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-   -   Chiefs An addition to the Pioli resume (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=268114)

Hootie 12-28-2012 04:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58 (Post 9246519)
You don't get to - or win - a Super Bowl with just a QB.

The problem is that this fanbase automatically undervalues players on other teams, while overvaluing our players.

You need a complete team - including a QB.

And even then, sometimes it's not enough.

Could Geno Smith come in next year and lead us to 8 or 9 wins?

Maybe.

But unless the new GM starts hitting on some draft picks and making some smart FA signings, 8-9 wins and the occasional one-and-done in the playoffs is the ceiling.
Well unfortunately until Peyton Manning retires we're going to be settling for fighting for the 5th and 6th seed every year so I doubt we have immediate playoff success REGARDLESS...

and this is the point I've been saying for YEARS in regard to the great Brady/Manning debate. YEARS. I'm glad to see people are starting to understand.

AND, again, we get grossly outcoached every game. Defense alone we have Johnson, Hali, Houston, Flowers and Berry with guys like Poe who have potential and guys like Arenas who are serviceable. You can't have an all-star at every position you need coaching to come up with schemes to put the 'average to system' players in position to succeed.

We do not have that luxury.

Denver has a QB that consistently sustains LONG drives and puts them in the lead so they can play to their defensive strengths (get after the passer)...we don't. Peyton Manning makes that solid defense with great playmakers ELITE and PETRIFYING.

We have Houston and Hali. If Peyton Manning were our QB he'd enable them to be ELITE and PETRIFYING.

I don't think you understand HOW MUCH Peyton Manning does for that team...offense and...and...ESPECIALLY defense.

Hootie 12-28-2012 04:35 PM
not to mention the fact Denver can take risks, or call aggressive defensive plays because you know what? What's the worst thing that happens? They give up a long TD and Peyton Manning gets the ball? Oh no!

We get down by 10+? Yeah. Ha ha. We're done.

DeezNutz 12-28-2012 04:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FAX (Post 9246523)
An excellent, albeit devastatingly depressing analysis, Mr. OnTheWarpath58.

By all rights, however, I think we shouldn't count Dr. Evil's first year ... or, at least, we should weight it less heavily. That was, by any reasonable standard, a rebuild year for sure. The new regime inherited a sloppy, lazy, completely unmotivated gaggle of out-of-shape quitters. Although I despise Dr. Evil as much or more than anyone else on planet Earth, I'd give that to any new GM/HC group.

What is unforgivable, though, was mentioned by Mr. Rausch earlier today. It's entirely unacceptable that you are worse in year 4 of your "rebuild" than you were in year 1 ... and we are.

It goes without saying that the root problem is lack of talent. But I'd add that it's lack of talent at some of the most crucial positions. And, of course, if you don't have quality depth in the NFL, you don't have squat because there are always injuries.

Frankly, I've given up thinking about this too hard because, when I do, the reality hits me once more just how screwed we are. The hopelessness that permeates this organization is palpable and, given our current situation and the total failure to improve or even stabilize the situation, we have only Pioli to thank. So, here's to you, Dr. Evil. May you wallow in opossum urine all your days.

FAX
I adamantly disagree with any notion of a "rebuild" in the sense that a team cannot be reasonably successful while going through it. Thus, discounting or prorating our evaluation of Pioli in '09 in nonsensical in my view.

Our talent at key positions was pretty damn good. Still is, though it's largely the same guys. If Pioli were even reasonably good at his job, we could have been a consistent playoff team from '09 forward.

I don't care whom Clark hires as the next GM; the sonofabitch doesn't get an "evaluation year." Furthermore, "rebuilding" is rhetorical bullshit sold on fans to get them to continue to support financially a shit team. It's fluff and does nothing but absolve blame and buy time.

"Evaluation years," "Right 53s," "Processes," and "Rebuilding years" can be shoved right up the next GM's ass if he even dares utter these trite cliches.

Hootie 12-28-2012 04:38 PM
we were a blocked FG away from making the playoffs in a shit division with Matt Cassel, Tyler Palko and Kyle Orton at QB with Jackie Battle as our best RB and Sabby Piscatelli starting at safety.

Dreadful 2012. No doubt.

Fortunately, we have easy fixes.

We have to hit one two things to be competitive in 2013. Geno Smith + a competent coaching staff. Those two things alone can get us to 8 wins.

Then we need to hit on some free agents, maybe hit on ONE more draft pick...and maybe see ONE guy like Poe develop into a good starter.

We have FAR less rebuilding to do than the Colts did this year (even though I think that is the luckiest team we've seen in a long time).

Ceej 12-28-2012 04:40 PM
I'm also a firm believer that Indianapolis is a pretty lucky team this year.

Luck has been amazing.

I don't see their overall group as a talented core of players.

FAX 12-28-2012 04:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeezNutz (Post 9246542)
I adamantly disagree with any notion of a "rebuild" in the sense that a team cannot be reasonably successful while going through it. Thus, discounting or prorating our evaluation of Pioli in '09 in nonsensical in my view.

Our talent at key positions was pretty damn good. Still is, though it's largely the same guys. If Pioli were even reasonably good at his job, we could have been a consistent playoff team from '09 forward.

I don't care whom Clark hires as the next GM; the sonofabitch doesn't get an "evaluation year." Furthermore, "rebuilding" is rhetorical bullshit sold on fans to get them to continue to support financially a shit team. It's fluff and does nothing but absolve blame and buy time.

"Evaluation years," "Right 53s," "Processes," and "Rebuilding years" can be shoved right up the next GM's ass if he even dares utter these trite cliches.
ROFL

Okay.

What do you call it when you install entirely new defensive and offensive playbooks and schemes, reassign positional responsibilities to your "best" players, and introduce an entirely new leadership group into the mix?

I know ... let's call it "Gloobering"! That should work just fine.

FAX

Hootie 12-28-2012 04:42 PM
Luck has something like 7 game winning drives this year...

So yeah, that's amazing. Shows what kind of gamer he is.

BUT FLIP SIDE IT...they could very easily be 3-12. That team, IMO, takes a big step backwards next year...I think Luck puts it all together in year 3 though.

DeezNutz 12-28-2012 04:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FAX (Post 9246557)
ROFL

Okay.

What do you call it when you install entirely new defensive and offensive playbooks and schemes, reassign positional responsibilities to your "best" players, and introduce an entirely new leadership group into the mix?

I know ... let's call it "Gloobering"! That should work just fine.

FAX
Outside of QB, are the Chiefs more talented than the Colts? How are the Redskins possibly surviving during this difficult "rebuilding" process? Hell, what about the Seahawks, the least talked about good team in the NFL? That "rebuild" is a bitch.

Why in the world should the highest paid GM in the game get a mulligan, if one entire season can even be counted so lightly?

Chief Roundup 12-28-2012 04:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58 (Post 9246519)
The problem is that this fanbase automatically undervalues players on other teams, while overvaluing our players.
The "fan base" might but not on here so much. On here any player for any other team is better than whomever the Chiefs have is the normal schtick around here.

Someone who is good with that PFF stuff could put all of our players or position groups against other teams and probably get a more accurate measure of where our "team" stands as far as talent goes.

TEX 12-28-2012 05:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CJizzles (Post 9246554)
I'm also a firm believer that Indianapolis is a pretty lucky team this year.

Luck has been amazing.

I don't see their overall group as a talented core of players.
Here's an obversation regarding the Colts - and this came from Gary Kubiak after the Texans played them - He said that they are deep in that when you take away the obvious stars - that most all the talent is the same level. They play a lot of thier roster each game (He said more than any team in the league) and the dropoff in talent when they sub is minimal. He said that it's a very good way to go through a rebuild in that teams can remain competitive with a GOOD QB at the helm. Interesting...

OnTheWarpath15 12-28-2012 05:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt Tasty Cheeks (Post 9246545)
we were a blocked FG away from making the playoffs in a shit division with Matt Cassel, Tyler Palko and Kyle Orton at QB with Jackie Battle as our best RB and Sabby Piscatelli starting at safety.

Dreadful 2012. No doubt.

Fortunately, we have easy fixes.

We have to hit one two things to be competitive in 2013. Geno Smith + a competent coaching staff. Those two things alone can get us to 8 wins.

Then we need to hit on some free agents, maybe hit on ONE more draft pick...and maybe see ONE guy like Poe develop into a good starter.

We have FAR less rebuilding to do than the Colts did this year (even though I think that is the luckiest team we've seen in a long time).
We have easy fixes, yet didn't fix anything in FOUR YEARS.

ChiefsCountry 12-28-2012 05:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58 (Post 9246612)
We have easy fixes, yet didn't fix anything in FOUR YEARS.
That is on the Fat **** in the GM office.

Hammock Parties 12-28-2012 05:12 PM
I disagree that we didn't fix anything.

The offensive line has been massively upgraded.

Winston, Asamoah and Hudson are all good players.

OnTheWarpath15 12-28-2012 05:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry (Post 9246614)
That is on the Fat **** in the GM office.
And it will be on the next guy as well.

As has been pointed out several times, the core of this team hasn't changed in four years - it's just gotten older.

We have all these easy fixes, yet the Executive of the Decade wasn't able to fix anything in four years.

A QB is part of the problem, but far from the entire problem.

OnTheWarpath15 12-28-2012 05:17 PM
I'm heading out to dinner, check in later.


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