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-   -   NFL Draft What about Derrick Morgan if Berry is gone? (https://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=221434)

kcbubb 01-09-2010 11:43 AM

What about Derrick Morgan if Berry is gone?
 
http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft...ory?id=4797424


One of the many memorable stories told in Paul "Dr. Z" Zimmerman's classic book, "The New Thinking Man's Guide to Pro Football," detailed the brief NFL career of collegiate high hurdles champion Harvey Nairn. Then-New York Jets coach Weeb Ewbank was constantly searching for fast players; when Nairn sprinted past All-Pro cornerback Lem Barney in a preseason game, Ewbank was so impressed with Nairn's potential that he kept the speedster around for three years despite the fact that he never caught a pass in a game.

The cautionary moral of the Nairn tale is that it pays to not get too caught up on a single performance when grading a player. I bring this up because after one game of the tape review of Georgia Tech defensive end Derrick Morgan (No. 5 on Scouts Inc.'s top 32 list and No. 8 on Mel Kiper's latest Big Board), I had thoughts of grading him above the phenom Ndamukong Suh.

That dominant game was the Sept. 10 contest against the Clemson Tigers. Morgan had seven splash plays (defined as when a defender negatively impacts a passing play) in a mere 25 pocket pass rush attempts and very nearly had two others.

Those are Suh-like numbers. Equally impressive was the wide variety of pass rush moves he used to get them. He alternated outside speed rushes with inside rip moves, sprinkled in a measure of bull and spin moves and used the wrist club and shoulder club with equal effectiveness. The mixing of moves at this level is so rare that I can think of only two NFL pass-rushers whose mastery would be equal to this (Jared Allen and Patrick Kerney).

Morgan also had a dominant showing against the run in that contest. Clemson knew better than to try to test him very often, so the Tigers directed only five running plays his way. Morgan won the point of attack (POA) block on four of those runs and the Tigers gained only five total yards.

Having a negative impact on 11 plays in one game is a pace that even the aforementioned Suh would have trouble keeping up with, but Morgan generally kept up a strong pace in the other five games of the study:

Miami Hurricanes: one POA win in seven runs, zero splash plays in 11 pocket pass attempts

North Carolina Tar Heels: zero POA wins in two runs, two splash plays in 17 pocket pass attempts

Florida State Seminoles: two POA wins in five runs, three splash plays in 18 pocket pass attempts

Georgia Bulldogs: five POA wins in 12 runs, two splash plays in nine pocket pass attempts

Clemson Tigers in the ACC championship game: three POA wins in 10 runs, one splash play in 13 pocket pass attempts

Add them up; it equals 11 POA wins in 36 POA attempts and eight splash plays in 68 pocket pass attempts. It's not quite to the initial Clemson game level but it is the second-best performance level I have seen in this year's Draft Lab breakdowns (behind only Suh).

That would seem to make Morgan a slam dunk top-five pick, but there were a couple of negatives of note.

First among the drawbacks: Whenever Morgan failed to win a block directed at his point of attack, the ball carrier often gained a lot of yards. There were 15 runs that gained at least five yards; six of those went for 14 or more yards. To put it another way, opposing runners gained 221 yards on the 25 runs where Morgan didn't win a POA block. A lot of this is due to Morgan's zealousness to get upfield and that is something he will have to improve upon at the next level.

Another potential area of improvement is endurance. Morgan was on the field for 299 of the 356 plays in these six games, or 84 percent of the time. That is a quality figure -- but Morgan did seem to have some issues during the Miami game. He was on the field for only 17 of the 27 passing plays and only 25 of the 36 rushing plays in that contest. Those numbers are a bit troubling and the negative feeling was amplified when the camera did a sideline pan of Morgan that showed he was having trouble catching his breath on numerous occasions. That may have been only a one-time issue, but it is something that any NFL team considering drafting him should at least do due diligence on before completely signing off on selecting him.

The Football Scientist Lab Result: Ndamukong Suh is probably the best collegiate defensive line prospect to come along in a generation -- and, for a time, Morgan's tape review had him keeping up with Suh. The two areas of concern are relatively minor in comparison with Morgan's upside, so he easily gets a TFS seal of approval.

K.C. Joyner, aka The Football Scientist, is a regular contributor to ESPN Insider. His Countdown Daily by IBM weekly video matchups can be found every Tuesday here. He also can be found on Twitter (@kcjoynertfs) and at his Web site.

CaliforniaChief 01-09-2010 11:44 AM

Ricky Stanzi outran him for 10 yards. No thanks.

DumbHillbillies 01-09-2010 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaliforniaChief (Post 6426257)
Ricky Stanzi outran him for 10 yards. No thanks.

This. I was watching him closely partly because of the thread I started below. If he can't catch stanzi he is going to lose out on a lot of sacks in the league.

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=220735

Mr. Laz 01-09-2010 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kcbubb (Post 6426254)
I had thoughts of grading him above the phenom Ndamukong Suh.

wow

BossChief 01-09-2010 11:58 AM

dumbassery is at an all time high!

Mr. Laz 01-09-2010 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 6426278)
dumbassery is at an all time high!

completely unnecessary

don't be like mecca

RustShack 01-09-2010 12:07 PM

You know we run a 3-4 defense right? Dumbass.

KCrockaholic 01-09-2010 12:08 PM

No and F-NO.

Mr. Flopnuts 01-09-2010 12:10 PM

He has stepped down as the leader of the BAU.............

BossChief 01-09-2010 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laz (Post 6426283)
completely unnecessary

don't be like mecca

dont do that laz

This place is not the Coalition. If you come to the party with dumbassery, you shall get pelted with the stones of foolishness. Dumbassery is not encouraged like on other boards, here. If he doesn't get drastic responses when he suggests foolish things, how is he supposed to know exactly how foolish they are?

Seriously, do you think that Derrick Morgan is a candidate for the #5 overall pick? Even a speck of a chance? **** NO!

This guy said he thinks Morgan is better than SUH!

SUH Laz, SUH.

:eek:

If I said that, I would expect to be clowned too.

Mr. Laz 01-09-2010 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 6426318)
dont do that laz

This place is not the Coalition. If you come to the party with dumbassery, you shall get pelted with the stones of foolishness. Dumbassery is not encouraged like on other boards, here. If he doesn't get drastic responses when he suggests foolish things, how is he supposed to know exactly how foolish they are?

Seriously, do you think that Derrick Morgan is a candidate for the #5 overall pick? Even a speck of a chance? **** NO!

This guy said he thinks Morgan is better than SUH!

SUH Laz, SUH.

:eek:

If I said that, I would expect to be clowned too.

yea ... i'm sorry for wanting to try a get people to be a little civil.


how silly of me

Reaper16 01-09-2010 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laz (Post 6426339)
yea ... i'm sorry for wanting to try a get people to be a little civil.


how silly of me

Yes, very silly. This is an internet forum. Civility is pretty much out of the question from the get-go.

salame 01-09-2010 12:57 PM

http://www.profile-comments.com/imag...ead-is-gay.jpg

Misplaced_Chiefs_Fan 01-09-2010 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reaper16 (Post 6426408)
Yes, very silly. This is an internet forum. Civility is pretty much out of the question from the get-go.

Odd, it didn't used to be.

Guess I'm showing my age again.

:shake:

teedubya 01-09-2010 01:24 PM

****ing n00b BossChief is an idiot.

Touchdown Bowe 01-09-2010 01:25 PM

Are there any 5 techs worth looking at at #5 this year?

RJ 01-09-2010 01:54 PM

I thought the article was interesting. Guess that shows what a dumbass douchebag I am. Thanks for posting, kcbub.

kcbubb 01-13-2010 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RustShack (Post 6426296)
You know we run a 3-4 defense right? Dumbass.

You do realize that I didn't write the article... right? KC Joyner did. Supposedly an espn insider. I have never really watched Morgan play. I was asking for opinions bc he is ranked in the top 10 by a few different "draft experts".

And supposedly, Morgan is projected to play outside in the 3-4.

Mecca 01-13-2010 10:49 PM

If you play Morgan standing up, you're asking for a disaster, the guy isn't super athletic. He's very good end and all but I don't think he translates there at all.

milkman 01-13-2010 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laz (Post 6426339)
yea ... i'm sorry for wanting to try a get people to be a little civil.


how silly of me

You know Laz, I used to be civil, hell almost even nice, but the constant bombardment of dumbassery just tore away the veil of civility.

The constant barage of dumbassery around here needs to be verbally bitch slapped.

Mecca 01-13-2010 11:04 PM

If someone repeatedly says dumb shit why should you be civil with them?

DeezNutz 01-13-2010 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkman (Post 6443408)
You know Laz, I used to be civil, hell almost even nice,

Damn. I'm glad I never knew this useless pussy. :D

Mr. Laz 01-13-2010 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkman (Post 6443408)
The constant barage of dumbassery around here needs to be verbally bitch slapped.

yea, but i don't see this thread as being dumbassery.

well at least it's harmless dumbassery, he just brought up a name. :shrug:


just disagree and move on ... it's not like he started screaming about something.


we need more "agree to disagree" without the drama imo.

milkman 01-13-2010 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laz (Post 6443424)
yea, but i don't see this thread as being dumbassery.

well at least it's harmless dumbassery, he just brought up a name. :shrug:


just disagree and move on ... it's not like he started screaming about something.


we need more "agree to disagree" without the drama imo.

While I agree to some extent, I think this is a reaction to the poster who has something of a history of dumbassery.

Mr. Laz 01-13-2010 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkman (Post 6443437)
While I agree to some extent, I think this is a reaction to the poster who has something of a history of dumbassery.

ahh ... i guess i just haven't paid attention to the history.

BossChief 01-14-2010 01:22 AM

Was my post really all that offensive?

Really?

I didnt say I hope the guys kids die in a aids tree or some other things I have read here. I simply stated that dumbassery is at an all time high if anyone thinks that Derrick Morgan is a better prospect than Suh.

I thought I went "hater light" on my response...

TigerPig 01-14-2010 01:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca (Post 6443372)
If you play Morgan standing up, you're asking for a disaster, the guy isn't super athletic. He's very good end and all but I don't think he translates there at all.

Tebow with the fifth pick to play outside in the 3-4... Write it up!

Titty Meat 01-14-2010 01:58 AM

Laz bitching again? No way.

milkman 01-14-2010 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 6443735)
Was my post really all that offensive?

Really?

I didnt say I hope the guys kids die in a aids tree or some other things I have read here. I simply stated that dumbassery is at an all time high if anyone thinks that Derrick Morgan is a better prospect than Suh.

I thought I went "hater light" on my response...

Never go "hater light".

Either go all in, or shut the **** up.

Chiefnj2 01-14-2010 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 6426318)
dont do that laz

This place is not the Coalition. If you come to the party with dumbassery, you shall get pelted with the stones of foolishness. Dumbassery is not encouraged like on other boards, here. If he doesn't get drastic responses when he suggests foolish things, how is he supposed to know exactly how foolish they are?

Seriously, do you think that Derrick Morgan is a candidate for the #5 overall pick? Even a speck of a chance? **** NO!

This guy said he thinks Morgan is better than SUH!

SUH Laz, SUH.

:eek:

If I said that, I would expect to be clowned too.

Someone posts an article with detailed information and your only response is "dumbassery". How about something substantive? How about your analysis of the kid from watching a game? That's what I thought, you've got nothing.

BossChief 01-15-2010 12:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2 (Post 6446463)
Someone posts an article with detailed information and your only response is "dumbassery". How about something substantive? How about your analysis of the kid from watching a game? That's what I thought, you've got nothing.

Some things shouldnt need spelled out.

If I come here and post that 3+2=6, I expect for someone to call me an idiot.

That is what this emplied.

FTR you can read plenty of my thoughts on both players from the game thread and after game thread....you know, the Orange bowl when Bulaga owned him all game long singlehandedly when BB is no better than a 10-15 prospect and Suh is likely the first pick overall, do you get that? ...I understand why some of the guys are the way they are.

I live about 25 minutes from Kinnick stadium BTW.

Sweet Dick Willy 01-15-2010 03:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkman (Post 6446376)
Never go "hater light".

Either go all in, or shut the **** up.

(America) **** YEAH!

HMc 01-15-2010 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 6446657)

If I come here and post that 3+2=6, I expect for someone to call me an idiot.

That is what this emplied.

You idiot.

BossChief 01-15-2010 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HMc (Post 6446843)
You idiot.

THERE WE GO!

I'm glad someone here is on their toes!

Have some rep!

Pussy!

tyton75 01-15-2010 06:52 AM

You guys really need to get laid

JD10367 01-15-2010 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Flopnuts (Post 6426306)
He has stepped down as the leader of the BAU.............

Yeah, but he's in good shape and could probably play DE very well.

And, besides, he's eye candy!

http://blogs.bet.com/entertainment/w...8/shemar_0.jpg

Chiefnj2 01-15-2010 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 6446657)
Some things shouldnt need spelled out.

If I come here and post that 3+2=6, I expect for someone to call me an idiot.

That is what this emplied.

FTR you can read plenty of my thoughts on both players from the game thread and after game thread....you know, the Orange bowl when Bulaga owned him all game long singlehandedly when BB is no better than a 10-15 prospect and Suh is likely the first pick overall, do you get that? ...I understand why some of the guys are the way they are.

I live about 25 minutes from Kinnick stadium BTW.

You still didn't contradict a single point in the article. The article talked about big plays made by Morgan in several regular season games, including a huge game against Clemson early in the year. If you weren't impressed by the guy in the bowl game, then fine, say so. But just saying "dumbass" lends nothing to intelligent conversation. And, remember that one poor game doesn't mean anything. If it did Jake Long would be horrible, Gholston would be great, Clady would suck because he got beaten in the Hawaii game and Berry wouldn't be a top 5 pick because he didn't really stand out in his bowl game either.

Sully 01-15-2010 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Flopnuts (Post 6426306)
He has stepped down as the leader of the BAU.............

I keep waiting for him to pity eff Garcia.

JD10367 01-15-2010 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sully (Post 6447011)
I keep waiting for him to pity eff Garcia.

Computer nerds are like mopeds: they're fun to ride, as long as your coworkers don't see you on one. :shrug:


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