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pugsnotdrugs19 11-19-2019 09:46 PM

I’m very much so down with drafting an IOL pretty early. I don’t think it’d take much to upgrade either.

LB, CB, IOL, RB. Big needs ahead at those spots.

Chris Meck 11-28-2019 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pugsnotdrugs19 (Post 14609767)
Iím very much so down with drafting an IOL pretty early. I donít think itíd take much to upgrade either.

LB, CB, IOL, RB. Big needs ahead at those spots.

If we had Indy's offensive line, we'd score 50 a game and nobody would ever touch Mahomes.

RunKC 12-18-2019 11:40 AM

Even though it should happen, it’s hard for me to think Andy will allow Veach to part with Sammy next year, especially if we don’t win it all.

Idk why I just have a feeling Andy is going to try to keep as many weapons as he can and tell Veach to make Pat and Jones (I think Veach will extend him) first year cap hits low.

Frank Clark’s cap hit is $6.5 million this year. I think something similar will be set up for Chris Jones.

pugsnotdrugs19 12-18-2019 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RunKC (Post 14663643)
Even though it should happen, itís hard for me to think Andy will allow Veach to part with Sammy next year, especially if we donít win it all.

Idk why I just have a feeling Andy is going to try to keep as many weapons as he can and tell Veach to make Pat and Jones (I think Veach will extend him) first year cap hits low.

Frank Clarkís cap hit is $6.5 million this year. I think something similar will be set up for Chris Jones.

After 2 years of observation, Iím pretty convinced that the best way to build this team for sustained championship contention is placing top priority on defense and offensive line. Especially moving forward.

If Mahomes has consistently good protection and Hill, Kelce, Hardman. Heís going to make shit happen. One way or another.

But to have a good defense to lean on when times are tough is critical I think.

pugsnotdrugs19 12-18-2019 12:15 PM

Terez reinforced on his pod today that KC wants to do a deal with Jones

DJ's left nut 12-18-2019 03:12 PM

Regarding Jones - there MIGHT be a viable replacement on the market for him from Pittsburgh.

Javon Hargrave is probably one of the best interior defenders that you've never heard of. He's damn good and has only looked better this year with Tuitt being injured. He's gonna make some nice money this year but I believe it will likely be a fraction of what Jones is making.

Now realize that Hargrave is doing this while playing the nastiest position in football - a true NT in Pittsburgh. You get him in a 4-3 and let him play a little freer and you could see an even bigger tick up in production. AND you'd get another damn big body in there.

If it's the sort of move that can save you $5-6 million in AAV over the next few years, I think you have to strongly consider it. Hargrave is under the radar for most people but he can be a true nightmare for opponents.

O.city 12-18-2019 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 14664211)
Regarding Jones - there MIGHT be a viable replacement on the market for him from Pittsburgh.

Javon Hargrave is probably one of the best interior defenders that you've never heard of. He's damn good and has only looked better this year with Tuitt being injured. He's gonna make some nice money this year but I believe it will likely be a fraction of what Jones is making.

Now realize that Hargrave is doing this while playing the nastiest position in football - a true NT in Pittsburgh. You get him in a 4-3 and let him play a little freer and you could see an even bigger tick up in production. AND you'd get another damn big body in there.

If it's the sort of move that can save you $5-6 million in AAV over the next few years, I think you have to strongly consider it. Hargrave is under the radar for most people but he can be a true nightmare for opponents.

Maybe.

I'm not keen on bringing in an outside free agent to replace a departing one just because of money. There's always that risk of said guy just not fitting here for one reason or another.

I think they've shoehorned themselves into having to move away from Jones, sadly though, so something will have to be done.

pugsnotdrugs19 12-18-2019 03:18 PM

Yeah no thanks on the Hargrave idea for me. He’s an awesome player, but he’s still going to be pretty expensive. If I’m gonna pay someone at the position, it can be the guy who has earned it here in our own building. And is elite.

Otherwise I’d just roll with Nnadi, Saunders, Pennel, etc. and go cheaper at that spot.

O.city 12-18-2019 03:22 PM

Middlekauf had a good segment on his last podcast about paying players. I think I probably agree.

Anyway, he was basically saying he's willing to overpay a guy or pay a premium for him if he has an elite upside. Guys like Prescott that play really well in a system, you just can't do it because they don't have that elite talent upside. Paying Wentz you can stomach because "atleast he has elite upside and if he can hit that, you get your moneys worth"

So with Jones, he's got elite upside. He can be a top 2 or 3 interior defender in football. I would pay for that.

DJ's left nut 12-18-2019 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14664236)
Middlekauf had a good segment on his last podcast about paying players. I think I probably agree.

Anyway, he was basically saying he's willing to overpay a guy or pay a premium for him if he has an elite upside. Guys like Prescott that play really well in a system, you just can't do it because they don't have that elite talent upside. Paying Wentz you can stomach because "atleast he has elite upside and if he can hit that, you get your moneys worth"

So with Jones, he's got elite upside. He can be a top 2 or 3 interior defender in football. I would pay for that.

Generally speaking I agree - you pay for difference makers; guys with elite skill and ability.

But when you ALSO pay for guys like Okafor and Hitchens or gambles on tools like Watkins fail, then you're left trying to come up with a Plan B. And as far as Plan Bs go, Hargrave could be a hell of a fallback.

The problem is that Hargrave doesn't fit the talent here quite as well in that he's not a guy who's likely to be an asset bouncing out to DE like Jones can if Saunders/Nnadi continue to perform at a high level or excel.

kccrow 12-18-2019 07:54 PM

I'm of the opinion that this draft is strong enough at DT that if you can get a good return on a tag and trade of Jones you do that.

For example, Marvin Wilson would be a baller in this defense in my opinion. Don't know if he'll fall far enough for us to get him, but that's where he's projected right now.

BryanBusby 12-18-2019 09:09 PM

I think this class at IDL is awfully weak.

I like Kinlaw and Brown is stout, but shit it gets thin after they go.

kccrow 12-18-2019 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BryanBusby (Post 14664768)
I think this class at IDL is awfully weak.

I like Kinlaw and Brown is stout, but shit it gets thin after they go.

If Wilson and Lynch declare I don't think so. It's pretty stout in the top 10 DTs.

Davis is solid, then you have Wilson, Lynch, and an already declared Madubuike and Elliott. Murchison, Lawrence, Fotu, offer solid value solid in different ways. Coatney is a sleeper in my opinion.

Chris Meck 12-19-2019 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14664219)
Maybe.

I'm not keen on bringing in an outside free agent to replace a departing one just because of money. There's always that risk of said guy just not fitting here for one reason or another.

I think they've shoehorned themselves into having to move away from Jones, sadly though, so something will have to be done.

I don't think so.


Some guys will be gone, but I don't think Jones will be one of them.

DJ's left nut 12-19-2019 02:06 PM

Man, just take a look at the FA defensive tackle group....

Jones
Leonard Williams
Jarran Reed
A'Shanwn Robinson
DJ Reader
Jordan Phillips
Michael Pierce
Javon Hargrave
Michael Brockers
Suh
Tyler Davison
Quentin Jefferson
Danny SHelton
Maliek Collins
Nick Williams


Now granted there's a pretty big gap between Jones and someone like Williams, but the question becomes whether or not the depth of FA options holds some value down.

Then again, I think there was some thought that the deep safety group in last year's FA class would hold values down there and all it did was damage the middle-class in the lot. The top of the FA pool still got paid in a big way.

Jones is just awfully unique.


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