Dont think Harden is a max guy. Yes, I know he lit up the Pistons but can he carry a team by himself? Doubt it.

he doesnt need to carry a team, the team just needs to make money off marketing him.

hes not going to win a championship in Houston and Houston was never getting a superstar or winning without him, thats the problem with markets like that, they will never get another Hakeem or even Yao. So why not get a really good young player instead. The fanbase is happy and everyone wins

Harden is a very likable player. i don't know how many games they'll win, but with Lin and him they will put asses in the seats. Too bad for them they spent so much on Lin. A different type of player would have been a better compliment.

They collapsed due to DeRozan's incredible uselessness (who the Raptors will now be paying $40M over 4 years because Brian Colangelo doesn't know how to step away) and Bargnani's poor defense down the stretch on D. West. So basically, the same thing as the last few years. Lowry and Valanciunas were great, though, and huge upgrades on what they had in those positions last year. If the two old stalwarts don't get in the way too much, they have a chance to make the playoffs.

I don't know why the Raptors didn't involve themselves in the Harden talks, though. He would have been perfect for them. The kind of wing talent they haven't had since Vince Carter was still there.

Investing the money they have in DeRozan and Landry should be grounds for firing

And giving $24M to Jason Kapono. And giving $34M to Amir Johnson. And giving $53M to Hedo Turkoglu.

So there's nothing new here (although giving the useless, one-dimensional, inefficient DeRozan $40M may top all of those). Colangelo has driven the organization into the ground several times over and is putting stake after stake into it at this point (kind of like a certain Chiefs GM but with three more years of failure).

I thought BC had turned a corner by swiping Lowry, who's a damn good player. But, alas, he throws DeRozan $40M. Roughly the same money that Lawson, Holiday, Curry, and Taj Gibson all received yesterday. And they're all significantly more valuable. Even if DeRozan played well this year, he'd have been a restricted free agent they could have matched, and no team was likely to throw $40M at him.

$40 million on DeRozan should be grounds for firing. I do like Kyle Lowry though.

BC lucked into Lowry in a sense. He was fully prepared to give Nash $40M over three years just to use his Canadian nationality as a way to hype up the product (and even gave that scrub Fields $20M in a convoluted attempt to stop Nash from going to the Knicks). When Nash didn't take the money, it enabled him to trade for Lowry (who admittedly is a good young PG that a team can grow with).

There are no words for giving a player like DeRozan $40M, though. I don't think he's even worth half of that considering all of his many deficiencies. I'd like to say I was surprised when I saw the contract terms, but overpaying mediocre players is Colangelo's MO. I don't think I'll be able to fully embrace the Raptors again until they get rid of him (which kind of puts me in a similar spot to what we have in KC with the Chiefs).

The good thing about tonight's Chiefs game is ill have an excuse to change the channel at 8:30.

I love having PiP with DTV, watching both the Chiefs game and the Spurs\Thunder.

So far damn good game. OKC really hasn't lost a beat

Thunder up! Harden looked strange in a Rockets uniform last night. :mad:

I'm happy with how OKC has looked so far for the most part. We never play well in SA so I never expected to win this game pre-trade either.

There's fellow okies here...nice!

this OKC team wont be bad if Martin buys in. Martin doesnt look that bad on the court with KD and Westy together.

WHAT A ****ING SHOT - MAYNOR

that was a pretty shot.

28 seconds left all tied up at 84...here we go

Damn good game going on right now. Tie game in the last 30 seconds of the 4th quarter.

Fail.

wow nice steal by Leonard on Durant..

That was terrible game planning by OKC. That play wouldn't have scored even if Leonard didn't get that steal.

Parker with the kill shot

Damn Parker. Just cold blooded.

The Thunder f'd that final minute.

Hell yes! Spurs are just winners....and winners can do whatever the hell they want.

Westbrook really ****ed up on that play. Don't know what he was thinking

Thunder played liked shit the whole game offensively. In the first half there was good ball movement. The second half was too much hero ball. SA deserved the win. Parker was clutch when he needed to be.

I thought Martin played really well. If Westbrook finishes his nice pass to go up 5 we win.

Oh well. As I said, we always play like shit in SA. 1 win there since they've been in OKC. None in the regular season.

Still better than watching the Chiefs :)

Westbrook had a bad game after the 1st quarter. That loss was on him for the most part. He'll bounce back.

They shot 37% and lost by 2. That's the bright side I guess.

Wow, they're killing Westbrook on post-game, deservedly. Embarrassing last play, 6 for 21 with 6 turnovers....and doesn't get other guys involved.

Honestly, watching Harden in Houston with a full game and team of his own vs. Westbrook? Still a very long season, but I think I'd rather have Harden.

Harden was getting others involved, dropping dimes on p&r, etc. I can't remember the last time I watched Westy and said, "wow, what a pass".

OKC's ball movement and ease of offense just wasn't quite up to par today. Harden was a great facilitator and playmaker in a way that Westbrook and Durant simply aren't. He's really irreplaceable.

Yep.

OKC just so talented they'll be there in the end. Just this sense that they should be better.

They are just piling on with the highlights now.

On a side note and I have probably said this before but the TNT show is by far the best pre-game, half-time, post-game show on TV. These guys ****ing crack me up..

Westbrook's assist rate actually dropped significantly last season. It was probably Harden's greater presence that did it, but he's going to have to get back to passing the ball more now and being more of a facilitator like Harden was for last year's team. He has the talent and vision to be able to do it, but I'm not sure he has the mindset.

All of the advanced metrics guys favor Harden, but I'm not sure how statistics can account for Westbrook's athleticism. He'll be a scary player if he ever reaches his potential.

I just don't think it's in his DNA. This was a risk when they drafted him and put him at PG. He was a SG at UCLA, and he's still got that score first mindset.

He looked off an open Martin several times late in the 4th.

It's an interesting question as to who of the two is a better basketball player (they're both top 20 in the NBA as it is). I'd probably give a slight edge right now to Westbrook based on his longer track record of elite success, but Harden is still getting better at a fast rate, is more efficient, and his potential is clearly huge (like top 5 in the league huge).

Harden is also incredibly athletic. His athleticism really shows up in his change of speed, body control and size.

crazy thing is the 2 guys are still very very young and not even in their primes really, Westbrook is what? 24? lol

The best thing they do is give Charles Barkley time, space, and freedom to talk about whatever he wants to. ESPN and the other sports channels don't do anything like that with their personalities, it's all regimented.

Both can get to the rim at will...they're probably among the best few slashers in the league.

No doubt, that's part of the fun of this is that we get to continue to watch them grow and develop. That's also why okcchief can get frustrated at times, but knows he's got two really good to great players to watch over the next few years.

I remember hearing an interview of a well-known player (don't remember who it was) a couple of years ago where he was asked who the best pick up game/playground player is in the NBA. I thinking Rose, Jennings, Tyreke.....guy says James Harden. And this was before Harden was as well known as he is now. The interviewer was surprised, the player talked about how surprisingly athletic Harden was with sick handles.

It's just too bad it wasn't three.

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This game had nothing to do with Harden. The Thunder had games just like this last year with Harden.

You do realize Harden normally drove to the basket? He averaged 3.6 assist a game playing 32 minutes.

The problem is our bigs can't finish no matter who is passing them the ball. It's also the reason Durant, Westbrook, and even Harden go into hero mode.

The ball movement was crisp in the first half. They just weren't hitting shots. They had games that way even with Harden. Look how many shots Ibaka and Collison missed early. That's why the ball stops moving.

Yes, there are issues with the Thunder winning a championship, but people are focusing on the wrong one.

Ibaka has to play better or they have to find someone that can. Martin filled the role fine tonight.

Westbrook would have had the ball at the end of the game with Harden, and the result would have been the same. When the bigs hit easy shots the Thunder roll. When they don't things get interesting.

How many times has Westbrook been abused for the same thing in the past? This is nothing new.

It's not all his fault either. He can't trust the bigs to finish and Durant has problem getting open at times in crunch time.

To simplify it to they lost this game because of the trade is silly. If you watch this team on a nightly basis nothing new happened tonight.

I don't think anybody simplified it to that, but the offense was clearly a mess in the 2nd half. When Westbrook is struggling (and he does that occasionally such as tonight), there's just nobody exactly left to fill that offensive void (unless Ibaka develops more).

Shaq's preparing for his Whitlock fight.

Russel's play in the last 10 seconds was embarrassing. The pass was bad and the defense was bad.

I love the Thunder, but they are going to miss Harden. I already do.

I'm not singling out you either because the media is doing the same thing. They keep saying they won without Ginobli. SA skull ****ed us twice in regulation last year -Ginobli.

The issue that needs to be addressed is an inside scoring presence. It would be the same with James.

Martin fills the role fine. Harden deserves more money, more playing time, and to be an all star.

Ibaka really needs to grow up quick.

The defense was bad for sure. I agree with Barkley on the pass. Durant was too passive.

I didn't get to watch all of the game, but when I did, I saw Perk brick an easy shot. It's getting more and more difficult for me to watch that guy.

Martin had 15 and 5. Those are pretty much the numbers Harden would have. He was sitting on the outside wide open when Russ was driving wildly.

Russ and Ibaka played like junk, and KD played just ok. We lost on a last second jumper on the road to a team we have never best in the regular season on their home floor.

OKC has 18 of the first 24 games at home. If they start out rough then I'll worry.

If they want to win this year another move will probably have to be made. That with or without Harden. I think they can still win the West.

Miami with the extra outside shooters and LeBron/DWade penetrating is going to be close to impossible to stop for anyone with their current rosters.

He's a terrible offensive player. You need him for basically 4 teams. They should be going small a lot more and giving PJ3 some minutes. Brooks is stubborn though so I won't hold my breathe.

Agree on Ibaka, I expected him to come out better this season. Again, only one game against a good defensive team, but he looked much like he did last season. Settling for jumpers, no aggression offensively, and too many times on defense not being the presence you'd expect. That guy should be able to score 10 points off the offensive glass alone with his length and athleticism.

What bigs are out there that the Thunder to get before the trade deadline? I'd guess you're right, Presti isn't done with this season's roster.

FYI, the Chiefs have driven me to the NBA. I'm not hitching my wagon to any team right off the bat, I'm going to watch a bit and enjoy not having any emotional investment. Look for my uninformed, unbiased takes.

Alot of good games tonight except apparently the Celtics have decided not to show up tonight. Down 16 to the ****ing Bucks...

30 points for the Celtics in the first half shooting barely 30%..****

At least the Knicks are up 9 against the Heat

Harden dominating again, 17 pts in the 1st half

Cavs look as bad as the celtics against the Bulls

Wolves doing okay in season opener against Kings. 38-24. When Love and Rubio are back we'll be playing 7th/8th seed playoff basketball fo sho

Okc should have traded westbrook.

You can't use harden's numbers from last year with westbrook on the team and act like he would have the same impact with just him and durant as the two stars.

Harden would be doing exactly what he's doing now.
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JFC Celtics. Jennings going off. I hope Doc chews their ass and works them off after this embarrassment.

Don't know if Harden can keep this up...but if he can... Sam Presti will be on suicide watch when the playoffs come around.

Westbrook > Harden.


And they don't even play the same position.

And even for an old guy... John Clayton is a weird looking MFer.

Yep. 27 through 3 quarters

Doesn't matter the position. Westbrook plays out of control far too often IMO.

Harden would be doing what he is doing right now on that team with no westbrook. Westbrook is also a somewhat selfish player. A pass first pg. would have to be there too
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Cole Aldrich sighting..more rare than bigfoot

oh shit Morris and Aldrich on the floor at the same time.

40 for Harden. Where are those people saying he wasn't a #1 now? LMAO

I'm taking Harden over Westbrook as well.

Harden is just a smarter basketball player. Westbrook has the speed, but Harden is smarter, has a better shot, and can attack the rim just as well.

Defensively on the ball, I'd take Westbrook, but Westbrook off the ball is putrid.

Harden dominating again tonight. Probably will end up with 45 pts after making his 3 FT's to end the game

LMAO

17 pts in the 4th...ugh wow

In that offense in OKC, they kind of do.

Westbrook is hardly a pure PG. He didn't facilitate the offense in the 4th quarter when Harden was in with him, either.

I agree.

45 it is. If Harden keeps playing like this, Houston is going to make the playoffs with ease.

If harden keeps up this high level of play Houston came out on this big time. They got him for a good price as well.

Some draft picks, a prospect, and a rental in Kevin Martin...that's not much at all for an extreme talent like him.