QBs other than Luck
 

In the event the Sea Hawks suckitude exceeds that of the Chiefs:

I'm adding Griffin the hottest QB in the nation right now (9/26/11). The kid has more TD passes than incompletions.

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Nick Foles
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Matt Barkley
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Landry Jones
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Ryan Lindley
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Brandon Weeden
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People seem to forget that Kellen Moore of Boise State is out there as well. Moore might be the most polished of all of them. Great pocker presence, excellent touch, goes through progressions effortlessly. Problem is, he isn't 6'4", 230 lbs.

He's a Brees/Montana type of guy that, if given the chance, has all the intangibles other than the physical stature to succeed in the league.

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Nobody has forgotten a thing. We just know Moore doesn't have a place in the NFL as a starting QB.

Thanks for adding that remarkable analytical insight Amazing Kreskin.

Who is this "we?" Your 13 other personalities that also don't know a ****ing thing about football?

This is rich coming from the dude saying he's a "Brees/Montana type." He has yet to even exit college, so trying to put him in a category with 2 of the greatest QB's in the game is beyond reeruned.

He's a frail midget with below average arm strength that will be legally murdered on the field when a 330+ lb. NT slams into him.

Judging by your posting history, you wouldn't be able to figure out how to make a decent mock even if the ghost of Bill Walsh was feeding you info.

Watch that video. He throws off his backfoot WAY to much.

Well calling him a Colt McCoy type wouldn't allow him to talk down on people that don't see Moore as an elite prospect.

It's important to remember who you're talking to - Sacoshit is worthless.

Lindley looks horrible in that video

He looks better against Utah, 2nd group.

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Watching the video for Nick Foles, Does he make any passes that are not in a shotgun formation?

Arizona runs a spread offense.....with a lot of bubble screens.

do you know about that
 

anyone know about that something else ?

Post of the ****ing year here folks

It's like a prophet came down from the heavens to grace this sacred land with bits of scribe.

I'm already preparing for a 3 win season and a top 3 pick so I'm watching Jones/Barkley. Any other QB on that list taken in the top 3 would be pure disappointment.

Another day later and I'm still completely in awe of this post.

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We had Foles v. Ok. State in 2011. Now here is Tannehill:

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Jones is my choice.

Barkley throws off his back foot too much for my liking.

The rest I don't even care about because I want a 1st round QB and not a best of the rest.

Barkley looked exactly like Cassel in this film, and it wasn't just because he was wearing number 7.

He responds to pressure the same; he makes the same mental mistakes, and I don't think he has an NFL arm.

Probably not a first round prospect, but he kind of has the "it" factor - Chandler Harnish

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Kiper's board has Luck #1, Jones #4, Barkley #10 with RG3 somewhere mid-late first.

Now that Luck is out of the picture, put me on the RG3 bandwagon.

We all know his skills he brings to the table. Seems to have a good head on his shoulders also.

I like this kid.

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Finally I hear a projection on RG3. Previously I had no idea where he was going.

I was on the Suck for Luck bandwagon. Since that is dead & buried, this is more enjoyable.

We need to win to fall in RG3's range to get him. :thumb:

I wouldn't be shocked if hes there in the 2nd if we really wanted him.

I can only see 3 teams as a lock for drafting a QB in the first. Miami, Seattle and Denver.

Now if the Colts or Vikings get the #1 pick then that changes things up a bit because I can see them taking Luck and then those other teams picking their favorite QB amongst Barkley, Jones, and RG3. If the Rams get the #1 pick it wont change much because they will either trade the pick to either Miami, Seattle, or Denver or they will trade Bradford to them.

Same here. Jones and Foles both seem a bit system dependant to me. RGiii has a great background. I'm not much for running QB's, but the more I read, the more I like him.

He comes from a military family, both parents are career Air Force. Born in Japan, they moved back to the US and settled in Texas. RGiii graduated highschool early, 5th in his class. At 17, he then started college early, has since graduated, and is now working on his Masters degree. Add that to the extensive playing experience he has and taking the leadership role of starting QB of that team at such a young age. He has a very very strong arm, Vick like, is very accurate, and makes good decisions.

To me, his only red flag is the fact that he's running QB, which I usually don't like. This guy though, has a good head on his shoulders and should be smart enough not to run too much, or depend on his athleticism so much that he neglects to learn his job ala Vick.

I'm all for him. If it ain't a QB in round 1, NT, ILB, and OL would be the only real justifiable pickups. I'd still be pissed though. This team needs a QB WAY too much.

From what I've seen of RGIII he is always looking downfield after breaking the pocket before electing to run. I think this kid has the goods. I wish I could see more snaps where he has to go through progressions and read defenses however.

I think he's much more of a passer than you give him credit for. He's very accurate and has a lively arm.

The big red flag for me is the system he's in. I hate it from a developmental standpoint but I suppose that's the norm now a days. They run a bunch of spread, quick hitter, hitch routes as he picks the open guy 7-8 yards sitting down in the zone.

At least he's very consistent in hitting them and gets a lot of practice throwing the ball. Completes around 80%

<----------

All of those quick hitters pad that completion %. He has good touch on his medium-deep throws which makes for a very catchable ball but when he has to put a little mustard on them they start going wild. When he runs he carries the ball so loosely that hes a turnover waiting to happen. That shit aint gonna fly in the NFL.

He's fun to watch in college because hes a play maker, but I don't see NFL franchise when I watch him play.

Though, If the big 3 are all gone, and Pioli wants to take a stab on the guy based on his athleticism and smarts I wouldn't hate it. But I don't think I'd draft him before #15.

Yea, I'm not salivating over his completion percentage. I'm looking at the fact that the dude throws accurately all over the field and has a cannon. He might need a couple years to adjust to the NFL and learn a real system, but he will be worth it, imo.

As to the ongoing discussion of college QB's "padding" their stats with short completions - they all do it. Luck, Foles, Jones, Griffin, etc. All of them take the underneath passes if that is what the D is giving them.

FWIW, Barkley plays tonight on ESPN.

Saturday at noon you can watch Griffin go up against Tannehill at noon on FX.

In the evening you can watch Luck and Jones carve up two horrible defenses and pad their stats even further.

hahahahahahaha ROFL

Take this for what it's worth from a Mel Kiper chat yesterday.


Jim (Minnesota)
What is keeping Matt Barkley from being a top 5 pick?

Mel Kiper (1:03 PM)
First of all, he doesn't have elite skills. He doesn't have the big time arm strength. He doesn't have the wow you over ability. He's a traditional pro style pocket passer. He can throw on the move. But he's not a scrambler. He won't wow you over. He's not 6-4. Elite skills is what he's lacking. But he's a good QB. He'll be a mid first rounder.

also later on....


danilo (boston)
Mel, do you see Landry Jones as a top 10 pick? When I watch him he doesn't seem to go through progressions and looks flustered when pressure is in his face.

Mel Kiper (1:12 PM)
Yeah, I do. I think he goes in the top 10. I have him No. 4 overall on the Big Board right now. He's a junior right now and he has some options. Jones won't be the No. 1 pick and he knows that. If he wants to be the No. 1 pick, he goes back to Oklahoma for another year. Robert Griffin III at Baylor debuts at 19 on my Big Board this year and he could go back again.

The fact that he made it his first post ever on the Planet makes it all the better. I know I'm a "newbie" here, but holy crap... First impressions are the one's that stick...

... back to pondering what the hell that "something else" is exactly...

How would you rank the top 5 qb's in regards to strongest arm...or most accurate deep ball, I guess.

I am going to assume that something else is code for he has herpes in the ear.

Watched a part of last night's USC game and just rewatched the clip of Matt Barkley above.

Yeah think I see what Mel Kiper says in that his tools are just average. Not elite.

I've seen so much of RG3 this year, seeing one of his competitors was a little shocking. Matt flat out doesn't have the tools RG3 has.

After going through Trent Green (who was a good QB but didn't wow you with his throws) and Matt "noodle arm" Cassel, it would be nice to for once have a QB that scared the D a little knowing they have to defend every part of the field.

RG3 is going to make defenses respect the pass about as much as Barkley. The only difference is that they will also have to defend him running.

You are getting carried away with the numbers. Barkley plays in a pro style offense, RG3 plays in a spread. RG3 isn't going to turn the Chiefs into a down field threat. He, too, doesnt have that cannon for an arm.

People were getting all wet over Collin Kaepernick last year. He has that cannon for an arm. Where is he now? Backing up Alex Smith in SF because he's an awful NFL QB. Now, I'm not saying that RG3 is Kaepernick, I'm saying ignore the numbers.

Right. I'm not focusing on the numbers. I've pointed out in the past the 80% completion percentage because I was trying to point out that this isn't just another scrambling QB who can't pass. I think clearly he can.

But I'm not getting too caught up in that number. Ultimately #s in college doesn't mean much. See Colt Brennan.

I'm talking pure tools. I think when you compare the two, Barkley & RG3, I think it's hands down RG3. Not saying RG3 has a cannon. But it appears to be plenty strong from what I see. Barkley is projected to be a mid 1st right now while RG3 is mid 1st at very best. Probably late and possibly 2nd. For my money? I'll take RG3 over Barkley right now.

I wasn't big on the Kaepernick bandwagon but I'll say this. I think to say he's back up Alex Smith in SF because he's an awful NFL QB is pretty short sighted.

He's a 2nd round pick rookie coming from a spread offense. You can't call him awful because he doesn't have that job yet. You have to give him time.

And I wouldn't expect RG3 to be the day 1 starter for us next year if we were to draft him. He's going to need a little time to learn the NFL game.

RGIII has a better arm than Barkley from where I am sitting. He consistently puts better velocity on his passes.

I agree. I don't see a weak arm from Griffin.

I also think it's asinine to write off Kaepernick at this point.

Kaepernick is not starting because they don't need him to start right now.

The SF starting job was up for grabs before the season started. They drafted a QB because they needed one. Alex Smith won it because he is hands down a better NFL QB. He's always had talent but people never gave him a chance behind one of the worst offensive lines throughout his career and a different OC every single year. The guy just put up the single best game of the year in the QBR with a 98.2 against Tampa. If Kaepernick ever takes a snap as a starting NFL QB, outside of some injury to the #1, I'll be shocked.

Kapernick is not starting because he was nowhere near ready to start. Alex Smith play just made sitting Kapernick on the bench until he's ready an easier decision.

I got a few opportunities to see him play in the preseason. Saw some good things from him, but he clearly wasn't used to the NFL speed yet.

Which is why I believe KC will stay with the status quo and develop Stanzi as the starter since Zorn is on the coaching staff. If the Chiefs don't make play on Luck with selling their soul to get him
( a shitload of picks this season and the next after that.)

Just watched RG3 today, live instead of youtube vs' clips.

Trying to figure out where his "zip on the ball" is. I don't see any more velocity on RG3's passes than the ones Barkley throws and Barkley throws off balance A LOT. I will say that RG3's deep ball is a lot better than Barkley's though. I'd probably draft RG3 before I drafted Barkley. His footwork in the pocket is better, imo, he can extend a play and his deep ball is a lot better. I'm still not really sold on either and Luck/Jones are way better, imo.

JD proved again in this thread the same thing he proves every time he talks about QB's, he doesn't know what he's talking about.

Well nobody is disputing that Luck is way better. That's obvious. But Luck isn't an option for us.

As for Jones? By projections, he probably should be better too considering he'll be top 10. It's probably just me but I'm skeptical about mostly every OU QB. They all look great being surrounded by elite talent and they all do nothing in the pros. Maybe Jones will be the first.

Perhaps we have a chance to draft Jones (not sure how I feel about that) and perhaps we don't. But we know will have a shot at Barkley or RG3 if we want. And if it's between those two? I'll take RG3.

Why don't you tell me what I missed then, wizard of QB knowledge. Must be easy to look smart without actually saying anything.

Where do you guys see Russell Wilson going? The only game I saw was him absolutely abusing Nebraska.

Does he have the goods?

I watched that game. He's a really good college player.

Problem is that he's 5'11. I think a Seneca Wallace is about the best you can hope for.

Right or wrong, he won't ever be considering starting material by NFL standards.

This thread can be capped in a few words.

QB's other than Luck? Well in my opinion there are none. When you have a chance to get a once ina lifetime prospect like Luck....go all in. Give whoever whatever to get that pick.

Not much you can do if that team picking first has it made up in their mind to take Luck & have him QB their team for the next 15 years.

I think it's really as simple as this. Luck is going #1 and that team is not going to trade away his rights.

Might as well let that dream die.

I think you are right, however depending on the team it could be different. I'm not sold the Panthers or Rams would for sure draft him. THey would def listen to offers.

I still think the Colts would have to consider trading it.

Hypothetical:
Draft Order
1 Colts
2 Broncos
3 Chiefs

Chiefs offer #3 and Bowe to swap picks with Colts.

1. Chiefs (thru Colts) Luck
2. Broncos ?????
3. Colts (thru Chiefs) Matt Kalil

Colts wind up with Kalil and Bowe to help manning out, we end up with luck.

Ya because Bowe would definitely make the difference.

Manning turns every receiver he gets into a pro bowler.

Can we please stop talking about Luck in a thread dedicated to QB's other than Luck. Nevermind the fact that we aren't getting Luck.

Why exactly would the Colts want Bowe? I think they're good on the WR front...

Why wouldn't the Colts want another 15 straight years of winning? Think they'll say, I "Nope, we're good, we had our success. When Peyton retires, we'll just go back to years of mediocrity, it's cool".

The only team who would consider trading the pick is the Rams. The Panthers WILL NOT get that pick.

Imagine what Manning could do with a receiver who could actually run after the catch rather than fall down. Yea, Pierre Garcon is good. But Reggie Wayne is old and Austin Collie is nothing without Manning. Bowe would be a monster in Indy.

I just can't see this. Peyton Manning is nearing the end of his career and he's out this year with a neck injury.

Soot I'm not sure they're not taking specifically to get Luck.

I think there's a 0% chance they deal Luck should the Colts get #1. Zero.


They'd sit Luck for a year or move Peyton. Hey if Joe Montana can end up somewhere else at the end of his career, anybody can.

Sorry Nightfyre, you're delusional. There's no guarantee that Manning won't take a hit on that neck of his and be done for good next year. No guarantee how long he's got left. The Colts will NOT pass up an opportunity for greatness for another decade and a half. They more than any other franchise understand the importance of the QB under center. Without Peyton, they are nothing. They will not mortage out the next 15 yrs. of their franchise for a shot in the next few. Incredibly short sighted and that's not the way the Colt do business.

Manning is done. He's old and is coming off multiple neck surgeries. He's rich and smart enough to know that he doesn't want to spend the next 40 years of his life with some debilitating neck condition where he is getting surgery every 5 years.

This weekend will be a fun game to watch with Baylor going against Ok State. Griffin v. Weeden. I know it's a gimmick type offense and he's a few years older, but Weeden has looked good this year.

There are at least 2 QB's we can scratch off the watch list now. Luck and Jones.

Looking at a 5+ win season now and around a #10 pick.

I'm starting to look at 2nd round QB's like Tannehill/Foles, hell... even RG3 might make it into the 2nd round. And picking Brewster/Ta'amu in the first. I wouldn't mind Burfict either but I'd rather see the C/NT position locked up.

Let me dream goddammit.

I wish I could...I wish, I could.

Why does everyone have a problem with Hudson at Center?

are you ****ing drunk or something?

Look at our schedule.

SD @ KC MNF
MIA @ KC
DEN @ KC
KC @ NE
PITT @ KC
KC @ CHI
KC @ NYJ
GB @ KC
OAK @ KC
KC @ DEN

You only think we are gonna win around 2 more games?

ROFL

ROFL

... Name the games you can sit here and say we will absolutely win. I can see 2. MIA and 1 against DEN. It's pretty rare to sweep a team, especially when you aren't a championship caliber team. And I don't see us beating NE, PITT, CHI, NYJ, or GB. Yes, some of those teams don't look as scary as they did last year but they still are playoff caliber teams.

SD @ KC MNF.....Win. Rivers has something wrong with his arm and they have injuries everywhere

MIA @ KC.....they don't have3 an answer to a lot of our weapons and it should be an easy win.

DEN @ KC...we usually win home games in this series and Tebow is playing

KC @ NE...we probably have a better defense, but I don't think we have enough to slow down Brady. This is a HUGE game for Cassel because we should be right in the thick of things (in terms of division lead) and I'm sure Cassel will be trying to have his best game as a pro.

PITT @ KC...I don't think we win this game, but I didn't think we would win our meeting in 09, either.

KC @ CHI...Our pass rush should be able to pressure Cutler and I think we match up well with them in a lot more categories.

KC @ NYJ...This is gonna be a damn good game with lots of CP traffic.

GB @ KC...Minnesota played them close...?

OAK @ KC....28-0 and at home

KC @ DEN....could have playoff implications and we should be on the top of our game.

...

If we only win 2 of those games...lots of people need replaced.

I think we win 6 of those games (the highlighted ones) and go 9-7.

Ultimate homer.

I agree with him. We have a great chance to win every one of these next three games, and a real chance to sweep Denver and unless the Raiders get some real ****ing QB play, them too. I also don't think we go winless in that 5 game stretch from hell. Best chances against Jets and Bears.

I agree with most of this. I think we can beat the Steelers, however. Our defense definitely trumps their offense at this point anyway, IMO. We also match up well against the pats, I think. We have a decent rushing attack and they will have difficulty stopping that. We also have a good enough pass defense to slow them down.

If this team plays to it's ability, and Cassel's lack thereof doesn't screw it up, we have a fighting chance against most teams in the league. Pretty cool considering no Charles, Berry, or Moeaki.

that's right
 

here is all right !

Barkley plays in 10 minutes on ESPN v. Colorado. Colorado has an atrocious pass D so he should look pretty good.

Was watching the USC game. I don't think Barkley will go back next year. What would be the point. Try and win a National Champ or the Heisman I guess. However now tha the rookie scale is in effect being the number 1 overall pick isn't as lucrative.

IMO Barkley is sitting in the perfect position right now. He could go into the draft and be drafted in the mid first or something by a team that isn't shitty like the overall first pick.

If he keeps playing like he has been then he's going to be a top 3 pick. I can't see him falling that far.

He was very impressive last night. Granted, it was Colorado but he still made a lot of great throws.

Barkley doesn't have a great showing in big games. This years Stanford game being the exception.

I want to see him play big in more big games.

Sent from my ADR6350