Xs and Os: The Denver Pick Plays
 

http://www.foxsportssouthwest.com/nf...blockID=949223

Very interesting read...long but interesting

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We now have the blueprint.

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Denver seems to be pushing the rules to the extreme and the league appears to be allowing it. As the article notes, other teams getting away with this is a big ? but Manning is obviously going to be allowed to do so.

Why do you hate teamwork?

The Chiefs should start incorporating these plays into their offense.

I mean, hell, if they're not going to call it, then might as well take advantage of it.

If they start calling it on KC, the they'll have to start calling it on Denver too. What have we got to lose??


"If you ain't cheatin, then you ain't tryin."

Not sure I would use Dallas's defense as the blueprint on how to beat Denver.

If I remember correctly, didn't Chiefs get called for this about three times in one game? I guess they aren't as sneaky smooth as the Donkeys.

Yep. But this is now the bread and butter of the Manning offense so now it's okay....I guess

Last .gif, bottom of the screen is obvious and unapologetic pick.

Why do you love cheating?

The only way they get open.

Nah, it's just a set of complimentary routes.

Hardly.....

That just happen to run receivers into direct contact with a neutral defender and impede their path to the play before the ball is thrown.

They aren't making contact, and it's not the receiver's fault when the cover guy guesses wrong.

Actually in some instances they are making contact but not enough so it's considered "incidental"

Give me a ****ing break dude. Do you even watch the games? They are making tons of contact. When a ****ing linebacker has to do a swim move on a receiver to get around him...that's the result of an illegal pick play.

Yeah, I meant meaningful contact.

So decker never made contact with the browns defender in a previous gif shown?

This is from another article...

3. Defending the “pick” play: Two thoughts behind this. If you are going to play from an off-man position (like we see from the Texans), the CB has to take an angle to the receiver that will allow him to make a play on ball. On the replay, the CB takes a flat angle—and that isn’t the proper technique. Instead, take an angle that puts you in a position to play the “up field” shoulder of the WR. However, from my perspective, there is no need to play off-man coverage inside of the 10-yard line—because there are too many opportunities to get beat. Align in a press-man look and attack the WR. Disrupt his release and force the “pick” to come right through you—which should draw a flag. Bottom line: don’t give the WR room to breathe inside of the 10-yard line and play physical when Cover 0 is called in the huddle.

Teams are trying to do this, but the officials aren't calling it.

You mean that last gif where the LB doesn't adjust to our TE and gets caught in the middle of the field because the D set up wrong? Not our fault, dude. Make that decision before the snap or climb uphill with everybody watching.

are you NEW to every thing?

WE ARE THE CHIEFS
WE DO NOT GET CALLS


denver could set up a minefield, and a machine gun nest and it would be legal
you every watched line play?


****in' n00b

They are having the pick guys turn around like they are expecting a pass which is pure bullshit. Look, this is more on the league than it is on Denver. However, as was stated before, we got called 3 times in 1 game last year for this shit and suddenly now it's okay as long as it's Manning.

I would be interested to see other teams do this and see how it gets called.

Denver should take advantage of however the refs are calling every single game they play. The refs tend to suck, they are far from consistent on pass interference (O or D) and this is legal. They'd be stupid not to do it.

I agree that there is plenty of misalignment going on in those gifs, but I'm not referring specifically to those gifs. Eric Decker today, on several plays, completely blocked a guy before the ball left Manning's hands. Welker too. The screen play to Demaryius Thomas was an obvious one. 2 defenders were engaged by blockers before the pass had been thrown. Jim Nance mentioned something like "Welker did a great job of timing his block just as Manning threw it" but that was bullshit. It was early.

I know we'll see it next week and I know it'll piss me off. I do feel confident though that our secondary is athletic and physical enough to counter it and probably make it work in our favor. Those wheel routes are the ones that Peyton has been picked on...and it's happened because he expects the pick to open the receiver up...when the corner or safety takes a good route to the ball and isn't knocked off his path by one of the other receivers, they're in a prime position to undercut the route and snatch the ball.

Not to mention Chris Clark had a blatant hold on a guy in that play. He practically tried to tackle the defender

There's a difference between an illegal pick-play and designed rub routes versus man coverage. These are the reasons why bunch formations even exist. It's only illegal if the receivers are actively blocking/knocking people over before the ball is in the air. Lern2football noobs.

And if he hesitates because of the coverage, then he'll be saying "Hello" to Misters Hali, Houston and Poe.

I didn't get to watch the entire game, and I was distracted when I did get to watch. I'm not saying it didn't happen. Just that I didn't see it. There is a lot of physical contact going on near the LOS though. Guys on D are trying to knock our guys off of routes, and we're trying to set them up to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. It wouldn't surprise me if Decker got his hands on a guy and started blocking too early.

Learn to watch the Denver offense. What you just described as being illegal is exactly what's happening. Truth be told, I don't give a shit either way. If Manning is on his ass, then it's tough to throw the football to a wide open receiver.

The hold was 5-10 yards downfield

lol not at all. You're exaggerating at best, refs would never flag that unless the receivers are blatantly blocking and don't even look like running routes. Plays like in the gif happen ALL THE TIME.

I don't know which play you are talking about.

talk about exaggeration. THEY aren't running routes.....at the very least they are holding.

Incidental and unavoidable contact. Notice how they CONTINUE on with their routes. Completely legal play that happens in every single game. Out of all the illegal "pick plays" the one in the gif doesn't show it AT ALL. You guys seriously need to watch more football if you think that's a great example of an illegal pick play rofl.

Seriously. All that's shown is just a well executed play that was completely designed to beat the coverage that was played.

The CBs can always light up the receiver. At least that will force the refs to address it.

Bullshit. Look at the second .gif. Moreno ALTERS HIS ROUTE and lowers his shoulder into the defender. He runs straight TO the defender; he's not running a route.

Please just STFU.

Thomas points to the spot where he wants Moreno to run his pick. And calling it a "rub" doesn't magically make it legal.

rofl you guys are grasping for straws. Look, I hate Denver as much as the next guy (well except the "fans" that are apparently expect us to lose to prove that Alex and the rest sucks), but the play shown is nowhere close to what would be considered an "illegal pick play." Please google the term or youtube or whatever to get a better idea of what it is. If the receivers completely truck/tackle or otherwise stop their route at the point of contact to blatantly block, it's an illegal pick play. What's shown is a perfectly legal rub route out of a bunch formation versus man coverage doing EXACTLY WHAT IT WAS DESIGNED TO DO.

Absolute horeshit these plays are allowed. One game they got 200 plus yards of YAC cause of this garbage.

KC runs plays just like this all the time.

In his time in Philly Reid ran stuff like this more than anyone.

Bullshir. Only a complete donco ballwashet would defend these plays.

Eat shit you mouth breathing, donkey loving, AIDS infested, cheating sacks of shit that we call Bronco fans.

EVERY TEAM who has a bunch formation in their playbook (aka ALL 32 OF THEM) run designed rub routes. The sole reason they exist is to beat man coverage. Please watch more football before going full reerun. "hurrdurr well you must love the broncos because I don't know what a rub route is."

Bullshit. He clearly blocks the defender. Hardly a "rub route."

Did any of you watch Bill Walsh's 49ers?

Holmgren's packers?

Seriously... we're pitching a fit about pick plays? Offenses will get called for it one out of twenty times. It's not new. Whaaa whaa whaaa. Boo hoo.

STFU, n00b...grabbing a DB by the shoulder pads is not incidental and unavoidable.

Don't bother trying to get through to this guy. He has been indoctrinated and is too far gone.

This is typical cheatin donks and you are sucking their dick on bronco week. Go **** yourself.

I've felt (since watching Favre's packers) that WR's are allowed WAY too much intentional contact on these routes.

It is what it is though. There's something hypocritical about watching fans of a team coached by Andy Reid bitching about this.

:) REP

He literally looks to be chasing the CB, instead of the other way around.

KC runs NOTHI N G compared to this.

Sure we do.

We've even been flagged for it.

Has Denver? I'd be interested to see the numbers.

White Whale, are you actually a Mastodon fan, or just using the image?

Anytime two routes are designed to cross each other as close as possible aka "rubbing" so that their trailing defenders would either run into each other or the receiver to clear out is a "rub route." Almost every single play ran out of a bunched formation does this. This is how you manufacture someone open versus man coverage. Come on, even Madden-brainwashed kids these days know this.

Yeah it's pretty hilarious. A blatantly "West Coast Offense" team with absolutely clueless fans complaining about one of the staples of their own style of offense.

Nobody runs it near as much as those clowns. Sure everyone does it occasionally but they abuse it.

Look man, I know. It's more of a Manning thing though. His WR's get away with more contact and DB's against him get away with less. That's how it's been for a decade now.

I just don't see the point bitching about it. It's not a new thing to deal with regarding manning. Press the WR's hard and screw up the timing. We should be able to do that.

I'll bet on at least one of Avery's long YAC plays there was a questionable pick involved... probably by Bowe or a TE (cos avery couldn't pick his nose)

I always think back to Freddie Mitchell destroying Randall Gay in the SB on an obvious pick play and Owens got a huge gain. Afterwards T.O. is all "Freddie threw a nice pick".

It was before the ball was thrown. They know what they're doing.

**** off bronco nuthugger!

That's true. However, this is NOT AT ALL what happens in the second play. Look at him. He takes two steps, then turns sideways, and tracks the CB laterally in order to hit him with his shoulder. That's NOT route running and is a clear violation of the rules.

Don't test my patience during donk week n00bs

Agreed. I was seriously wondering, though, if they'd been called for picks yet this year?

The CHEATING DONX run illegal picks as much as Indy used to when BIG HEAD played there. Now add a little Crisco to the OL and chop blocks & they'll be just as bad as the HORSE FACE CHEATING DONX were. **** EVERYTHING Denver!

Leviathan is one of the greatest albums of the 00's. I've seen them live 3X. I'm kinda fading after the recent album, but that takes nothing way from the masterpiece in my avatar.

That is the spirit!!! :)

Wut?

I have no idea. They probably get away with it like Favre's packers did in the day.

I think he typo'd. He's edited it to BIG HEAD.

REP for knowing good music.

or NAG head :)

Don't piss me off this early in the week. I need a slow build until my distain explodes with the power of a Tsar bomb during the game.

Did you guys get to the end of that article?


"My takeaway is that this is one of many ways that this Denver team can beat you and that smart offenses should look to steal these ideas. Not sure the officials will always afford you the same wiggle room that Manning gets, but if the NFL doesn't see this as anything more than "football", then teams are not using all their advantages to mount drives and scores with a simple technique like this."

Hoping that the referees ignore the rules doesn't seem like a great strategy.

Well my taste in women, wine, professions, and food all leave a lot to be desired... so at least I have that. :thumb:

C'mon Chieftan Fans !! Stop will ya !!! Just stop all the 'cheating BS' talk ! All it does is show your anxiety about next week's game. Not my anxiety of course BUT this 'cheating BS talk' reminds me of all the Bronco O-line so-called illegal zone blocking crap:rolleyes:

Play the game and let chips fall where they may !! But the Colts did show how to beat the Donks. In Mannings face all game and play man to man in our 2ndary the whole game while we chew up the clock with dink and dunk and the run;)

The dumbest thing about this is some weird idea that Manning is behind it.

Teams have been doing this forever. It can kill a drive if the officials 'decide' to call it though, and Manning is more likely to get defensive holding or defensive PI if his WR runs over a defender.

It sucks, but it's not new.