more picks and paying less guarantee money and getting more for our dollars and more picks.

I guess we have another option on draft day which is to trade LJ for picks.

It's going to be fun to watch what happens.

What makes you think we are getting Curry?

name me one rookie who is a proved player. Does that mean we shouldnt pay any rookies any guaranteed money? Thats not the way the NFL works.

For the first time in years and years I feel like KC is holding the cards and is in a position to be able to make/offer deals and have the advantage instead of the other way around.

If Cassel becomes KC's QBOTF and leads the team to some playoff wins and Curry becomes a pro bowl caliber LB then it is a successful draft/offseason.

You don't think he'll be available at the 3rd pick?

I agree no matter how the season ends I am so happy that we finally have a clean slate. No CP and no Herm is so awesome. I'm way patient for this franchise to develop. I think they will turn this around real fast. Looking forward to renewing my NFL Ticket for the first time since 2007! LMAO

I guess it depends how you look at it...

If the Chiefs use the first 2 rounds to add 1 starting QB, 1 Defensive Playmaker and another starting OLB to their roster, on paper, you'd have to at least consider that was successful by Chiefs standards. I mean, the 2nd could have gone to the next Jr Siavii.

Even if he is, what makes you 100% certain the Chiefs will select him? Has Pioli said he will pick him?

Brown is better.

I would have paid good money to see the look on your face as you typed this.

I can't tell what this Denver/Chicago trade has done for the stock of Sanchez and Stafford, but I get the feeling now that one of them is going #1.

So the real question is the stock price of our #3 pick, assuming the other QB is still there. And honestly, even if he isn't. Then we're talking about pick of the litter at LT. We're really in a badass position. At this point, I think taking Aaron Curry could be a mistake. We'd be smarter to draft Sanchez or Stafford ourselves, if for no other reason than trade value and potential. The #3 pick is going to make too much coin to waste on anything else.

So long story short, I think we'll trade down and gain picks doing it. That or another piece to the puzzle in a wild trade scenario.

I wonder if someone would trade up with us for a LT?

As much as I like Albert, I would take Ryan Clady and the 18th pick for our #3 in a heartbeat.

ROFL

Slowly put the crackpipe down.

He allowed .5 sacks last year and should have been in the pro-bowl. He was immediately one of the best LT's in the league. Having Albert as RG/LG or RT with Clady as the LT would make our O-line from below average to top 5.

We already have a dope LT, and even if Denver would trade him (never gonna happen) there's no way we'd entertain that trade.

So pretend that the offer came up and you where GM. What would you do?

I won't play pretend but i do think we need do draft a defensive line stud, preferably a DE.

If Pioli trades down a few spots, which i would expect actually. Then a DE and a OT.

But i also would not be surprised if they picked a WR.

Why in hell would Denver give up Clady? Who would be their left tackle, especially after trading their picks to get a QB?

There are no defensive line "studs", especially true defensive ends that we know of in this draft. No Bruce Smith, Julius Peppers, Mario Williams, etc.

The draft is absolutely loaded with high quality offensive lineman that would immediately upgrade the Chiefs line (maybe for a decade) but moving down a few spots would still be way, way, way too high for these guys.

DHB could be a possibility at #12-17 but the Chiefs would have to absolutely love him because he's a boom or bust guy.

well if you look at it, we have a starter at QB for a 2nd round pick that has only 1 year of wear and tear on him, unless you count practice. So I would say whoever we draft in the 1st/Cassell/3rd is looking to be a pretty good first day if you ask me.

I agree with the DE situation in this draft. Sad to say, even with this high a pick. I like B.J. Raji but he is a tackle. We need a rush to the QB.

And we need an o-line really bad. Pioli will trade down i think. Draft day will be so controversial around here thats for sure whatever we do.

And i can assure you that there is an 95% guarantee that Mecca won't like what the Chiefs organization does with the picks.

Thats pretty dumb. Clady was perfectly suited for Shanny's offense and most of it said so last year during the draft. Albert is a gifted tackle, we need to be a little patience and he will be the best in the league or close to it.

I dont think I ever said that they would give up Clady. I was hypothetically discussing Clady, refering to Claythans post. I know it will never happen. I was just thinking it would be pretty awesome if that deal did come up.

I would rather take Harvin in those spots than DHB.

There aren't many suitors that can trade up to the 3rd pick.

I say pick the best player available and work like hell to make a trade after you pick. Maybe someone will covet the pick they make.

draft curry then trade lj and waters for a 2nd

I stand by the notion that the #3 will be traded down to get more picks. I hear Denver wants Sanchez...

I'm sorry. I know people are getting tired of this argument. But this is a clear year when you're better off trading down and sacrificing some trade value than to adhere to the draft value chart.

I would trade down as far as maybe #10 in exchange for a 2nd round pick and some other low round pick, to hell with the fact that the draft chart says. In this draft, is there anyone that disagrees that a #10 and a #74 pick would be nicer than a #3 pick? With those two picks, you could easily get a linebacker like Maualuga (who I believe is a much better fit for the eventual 3-4 than Curry is) and probably Everett Brown or Raji (assuming his trade value doesn't decline majorly after his drug test). In the second round, you can grab one of the top centers or guards off the board.

LJ isn't worth anything. All he is is leftover baggage from the King Carl era. LJ will be cut if they win their case.

This is already a successful offseason - Herm and Carl are gone.

Agreed

Yep. + we got Vrabel as well.

This.

If Cassel plays well, that's a success in and of itself. No need to include Curry. :)

Trade down!

Ding Ding Ding

We have a winner!

There's a HUGE difference in sacrificing SOME value - which several of us have said they'll likely have to do - and just giving the pick away because you don't like the draft chart, as you've said in the past.

The scenario you're describing is giving the Niners the 3rd overall pick for less than .70 on the dollar.

You want an exchange rate like that, visit Canada.

Otherwise, this is a business. You're not going to get far giving away your commodities at a huge discount.

Okay, the Chiefs can have a good draft with the picks that they have. Now, the reality, is that the Chiefs first day of the draft will be rather boring if they don't trade down, or they may trade up from the third pick if something is sitting there that they want.

But, if they don't trade down, the first day of the draft will probably be pretty boring for Chiefs fans.

But, the actual quality of the draft? Not an issue with those picks. Heck, if they get a HOF player at #3, and then a starter in the third round... it is a successful draft.

I think we just need to keep in mind that we're still at least one year away from being a playoff contender. While there's a chance we could have a great turnaround like the '08 Dolphins, it just doesn't happen that often.

We got a potential franchise QB prospect with NFL experience and a solid veteran LB with our 2nd. Let's see anyone else do that good with their 2nd round pick.

My face rarely reflects my emotion.

I should have been a poker player.

Branden Albert is going to be a better LT than Clady.

He has all the same physical attributes that Clady does (Clady has slightly longer arms, Albert has slight quicker and more fluid feet), and has a stronger lower body, making him a more physical run blocker.

Going forward, Albert will be a top 3 LT in the NFL.

Exactly this. However, on the bright side, if all you're worried about are the Chiefs selections - then it frees up your saturday after about 30 minutes of waiting.

:D

I don't like the draft chart because I believe that value should reflect the strength of the draft board. I have never said you should completely throw away the draft chart. It's a good benchmark to use, but too many teams use it as an absolute. It should be used as a reference point, not as exact value. This year, the trade board is weak, so the draft value chart should adjust. Using your analogy, the exchange rate changes based on a lot of economic factors. So why is draft trade value the same ever year? Shouldn't trade value go down when, for example, you learn that Raji failed a drug test? Or Malcolm Jenkins bombed the combine? You're right. This is a business and negotiations change based on market conditions. If you don't believe that, ask yourself how much your house is worth versus five years ago. Or ask yourself how much your average laptop costs versus how much it costed five years ago. So as the draft "market" changes every year (and even every day), why does the draft value stay exactly the same? It doesn't make any sense to me.

Here's the situation the Chiefs are in. Nobody valued at #3 is worth taking. That would likely be Stafford, Sanchez, Jason Smith, and/or Eugene Monroe (I think Curry is a huge reach for a team trying to shift to a 3-4). So the Chiefs are in a situation where they are forced to take a guy valued at #3 who they don't want, or reach for a guy that's a middle-round prospect (Maualuga, Everett Brown, Aaron Maybin, Orakpo, Maclin, Andre Smith). The players the Chiefs should like are valued around the middle of the first round. So rather than reach, then why not trade down into those spots and recapture that second round pick you don't have? Who really cares if an extra third rounder or whatever isn't packaged in too? You're picking the guy you want (and not the guy you're forced to take) at the right spot without reaching, paying him the salary he deserves, and getting picks on the side. What's not to like?

Brandon Albert already IS a more-complete LT than Ryan Clady. He may not ever be truly BETTER since that is so subjective.

Ryan Clady is, and will always be, a finesse LT that's a better pass blocker than anything else. It will be interesting to see if McDaniels' offense helps him or hurts him, because Shanny's offense definitely helped him.

This would make me sick to my stomach. Trading our spot so a division opponent has an opportunity to draft a possible franchise QB. **** that I'd rather draft him and keep him or trade him to someone outside of the conference.

This!!

Amen! Brother Milk!!! And, just how many years have us Chief fans been waiting for a long term QB??? I go back to the Mike Livingston (sp?) ... it's been a while and to get the long term answer with a 2nd. pick is a real accomplishment. And, as you said, it doesn't matter how the rest of the draft turns out. It's worth giving up your whole draft for a Peyton, Brady, Elway, Farve, Montana!!!! You can build aroung a guy like that.

Yes! Plus, Vrabel will be a playing coach ... which adds further value to the #2 pick.

Is this a "let's pretend session?" First, Pioli will never ask; second, Denver will never trade him ... so, why not just dream about getting a whole new defensive line in with your trade/draft.

But, if Denver is willing to trade, why accept Clady ... I'd much rather have the #12 & the #18. That is the trade I'd like ... and I'm with those of you saying we don't have to have true value in the trade. This would be a successful trade/draft. But, I doubt Denver will give up that much to trade.

Don't misunderstand me here.

I don't believe that Matt Cassel is that guy, and I think it was a mistake to trade for him.

But I do allow for the possibility that I'm wrong.

If Matt Cassel does prove me wrong, then it will have been a good draft.

But remember, Mike Livingston looked like an NFL starter after the '69 season.

How'd that turn out?

I know this sounds crazy, but if the Chiefs get a strong enough feeling that the Broncos will trade up to take Sanchez, I wonder if they might consider drafting Sanchez and then attempting to trade him. It's not much different from a trade down. That way they hold all the cards.

I'm still not convinced that there's anybody worth a #3 pick for the Chiefs.

You are correct ... I remember the fans making reclamo (I think it was after 1969) about him replacing Dawson and no, it didn't turn out well. We'll have to wait and see how Cassel does.

Cassel ... What I have is "hope" ... not assurance he will become the franchise QB. But, with Pioli in charge, I'll give the team the benefit of the doubt and hope he continues to develop.

That's my feeling as well. I'm not one of those ... "don't draft that guy in that position because he doesn't have VALUE." It's stupid to pass on a guy who can do the job for the team, just because of someone's precieved "value."

For me the value is whether he plays his position up to expectations or not. If a player fills the bill for the team then he has value for them. i.e. the year Tom Brady was taken in the 6th. round, most would have said that is where his value was. (And, BTW ... it was a lucky break on N.E.'s part ... if they had really known how good he was they would have certainly taken him much higher.) But, knowing what we know now, where would you draft him. Of course at #1 ... but, many would scream, that's way too high for him. So, to me value has to do with how a player fits the team and how he performs.

I agree ... this year there is a lot of money involved at #3 to just take any player. So, a player taken needs to become a Ray Lewis/L.T, or Roaf, or Elway, etc. I don't see that player in this year’s draft. Therefore, I hope we can trade down and get almost the same LB as Curry (and in a lot of years the player that becomes the best at his position is taken way down the list) with a lot less cap space and get extra picks.

If we could (not sure there will be any takers for the #3) trade with the donks ... a #12 & #18 (I think those are correct???) would help us build our team, replace our 2nd. round pick, and relieve the cap space of a #3 pick. But, like you guys ... I don't want to help build their team for the long haul with a franchise QB. If there are no other trade partners, it might be best to just take Sanchez and either dangle him for trade bait or as an insurance policy for Cassel’s continued development (can trade later).

That being said, the best scenario would be for us to get the extra pick(s), they take Sanchez, for Mecca to be totally wrong about him, and at best he becomes a so-so QB. (I don’t think that will happen.)