Okay, so WHAT exactly is so goddamn great about the 2018 QB class?
 

I see a loooooot of question marks here. A bunch of guys who would be 3rd or 4th rounders in THIS draft class if they declared this year. A bunch of these dudes are so young they might not even declare for the draft. And finally, we got a bunch of spread QBs who.... [gasp!]... need time to acclimate to an NFL pro style offense and develop the footwork and timing of taking snaps under center.

I see Sam Darnold. That's great. There's your #1 overall. IF HE ****ING DECLARES, THAT IS. I see Josh Rosen, who looked good in 2015 but could wind up as another Christian Hackenburg who never puts it all together. And I see a bunch of dried cum with question marks, JUST LIKE THIS QB DRAFT CLASS.

Here's how Walter Football has them ranked:

1. Sam Darnold, USC
2. Josh Rosen, UCLA
3. Luke Falk, Washington State
4. Josh Allen, Wyoming
5. Jarrett Stidham, Auburn
6. Nick Fitzgerald, Mississippi State
7. Chase Litton, Marshall
8. Riley Ferguson, Memphis

COULD this be an awesome and deep draft class for QBs? Yes, absoutely. No question about it. But guess what. There's an equal chance that this QB class flames out and looks just as bad as the 2013 class, particularly if Sam Darnold doesn't declare.

People who bitch about the 2017 class don't ****ing get it. They think if there's no true top end QB, that means they all suck. What do the Chiefs ****ing care about the quality of the top guys in a given QB draft class? We're not going to be in a position to draft them!

Again, let me say this slowly, so the reeruns and assholes can hear me:

In ANY GIVEN DRAFT CLASS, the top QB prospects with the best resumes and attributes are irrelevant to the QB draft needs of the Chiefs. The Chiefs have zero shot at picking any of them. The worst teams with the biggest QB needs will draft all of these players before Dorsey can even begin to pick up the goddamn phone to call and move up.

Tell me what we gain from NOT drafting a QB in 2017 so we can draft Josh Allen, Jarrett Stidham, or Chase ****ing Litton in 2018, a FULL YEAR LONGER where Alex Smith is the only ****ing thing we have at QB.

Agreed. I posted as much, far less eloquently in RunKC's thread.

Our best shot is dumping 10 games to get us into the position to trade the farm for a guy.

Losing 2.5 times more games than we did this year is unlikely. Moreover if we got there, it is unlikely Dorsey would trade the farm for a guy.

RE: Darnold. He had 3/4 of a season, was beat out in camp and is from USC. Why are people all over this dude's junk?

Because CP.....Next year is always better. Draft a fatty.

2019 class will include UGA QB Nick Eason. He will be the best QB prospect since Andrew Luck. None of those 2018 guys are close to him.

2 years? Really?

LMAO


It's always been that way. It's time to shit or get off the pot.

USC's season totally turned around when Darnold was named the starter. He has leadership, he can scramble, he has a lightening fast release, is accurate on the run. He isn't the prototypical USC QB in the Palmer, Booty, Leinart model. He had to play with less talent due to sanctions.

Falk is Brady-like. Very accurate on short passes even to the side lines. Has a surprising deep ball but it is not his main weapon. He can scramble a bit but prefers not to. The knock on him is that he holds the ball far to long sometimes.

Rosen I am not totally sold on. He had a great beginning of a freshman year but has cooled off a lot since then. There is also injury history there that might be concerning.

I am ready to draft a QB. That said, I would be fine with stock piling first round picks to move up and get a really good QB prospect in 2018 or 2019. Especially if we can't move down and Watson is gone by our pick this year. I bet we could have three firsts next year if we wanted.

The thing is they actually have to do it. Not just talk about it.

Once again, if Eason is Andrew Luck, we're not getting him. We're not stockpiling picks, and even if we did, it wouldn't be enough for us to jump from the 20s to #1 overall. There is no price or amount of draft picks that will ever be enough, because eventually the team trading with us will say, "Listen, thanks for your entire draft for the next 3 years, but uhh... we'd probably just rather keep this pick right here thank you."

Worrying about the top QBs in a draft class was what we did during Herm and Pioli. It didn't work. The franchise was too chickenshit. That dream died the day we traded for Alex. Now we have to gauge the 3rd, 4th, 5th best QB talents in a given draft class. Because that's the only shit that will ever fall to us that we'll be in a position to draft or move up and draft.

Add Luke Falk and Mason Rudolph to that class.

It's the top 4 and the rest are the same developmental QB's as this years crop. Top 4 will all be gone in the top 10.

Morons saying to wait for next year dont understand we would have to give up 3 first rd picks, two 2nd and a 3rd to even begin consulting with a team to move up that high.

Yep. I started out with the 2018 mentality, but truth is we dont have a clue if it will even pan out as well as this one in the long run. They need to decide if one or more of these guys has the tools, and can run the system, after a year, and If he's available, ****ing draft him.

Rudolph is hot garbage.

Two spread offense QBs who need time to acclimate to taking snaps under center and learning added complications to NFL playbooks? No problem! They're fine!

Oh, unless you're Deshaun Watson, Mitch Trubisky, or Patrick Mahomes. Then it's the end of the world! No way they can acclimate to the pros!

Leach's system is quite a bit different from most spread systems. First Falk gets two play calls:a run and a pass. He determines which to run. After that it is up to him to change protections and routes based on the pre-snap read of the D. It isn't simply looking at the sideline and running tempo. In fact Leach rarely runs tempo offense.

Right. He did that on 3/4 of a season. He looks the part but how many have and have taken steps back during their college careers?

It is really pretty dumb to make decisions for the now based on what some college kid may do in a year.

I personally hate the idea that you need an 'Andrew Luck' type prospect if you are taking a QB early in the draft. Why?

At the end of the day, you're going to need a solid team and coaching staff around whatever QB you draft for them to succeed, which the Chiefs currently have. Andrew Luck does not, however, in Indy.

This team is set up to draft any talented QB early and have success, because the foundation around the position is already in place.

He may regress but I think the kid has it.

Chiefs and the majority of their fans are the Cubs, before 2016, of the NFL. :(:(:shake:

Let's say it's Darnold and Falk.

Again, what good does that do the Chiefs? We have no shot at them.

Let's say Mitch Trubisky falls to 27. How is he not just as good of a prospect as Josh ****ing Allen, a guy who threw a zillion picks playing in the Mountain West?

Also, when is the last time you saw a really good football team draft a great QB prospect in the top 10?

Unless the Chiefs fall off drastically in 2017, so much so that Reid and Dorsey end up on a very hot seat, we will not be in position to take any of the top 2-3 QBs in 2018. Hard to see them winning any more or less than 9 to 12 games this year. 2017 is the year to draft the QB. Do it now so you can have a kid ready to roll in 2018 and move on from Alex's contract.

Just stop it.

Next year has always been the best year to draft a QB since 1983.

Too risky.

Kid at my local high school has been tearing it up. We should target him after Alex's upcoming extension hits its twilight years in 2021.

Somewhere out there a drunken star college football player is about to knock up a drunken star college soccer player. We should hold out for that unholy brood to declare for the draft.

Star college pitcher and star college player.

Qb from the heavens

If you want to wait until 2018 to draft a QB....then you'd better be ready to hope Smith goes down for the entire season and Bray leads us to eaxtly 1-2 wins. That's the only shot we'll have at a high QB. And even then it will be "He's not Andrew Luck! We need to draft an offensive lineman to protect Smith and get our QB in 2019!"

More white guys, duh.

The same people who aren't willing to wait till 2018 to draft a QB are willing to draft a QB and have him sit for 2 years to develop. What's the difference?
Posted via Mobile Device

To supplement your list in no particular order:

9. Baker Mayfield (Oklahoma)
10. Max Browne (Pitt)
11. Matt Linehan (Idaho)
12. Mike White (Western Kentucky)
13. Quinton Flowers (South Florida)
14. Jeremiah Briscoe (Sam Houston State)
15. Logan Woodside (Toledo)
16. Lamar Jackson (Louisville)*
17. Brett Rypien (Boise State)*

'*' denotes underclassmen in 2018

As it stands today, with seniors alone, I personally think the 2018 class is superior to 2017. Any combination of the underclassmen declare and it could be quite special both in terms of talent and depth.

Nonetheless, the Chiefs won't wait until next year to draft a QB because Dorsey was taught by Ron Wolf to draft a QB every year...every other year at minimum. For KC so far on Dorsey's watch....Bray (UDFA/ '13), Murray (Rd 5/ '14) and Hogan (Rd 5/ '16).

Therefore, it's a reasonable expectation for the Chiefs to draft one both in 2017 and 2018 and I doubt they wait until the 5th round in either year to do so given the impending separation from Alex Smith and his salary.

Also, you don't really know how these players are going to look a year from now. Several of them could have 2017 seasons that place them far and away above the guys coming out this year, who all need work.

The fact that most everyone agrees the 2018 class is ALREADY better is a big deal given that they still have another season to improve.

The 2018 rounder might need a year or two also. Were you actually being serious here?

The difference is that we might have wait 2 years for whomever is available when we draft next year.

The difference is that we've heard next year is a better year for QBs every ****ing year since before many here even started following football.

Gotta wait until 2019, bro.

2021 is ligning up to have a shit load of great QB's . I'm excited for 2021

This year's HS sophomore class is the one to keep an eye on for sure!

I'm excited for the QB that hasn't been born yet. Might as well wait it out.

Expanding on what these guys thoughts and using the accurate logic that SNR layed out:
If we are drafting in the 25 to 32 range in the 2018 draft the top QB prospects will be gone and we will be left with the same/similar type prospects that we have available to us this year. One of the reason that these QBs might drop to us or close enough for Dorsey to go get him is that this draft is deep at a lot of other positions, 2018 is not according to those same analysts, which will drive these QBs value down.
So if we are going to get a QB that needs to set for a season or two whether we draft that QB in 2017 or 2018 then the difference is that we can have one of those seasons already behind the QB that we might draft in 2017 which in essence would give the 2017 QB an advantage over any 2018 QB that would be available to us in the back end of the 1st round.
To take it one step further another possible advantage to drafting one this year is IF next years draft has these better QBs it will push better talent at other positions down to us. Win-Win!!

Trubisky will be 23 when the season starts. The other 3 will be 21, and turn 22 during the season.

And I have read where these 4 guys have a chance to be something special... they just need a little time.

A year in our system may help Mahomes far more than going back to Texas Tech for 1 more year and getting college experience. Maybe even the same for Watson or Kizer.

Plus they just may fall down the draft board because they need a little time, not because they lack talent. Plays right into our hands.

In this case it's actually true, though.

And if we reach for a middling prospect this year, there's a very good chance we blow our shot at a real first round prospect next year.

The best play to is to trade our 2017 1st for a 2018 1st and then use that ammo to try and move up in 2018.

Nobody is going to trade their 2018 1st rd pick for our 27th overall pick.

It can ABSOLUTELY happen.

It has happened before. If a team is looking to get back into the first round, or even the top of the 2nd round, they will trade a future 1st, no question.

Examples:

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...&ct=clnk&gl=us

And that's not even the entire history of the draft.

Or they might need a year. Or they may be ready to start right away. Bottom line is if you want to draft a QB right now that won't be ready till 2019, you shouldn't criticize people who want to wait until 2018 to draft one.
Posted via Mobile Device

That's my whole point. SNR had said hes okay with drafting Mahomes and having him sit for 2+ years. How is that any better than waiting until 2018 to draft a QB that may be more developed than he is and won't need 2 years on the bench to be ready?

I want to draft a QB this year. I don't want to draft a QB that takes more than a year to develop. I don't see how a QB sitting on the bench for 2 years is any better than drafting a QB next year and having him either start right away or sit for one year and be ready to start at the same time Mahomes would have been ready to start.
Posted via Mobile Device

Financially doesn't make sense if your QB has to sit for 2 years. You figure year 3 is then basically a rookie year, and your having to make decisions on a contract without really knowing what you've got.

I'm all for not playing a guy till he's ready, but if it's more than a year, I'm not interested. Especially for a first round pick.

This.
Posted via Mobile Device

Give Kizer a year and he'll be ready to match and exceed our QBs 15 TDs.

Who is going to be there at 27 that someone would want to trade a potential high 1st round pick next year for?

Chiefs could find their Carr. Why not draft 2 QB's if their there. Redskins did it in 2012 with RGIII and Cousins. Bottom line is the Chiefs need to try and develop their own QB.

In the Playoffs last year the Chiefs were the only team to play with a QB they didn't draft. Miami played with there backup who they didn't draft I believe. Tananhill who they drafted would've helped them as well as Carr would've improved the Raiders chances. I see a pattern here.

Patriots -Brady
Oakland-Cook
Steelers-Big Ben
Texans-Savage

Miamai-Moore (not drafted/not the starter)
Chiefs-Smith (not drafted)

Falcons-Ryan
Cowboys-Prescott
Packers-Rogers
Seahawks-Wilson
Lions-Stafford
Giants-Eli

I don't know dude. You never know who a team has on their draft board or who is going to fall.

Look at the bags of shit these teams traded future first round picks for:

Jason Campbell
Tony Ugoh
Alphonse Smith
Everette Brown
Mark Ingram

The best of that group was Joe Staley.

History says the Chiefs can absolutely trade #27 for a first round pick in 2018.

It's hard to find guys that are ready to go that quickly. If anything, a QB's first year or two won't be good anyway.

It's all about drafting good players most of the time. Hell Houston and Peters alone are going to cost a shit ton of $$ combined in 2-3 years.

Not a fan of trading back to the 4th round (110) for a 1st next year, that may or may not turn into a QB.

I also think if anyone is trading back into the 1st, it is going to be to get in front of Houston, or with Seattle to get in front of us.

Huh? What happened to our second and third round picks? We're not giving those up.

How many guys have had to sit 2 years? 1 year sure, although I still think you learn more by playing but a year is fine.

Every qb that has failed and has been said "if they'd have sit a year to be ready they'd have been good" has been on or in shitty situations

I just used NE trading their 1st for pick #110 and a 1st the following year.

Yeah. They kept their 2nd and 3rd round picks bud. You make it sound like the Chiefs trade 1, 2 and 3 when you say "trade back to the 4th"

You lose your first round pick, but you get another one the following year. That's the point.

What player are the Chiefs going draft at #27 that will have more potential impact than a franchise QB in 2018?

The draft is always a crapshoot, a gamble. Gamble big. You can package two 1st rounders in 2018 and your 2019 1st to move up into the top 10 if need be. You can ABSOLUTELY go and get yourself a QB if you have the balls.

Didn't mean to make it sound that way. I knew we would still have our 2nd and two 3rds this year.

Just not a fan of your plan right now. Now come draft day I might be... depending on who is still available after the Browns and Cards pick at 12 and 13.

I'm not advocating for them to sit two years, sit one. But the next year there will probably be some growing pains.

Yeah and that's fine. Put a good d around him, better running game and the weapons they have and ease him in

So basically you are getting a jump start of a year if they think a guy this year is good enough

The greatest thing about the future is hope. All is possible in the future.

And then 1/4 guys doesn't declare while NYJ, Jags and 49ers take the other 3 amd we're stuck with our dick in our hand.

Quarterbacks aren't going 1-2-3 in 2018. That rarely happens.

All you've sacrificed is a player we aren't in desperate need of in 2017.

What do you have to lose? Just get in position for the best QB class in years. You have nothing to lose. And everything to gain.

**** that. Take someone this year and someone else next year if we have to. This next year shit needs to end now.

There's 0% chance of that happening though.

We're looking at another Geno this year if we reach.

Speaking strictly in terms of the first round, perhaps. But in the entire draft, I don't think it's a stretch at all to say the Chiefs take a QB in '17 AND '18 for reasons I mentioned earlier.

We're currently shitting our pants about drafting a QB in the first round, so you want to take a mediocre prospect this year and then spend a mid-round pick on another next year?

That sounds like rubbing my dick against a cheese grater to be honest, when I can potentially package picks to move up in 2018 instead.

I basically don't care, AT ALL, about a quarterback taken outside the first round at this point.

Bray, Murray, Hogan...garbage. Why even bother?

I remain firmly convinced that you take a quarterback in one of the first three rounds every single year until you get your franchise guy. Don't stop until you're satisfied. It's the only way to win a Super Bowl unless the league decides to give you one because your neckless, half-dead, HGH-saturated franchise quarterback from the University of Tennessee has announced his retirement.

Brady
Carr
Brees
Rodgers
Dak
Wilson
Dalton
Cousins
Flacco
Romo

All these guys were mediocre or worse prospects. This QB class is not 2013.
And you might as well stop now with the thought that the Chiefs we'd to draft an elite talent bc it won't happen.

That "It's actually true" bullshit has been said in every single ****ing draft every single year, except the year that Luck was drafted.

Who the hell even heard of Carson Wentz prior to the '15 season?

Brian Brohm was supposed to be the next big thing prior to his final college season.

It's the same damn thing every single year.

Defeatist thinking. Not participating.

Tyler Bray was a "worthy" QB pick once "next year"

I just can't believe this place is so gung ho about borderline 1st round prospects after the Geno debacle.

Let alone a god damn Texas Tech QB.

Heh.

Dorsey will figure it out.

You never really know though. Nobody thought Prescott was in Goff and Wentz league, but he's tirned out much better so far.

WTF? How did you get that from my comment? I merely stated what the Chiefs are likely to do based on Dorsey and his background as an evaluator. I also stated they weren't likely to wait until the 5th round to do so in '17 or '18 given the urgency to replace Smith. I stated nothing about what I "want" or prefer them to do.

Actually just based on the history of air raid QBs and goddamn Red Raiders in the NFL, I think I can say we should ****ing pass.

To be fair, Prescott landed in a great situation with that Oline and Elliot. Not to take away from his talent as he displayed veteran-like decision making and command of the offense. But his surrounding cast definitely made his college-to-pro transition easier than Wentz and especially Goff.

Maybe Dorsey is baiting those teams into taking qb's??

Based on the history of Tedford QBs and Cal, the Pack should never have selected Aaron Rodgers.

You're sacrificing the potential for a stud in this deep draft class so you can get picks next year and pay an arm and a leg for a prospect that might not even be that much better than a guy we could just take right now in 2017?