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Hammock Parties 07-31-2009 11:52 PM

Cassel Chronicles: The Conclusion
 
Warning: this is long. If you don't care about Patriots games skip to the second part. There's some good stuff from Football Outsiders.

http://kan.scout.com/2/883312.html

Over the last two months we’ve reviewed the best and worst of Matt Cassel during eight Patriots games. With training camp set to start Saturday, it’s almost time to move on from Cassel’s past and look to the future. But first, we’ll take one final look at 2008.

With a young team, a new offense and a whole lot of unfamiliarity, there will undoubtedly be plenty of negatives for Cassel over the next few months. So with that in mind, we’ll just focus on the positives from a few more Patriots games last season.

Then we wrap it up with a summation of Cassel and just what he brings to the Chiefs this season.


PATRIOTS VS CARDINALS

1st quarter – 1:49 – 1st-and-10


We’ve covered the difficulties Matt Cassel had last season in hooking up deep with Randy Moss, so it’s nice to see him improve, even if it doesn’t result in a completion. On this play the Patriots fake a handoff and Cassel makes Arizona’s safety bite on a pump fake. This leaves Moss one-on-one with Antrel Rolle deep and Cassel lets it fly.

The throw is magnificent. Rolle actually has decent coverage, but Moss never has to break stride and the ball is placed over his right shoulder, away from the cornerback. It falls perfectly into the receiver’s hands, only to be dropped. Daryl Johnston comments on Cassel’s great pass.

2nd quarter – 13:43 – 2nd-and-12

In the middle of a heavy snowstorm, the Patriots are up 14-0 but pushing for more, lined up in five wide at midfield. The Cardinals only rush four so Cassel has plenty of time to step up into a clean pocket, and he finds Jabar Gaffney down the middle of the field for a huge 34-yard gain.

There’s nothing all that impressive about this throw to be honest. Gaffney is wide open and there’s no pressure on Cassel. But horrible field conditions and the weather make it an impressive play. The field is absolutely covered in snow, and flakes are coming down in buckets at an angle, indicating wind. Visibility is low.

Despite all of that Cassel delivers a strike, hitting Gaffney in stride and enabling him to run after the catch for significant yardage. Also, Cassel passes up an open Wes Welker running a shallow drag route, indicating his willingness to be aggressive even in less-than-favorable conditions. Two plays later the Patriots score a touchdown.


PATRIOTS VS RAMS

1st quarter – 5:24 – 1st-and-10


After a play-action fake, the Patriots send two receivers out, trying for a big play down the field. Cassel’s first read is on the right side, with Randy Moss going deep, but he’s covered, so our quarterback comes all the way back to the left side of the field and spots an open Jabar Gaffney, running an intermediate comeback route.

The impressive part of this play comes as Cassel prepares to make the throw to his left, as a safety is barreling right down on top of him, and is right in his line of sight. It’s not easy to keep your eyes focused down the field with the pass rush closing in, but Cassel simply sets his feet and fires the ball with great accuracy for a 17-yard gain. There’s no hesitation, even though Cassel takes a shot and ends up on his butt at the conclusion of the play.

4th quarter – 10:16 – 1st-and-10

With the Patriots trailing by three and the game winding down, every play becomes more important. Fortunately, Matt Cassel delivers here and gets his offense deeper into St. Louis territory on a drive that eventually culminates in the tying field goal.

The Rams don’t blitz, but there’s pressure up the middle after Cassel completes his first read to the right side of the field. As he snaps his head around to the left, a defensive tackle is right on top of Cassel, and he has no room to step up in the pocket. He still manages to get rid of the ball on time, and even though it’s off his back foot, it’s well placed and an easy 12-yard catch for Randy Moss.

4th quarter – 9:36 – 1st-and-10

The Patriots line up in five wide as they approach the St. Louis goal line and, desperate for a stop, the Rams bring a zone blitz off the right side of the formation. It doesn’t faze Cassel even a bit, however, as he completes his drop and keeps his eyes down the field.

With two defenders barreling down on top of him, Cassel is completely focused on the throw, and it’s a beauty – a perfect 40-yard spiral, lofted toward the left corner of the end zone, right into the hands of Randy Moss, who doesn’t break stride but still drops a sure touchdown. The interesting part of this pass is that again, the coverage is solid. Cassel just makes a throw that’s indefensible.

4th quarter – 3:25 – 1st-and-10

Matt Cassel has brought his team from behind, and has marched them down the field for a potential go-ahead score, but there’s still 15 yards to go for a touchdown. The Patriots decide to put the game in their young quarterback’s hands and line up in five wide, most likely hoping to catch the Rams in man coverage.

That’s because the play is a slant-and-go to Kevin Faulk. Cassel pumps once to try and draw up the linebacker covering Faulk, and then lofts the ball towards the front corner of the end zone. Linebacker Pisa Tinoisamoa actually has great coverage on the play but, again, the pass is so well thrown – Faulk doesn’t have to make much of an adjustment, if any at all - he doesn’t have much of a chance to defend it. The ball drops right in for the game-winning touchdown.


PATRIOTS VS RAIDERS

1st quarter – 8:33 – 2nd-and-11


Already up by a touchdown and threatening for another score, the Patriots run everybody out in the pattern, with Benjamin Watson going up the seam and into the end zone. The Raiders have him well covered however so Matt Cassel turns to the left and Randy Moss, who is actually, again, fairly well covered. Nevertheless, Cassel steps up and fires a dart toward the pylon, right into his receiver’s hands for a touchdown.

The interesting part of this play is Cassel’s apparent willingness to throw to a receiver who was open by only the slimmest margin. He ignored two wide open short options, and instead tried – and succeeded – to make a longer throw that required almost exact precision to complete. Rich Gannon gushes over Cassel’s accuracy in the booth.

3rd quarter – 14:26 – 2nd-and-9

When you’re as accurate a passer as Matt Cassel, sometimes the pass rush and the coverage is pretty much meaningless. That’s the case on this play, which is just an 11-yard gain, but really an unfair one.

Cassel takes the snap and as he begins his throwing motion, Randy Moss is not even four yards down the field. It’s not as if Moss is running a slant, either, he’s just running straight down the field. But Cassel’s timing and accuracy is so perfect, all Moss has to do is plant one foot and lean backwards as the ball arrives.

Of course, there’s no play for Nnamdi Asomugha despite the fact he’s on Moss’ hip the entire way. The throw is too perfect. This is the sort of ridiculous timing you see between quarterbacks and receivers like Peyton Manning and Marvin Harrison. To see it from a first-year starter like Cassel is certainly impressive.


THE CONCLUSION

So we’ve just spent two months reviewing Matt Cassel’s games from last year. What did we learn? What are his strengths and his weaknesses? Why did the Chiefs give up a second-round pick and a wheelbarrow of Hunt money for him? How will his game, without Randy Moss or Wes Welker, translate from New England to Kansas City?

Well, we’re not exactly NFL scouts, but certain things definitely become clear if you pay enough attention. There were obvious patterns – for better or for worse - that repeated themselves in Cassel’s game over the course of the 2008 season. We can break them down into the following categories.


• Accuracy

If nothing else, Cassel’s accuracy separates him from the average NFL quarterback. According to Football Outsiders, he was the 9th most accurate passer in the league last year at 84.6 percent. This was the percentage of his passes which were – referring to the official FO definition – “not marked as Thrown Ahead, Thrown Behind, Overthrown, Underthrown, or Out of Bounds. Does not include passes marked Thrown Away, Tipped at Line, or Hit in Motion.”

There’s no question that percentage bore itself out in Cassel’s play. It didn’t matter which receiver he was throwing to, whether it was Randy Moss, Wes Welker, Jabar Gaffney, Benjamin Watson or Kevin Faulk. He showed the ability to hit all of them in stride, and not just on short routes.

Cassel also showed the rare ability to connect with receivers who were actually well covered at the point of his release. And it’s not as if he was out there throwing jump balls around the yard like Brett Favre. Cassel was simply great at putting it where only his receiver could get it, time and again.

We can probably attribute Cassel’s near-impeccable accuracy to his consistent footwork. Time and again, he showed an affinity for resetting his feet depending on where he wanted to throw the football. It was extremely rare to see him attempt an off-balance throw, although when he had to throw on the run, it wasn’t an issue.

Where Cassel’s accuracy faltered most was on the deep passes over 30 yards, especially to Moss. Fortunately it wasn’t because of a lack of arm strength. At times Cassel actually overthrew Moss.

Inexplicably, Cassel also had a tendency simply to flat miss a throw at times. It didn’t matter if he was throwing on the run or standing still in the pocket. Occasionally, he would just throw up a duck for no apparent reason.

How will Cassel’s accurate passing benefit the Chiefs? The fewer circus catches Dwayne Bowe has to make, the better. And it goes without saying that if Bowe can catch more passes in stride, his yards after the catch average will skyrocket.

Tyler Thigpen, by the way, was ranked 28th in quarterback accuracy by Football Outsiders. It’s also worth noting that Cassel’s completion percentage could have been even higher. The Patriots dropped 30 passes last season, the 12th highest mark in the league (again, we tip our hats to FO).


• Intelligence

There’s no question Cassel’s smarts helped him succeed despite his inexperience last season. How else do you explain his low interception percentage? But what may not be so obvious is just how rarely he was truly fooled by a defense.

Cassel threw 11 interceptions in 2008, which is already a low number, but in watching the games we discovered that at least four of those interceptions were caused by the receiver (I’m looking at you, Randy Moss). And we didn’t watch every game, so the number of turnovers Cassel was actually personally responsible for may be even lower.

The low turnover rate is pretty easily explained – Cassel simply didn’t throw into tight coverage or take chances with the ball that often. He didn’t have to, because he constantly went through his progressions and found the open man again and again.

Even when defenses blitzed Cassel relentlessly, or stacked the line of scrimmage with defenders who dropped out into zones, usually he read the coverage correctly. Early in the season there were a few cases of “happy feet,” the usual symptom of indecision in a quarterback.

But as the weeks wore on, Cassel looked more and more like a quarterback who knew exactly what he was doing on every snap. There weren’t many signs of confusion. He was in control.


• Mobility

The first thing that really became obvious about Cassel was his athleticism. For a 6-foot-4, 230-pound quarterback, he can really move, and racked up 270 rushing yards in 2008.

But those stats don’t tell the whole story. While Cassel was sacked 47 times last season, and has been accused of “holding onto the ball too long,” it really wasn’t as big of a problem as it’s been made out to be. Early in the year the Patriots had issues on their offensive line, and at times Cassel had no chance. Calling on Football Outsiders again, the Patriots ranked third in the NFL in blown blocks, with 25 in 582 pass plays.

When New England sorted out their protection issues around midseason, the sacks drastically dropped, and Cassel’s mobility really helped out at times. Even if he wasn’t scrambling for a first down, he was great at moving outside the pocket and buying time for his receivers (although he rarely needed to do so, because the Patriots executed on offense so well).

But it’s important to note that Cassel was never at any point a run-first, pass-second quarterback. Too often this is an issue with young passers, but in Cassel’s case, most of the time running was a last resort after he went through his progressions and didn’t find anyone open. And frequently he showed decisiveness in escaping the pocket in such situations.

Occasionally, Cassel’s mobility got him into trouble. There were times when he escaped pressure and decided to throw across his body or attempt a throw that required a stronger arm than he possesses. But these instances were infrequent.


• Toughness

As was already noted, Cassel was sacked 47 times a year ago, but he was also hit 88 times, the third-most in the league behind Kurt Warner and David Garrard. Despite that he was never seriously injured and never became gun-shy. He was always willing to stand in the pocket and take a hit to make the play.

Likely, this is an aspect Head Coach Todd Haley really appreciated if he had any say in bringing Cassel to Kansas City. After all, it was Haley who coached Warner last season in Arizona.

Cassel’s toughness also showed up when he ran with the ball. He wasn’t afraid to lead with his helmet when he needed a first down, and though that can be dangerous, his large frame and thick lower body often prevented defenders from laying any serious hits. Actually, at times he was successful in breaking tackles, although no one should compare him to Daunte Culpepper.

Clearly this is an attribute that will be needed in Kansas City. The Chiefs have had their problems on the offensive line, and if the receivers struggle at all this year, Cassel may need to hold on to the ball a little longer than he did in New England.


PROJECTED 2009 SEASON – FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS

COMP-ATT: 299-501
YARDS: 3,277
TDS: 20
INT: 14


WPI “HOMERVISION” ADJUSTMENT

COMP-ATT: 335-543
YDS: 3,463
TD: 24
INT: 10

chiefbowe82 07-31-2009 11:54 PM

We landed on the moon!

kysirsoze 08-01-2009 12:01 AM

Interesting stuff. Makes me even more eager to see what he can do outside of the Patriot offense.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 12:04 AM

Matt Cassel will have a more successful Chiefs career than Trent Green.

You heard it here first.

ArrowheadMagic 08-01-2009 12:10 AM

Cassell is essentially a 2nd yr QB, he is unknown. We spent less on him than we would have on a rookie QB. Except the GM has a knowledge of what he is getting. Sure he has less weapons to work with, OL probably not as good. Wait and see mode..... hope for the best, realize its a completely different situation a new QB has been thrown in. The Chiefs werent just a QB away from a title run. IN all honesty, not sure what to expect from him. Dont think he ends up being the problem..... plenty of holes on defense and skill positions on offense.

ChiefJustice 08-01-2009 12:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939636)
Matt Cassel will have a more successful Chiefs career than Trent Green.

You heard it here first.

All he needs to do is win a playoff game to accomplish that.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 12:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArrowheadMagic (Post 5939647)
Sure he has less weapons to work with, OL probably not as good.

I would disagree with this, at least on the OL point. The Patriots' pass blocking was HORRIBLE for half a season last year. Ask any Pats fans, they'll tell you. And Matt Light didn't have a great season. I'd honestly rather have Branden Albert at this point of their careers.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefJustice (Post 5939650)
All he needs to do is win a play-off game to accomplish that.

OK, well let me put it another way:

Matt Cassel will be a better quarterback than Trent Green.

ArrowheadMagic 08-01-2009 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939636)
Matt Cassel will have a more successful Chiefs career than Trent Green.

You heard it here first.


Very possible. Think this year is the year to see what holes need to be filled. Need Bradley to stay healthy. No given. Engram stays healthy, gives him the same safety blanket, TG would have. Defensively, a whole other thread about the holes.

chiefbowe82 08-01-2009 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArrowheadMagic (Post 5939655)
Very possible. Think this year is the year to see what holes need to be filled. Need Bradley to stay healthy. No given. Engram stays healthy, gives him the same safety blanket, TG would have. Defensively, a whole other thread about the holes.

engram being the same safety blanket as gonzo?

thats taking it to far imo

ArrowheadMagic 08-01-2009 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939651)
I would disagree with this, at least on the OL point. The Patriots' pass blocking was HORRIBLE for half a season last year. Ask any Pats fans, they'll tell you. And Matt Light didn't have a great season. I'd honestly rather have Branden Albert at this point of their careers.


Probably better than what we have.... Truely debatable. Yes on taking Albert over any lineman in NE.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939654)
OK, well let me put it another way:

Matt Cassel will be a better quarterback than Trent Green.

God I hope so.

ArrowheadMagic 08-01-2009 12:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_CHIEFS_06 (Post 5939658)
engram being the same safety blanket as gonzo?

thats taking it to far imo


Why's that? You telling me a vet WR cant find a hole and be reliable to catch a ball? He isnt the name that TG is..... for fans..... but easily can do what TG did. Red Zone, not so much. Between the 20's, actually brings more value than TG. Just have to find that sure hand, big body guy in the red zone. Thats where we lack..... the whole Chiefsplanet ...over value TE's crew loses steam here. Its why teams went after Gates and BBall players ,was for the red zone.

Tiger's Fan 08-01-2009 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots (Post 5939688)
God I hope so.

Trent Green didn't lose most of those games, but I wouldn't expect you to understand that.

Micjones 08-01-2009 01:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939636)
Matt Cassel will have a more successful Chiefs career than Trent Green.

You heard it here first.

That's a hell of a limb to go out on.
Here are Trent Green's numbers during his tenure as a Chief:
1,720 Completions
2,777 Attempts
62% Completion Percentage
21,000+ Passing Yards
118 Passing TD's

I HOPE you're right, but I'm not so sure...
Green's been the best QB this franchise has ever known not named Len Dawson.

Mojo Rising 08-01-2009 02:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArrowheadMagic (Post 5939689)
Why's that? You telling me a vet WR cant find a hole and be reliable to catch a ball? He isnt the name that TG is..... for fans..... but easily can do what TG did. Red Zone, not so much. Between the 20's, actually brings more value than TG. Just have to find that sure hand, big body guy in the red zone. Thats where we lack..... the whole Chiefsplanet ...over value TE's crew loses steam here. Its why teams went after Gates and BBall players ,was for the red zone.

TG didn't have to find a hole in the zone. That's what made him a security blanket. If the QB had a guy in his face and no-one open he could throw a jumpball to TG and if he didn't catch it he would at least shield the defender from the Int.

He can not do what TG did. Not even close.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Micjones (Post 5939709)
That's a hell of a limb to go out on.
Here are Trent Green's numbers during his tenure as a Chief:
1,720 Completions
2,777 Attempts
62% Completion Percentage
21,000+ Passing Yards
118 Passing TD's

I HOPE you're right, but I'm not so sure...
Green's been the best QB this franchise has ever known not named Len Dawson.

Here's what I think about Cassel vs Green.

Accuracy: Edge Cassel
Arm: Edge Cassel
Mobility: Big edge to Cassel
Intelligence: Slight edge to Green (haven't seen Cassel play enough, don't know how he'll fare on another team)
Experience: Edge Green

Cassel is 27. If he plays 7 years here he'll easily shatter Green's passing numbers.

Mojo Rising 08-01-2009 02:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Micjones (Post 5939709)
That's a hell of a limb to go out on.
Here are Trent Green's numbers during his tenure as a Chief:
1,720 Completions
2,777 Attempts
62% Completion Percentage
21,000+ Passing Yards
118 Passing TD's

I HOPE you're right, but I'm not so sure...
Green's been the best QB this franchise has ever known not named Len Dawson.

Joe Montana was a much better QB for KC than Green. Green had a better supporting cast and offensive system. Montana, even at his age as a Chiefs, was a better QB.

Mecca 08-01-2009 02:45 AM

I don't think Cassel is more accurate than Green...I think they both hold the ball to long though.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 02:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca (Post 5939733)
I don't think Cassel is more accurate than Green...I think they both hold the ball to long though.

Wrong on both counts.

And don't get me started about throwing on the run. Green sucked at it. Cassel does it in his sleep.

Mojo Rising 08-01-2009 03:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939742)
Wrong on both counts.

And don't get me started about throwing on the run. Green sucked at it. Cassel does it in his sleep.

How can he do it in his sleep? He has 15 career starts in the NFL and College.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 03:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mojo Rising (Post 5939748)
How can he do it in his sleep? He has 15 career starts in the NFL and College.

It's an innate ability. Some guys have it, some don't. Jake Plummer was great at it. So was Montana. Green sucked balls throwing on the run.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 03:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939750)
It's an innate ability. Some guys have it, some don't. Jake Plummer was great at it. So was Montana. Green sucked balls throwing on the run.

Cassel can throw on the "trot".

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 03:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots (Post 5939751)
Cassel can throw on the "trot".

What the **** is that supposed to mean? The dude has wheels.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 03:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939752)
What the **** is that supposed to mean? The dude has wheels.

It means there's a difference between running and doing the "Quarterback Pocket Escape-Trot".

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 03:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots (Post 5939753)
It means there's a difference between running and doing the "Quarterback Pocket Escape-Trot".

The guy had 60 yards rushing in ONE game. Saying he trots is ignorant.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 03:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939754)
The guy had 60 yards rushing in ONE game. Saying he trots is ignorant.

Jesus ****ing Christ, you.

Let me put it like this, and hopefully you will finally understand the ****ing difference:

Pocket Mobility, Chiefs-Style:

Gannon was a runner.

Elvis was a trotter.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 03:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots (Post 5939755)
Jesus ****ing Christ, you.

Let me put it like this, and hopefully you will finally understand the ****ing difference:

Pocket Mobility, Chiefs-Style:

Gannon was a runner.

Elvis was a trotter.

Cassel is more mobile than Grbac was.

No question.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 03:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939756)
Cassel is more mobile than Grbac was.

No question.

He's better at making ground yardage if he has to than Grbac, no question there.

Mojo Rising 08-01-2009 03:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939750)
It's an innate ability. Some guys have it, some don't. Jake Plummer was great at it. So was Montana. Green sucked balls throwing on the run.

Innate ability or someone to throw to? Plummer was much better throwing on the run when he had talented WR's in Denver. Montana had much more success sliding in the pocket and completing passes to Rice, Taylor and Jones than Lake Dawson and Keith Cash.

Before coronating Cassell as the second coming I would see how he performs with a below average OL, running game and receivers.

Moss' size and speed covers up a lot of mistakes. As does the hoodies system.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 03:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mojo Rising (Post 5939758)
Innate ability or someone to throw to? Plummer was much better throwing on the run when he had talented WR's in Denver. Montana had much more success sliding in the pocket and completing passes to Rice, Taylor and Jones than Lake Dawson and Keith Cash.

No no no...that's complete garbage.

Plummer threw well on the run in Arizona. Montana threw well on the run in Kansas City.

Green sucked balls, even WITH Tony Gonzalez. His balls took nosedives half the time when he tried to throw on the run.

It has absolutely nothing to do with the receiver. Nothing at all.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 03:30 AM

See here's the thing; I don't give a **** if he out-runs LJ for total ground yards, I want to see him out-scramble pressuring defenders, avoid 40+sacks, and complete passes on the run.

If he does that consistently and brings the team to an NFL Championship; Len Dawson has an equal.

Mecca 08-01-2009 03:37 AM

I would seriously hope Cassel moves and throws better on the run than Green. Green had a surgically reconstructed knee and didn't like to move. If guys even got around him it ****ed with him.

So throwing that out there isn't some huge shining compliment.

Cassel's issues are as follows, bad deep ball, inconsistent accuracy to the middle of the field, holds the ball to long and shockingly wide splits in stats from shotgun to under center.

Those are his major issues that he needs to work on.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 03:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots (Post 5939760)
See here's the thing; I don't give a **** if he out-runs LJ for total ground yards, I want to see him out-scramble pressuring defenders, avoid 40+sacks, and complete passes on the run.

Uh, he does all of that. I think that's already been explained.

You sound like someone who hasn't watched Cassel play ONE game.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 03:41 AM

If only Cassel could run.

http://i27.tinypic.com/mbgv46.gif

Mojo Rising 08-01-2009 03:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939759)
No no no...that's complete garbage.

Plummer threw well on the run in Arizona. Montana threw well on the run in Kansas City.

Green sucked balls, even WITH Tony Gonzalez. His balls took nosedives half the time when he tried to throw on the run.

It has absolutely nothing to do with the receiver. Nothing at all.

Plummer and Montana might have thrown well on the run with both teams. Their ability didn't change with their uniforms.

However, their circumstances did. With the Cards and Chiefs Plummer and Montana had less time before they had to run, less time to run and less options when they did.

With nothing more than 15 games of experience, (College and Pros), let us see how he performs driving a Yugo vs. a Ferrarri.

Keep in mind that the last year Offense he lead (?) broke the record the prior year in too many categories for me to look up now. The Offense he is stepping into was .... well... offensive.

He needs someone to throw to, someone to block for him and someone to divert the attention on the pass game. He has none. He doesn't even have a RB that can protect the QB.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 03:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939763)
Uh, he does all of that. I think that's already been explained.

You sound like someone who hasn't watched Cassel play ONE game.

:spock:

Uh, if he does that; why was he on his ass looking at the stars 40 ****ing times in 2008?
And I have watched the mother****er play, so kiss my ass. And the next time you service him, tell him to work on tightening up that spiral too please.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 03:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939764)
If only Cassel could run.

http://i27.tinypic.com/mbgv46.gif

If only Cassel could shuck one "blow-by" defender in the backfield!

You're really not getting this, are you?

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 03:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mojo Rising (Post 5939765)
Plummer and Montana might have thrown well on the run with both teams. Their ability didn't change with their uniforms.
.

Neither will Cassel's. You don't seem to get it. He throws well on the run. When he's running, the ball comes out with velocity and accuracy. He could be throwing to a cheerleader. It would be irrelevant. He would hit the bitch in stride.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 03:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots (Post 5939768)
If only Cassel could shuck one "blow-by" defender in the backfield!

You're really not getting this, are you?

Do you see Dwight Freeney gaining on him?

The mother****er doesn't trot.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 03:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots (Post 5939766)
Uh, if he does that; why was he on his ass looking at the stars 40 ****ing times in 2008?

That has already been explained. The Patriots had major protection issues early in the season.

You really don't get it. And he throws a tight ****ing spiral. Jesus CHRIST, you HAVEN'T watched him play.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 03:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939771)
Do you see Dwight Freeney gaining on him?

The mother****er doesn't trot.

Yes, I saw him capitalize and make hay, but you're not understanding what I'm trying to tell you.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 03:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939772)
That has already been explained. The Patriots had major protection issues early in the season.

You really don't get it. And he throws a tight ****ing spiral. Jesus CHRIST, you HAVEN'T watched him play.

You are full of shit.ROFL

Titty Meat 08-01-2009 03:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca (Post 5939762)
I would seriously hope Cassel moves and throws better on the run than Green. Green had a surgically reconstructed knee and didn't like to move. If guys even got around him it ****ed with him.

So throwing that out there isn't some huge shining compliment.

Cassel's issues are as follows, bad deep ball, inconsistent accuracy to the middle of the field, holds the ball to long and shockingly wide splits in stats from shotgun to under center.

Those are his major issues that he needs to work on.

Really? I saw him throw a pass vs the Colts on the money to Gaffney for a touchdown and he dropped it.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 03:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots (Post 5939773)
Yes, I saw him capitalize and make hay, but you're not understanding what I'm trying to tell you.

No, I understand completely.

What YOU don't get is that Cassel is a hell of a lot better than you're willing to give him credit for.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 03:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939776)
No, I understand completely.

What YOU don't get is that Cassel is a hell of a lot better than you're willing to give him credit for.

:banghead:

Titty Meat 08-01-2009 03:52 AM

People on here hate on Cassel. Before the Chiefs traded for him they said he was the reason the Patriots didn't make the playoffs.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 03:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billay (Post 5939778)
People on here hate on Cassel. Before the Chiefs traded for him they said he was the reason the Patriots didn't make the playoffs.

:banghead:

















Beer please.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 03:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots (Post 5939774)
You are full of shit.ROFL

No, you are. Just yesterday I watched Cassel throw a perfect spiral 40 yards down the field to Moss, right into his hands for a score. Moss dropped it.

Titty Meat 08-01-2009 03:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots (Post 5939779)
:banghead:















Beer please.


Was it his fault they couldnt defend the wildcat?

mikey23545 08-01-2009 03:57 AM

That's cute, the way you're pretending to have a dialogue with yourself, GoSuck...You and Raised on Rats must <i>surely</i> be two different people....

Mojo Rising 08-01-2009 03:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939769)
Neither will Cassel's. You don't seem to get it. He throws well on the run. When he's running, the ball comes out with velocity and accuracy. He could be throwing to a cheerleader. It would be irrelevant. He would hit the bitch in stride.

I do get it. There is less velocity and accuracy required in an offense that broke almost every record the prior year.

He will be throwing to Bowe, Cottam and Engram. He will have Johnson covering his blind side. How many games do you think he will really last?

It is a team sport. If I were a betting man I would lay money that Cassell will become the next Scott Mitchell before he becomes the next Brett Favre.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 03:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939780)
No, you are. Just yesterday I watched Cassel throw a perfect spiral 40 yards down the field to Moss, right into his hands for a score. Moss dropped it.

Are you seriously going to try and tell me that every pass he throws is perfectly tight and beautiful? Is this what you're saying to me?

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 04:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikey23545 (Post 5939782)
That's cute, the way you're pretending to have a dialogue with yourself, GoSuck...You and Raised on Rats must surely be two different people....

Oh look; it's Mikey! Yay!

Well, it was fun Mr. Douche and Run; see ya' 300 posts from now. Buh-Bye!

BossChief 08-01-2009 04:02 AM

I rarely say this but never fail to give credit where it is due.

Good read!

A couple things from the Boss:

Cassel isnt bad at throwing passes over 30 yards, he was TERRIBLE at it...3-26 over the course of the year.

Cassel was instructed to take sacks rather than risk turnovers.

Collinsworth said many times that Cassels problem early on and till about week 11 or 12 was that if his first two reads were covered, he took his eyes off his recievers and focused them on the passrush. Once he overcame that, he really excelled. Hopefully he continues to progress and doesnt fall back on bad habits for us when players arent routinely open as was the case in NE.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 04:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billay (Post 5939781)
Was it his fault they couldnt defend the wildcat?

Come again?

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 04:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots (Post 5939784)
Are you seriously going to try and tell me that every pass he throws is perfectly tight and beautiful? Is this what you're saying to me?

No. But he can throw a tight spiral.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 04:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mojo Rising (Post 5939783)
I do get it. There is less velocity and accuracy required in an offense that broke almost every record the prior year.

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BossChief 08-01-2009 04:04 AM

I rarely say this but never fail to give credit where it is due.

Good read!

A couple things from the Boss:

Cassel isnt bad at throwing passes over 30 yards, he was TERRIBLE at it...3-26 over the course of the year.

Cassel was instructed to take sacks rather than risk turnovers.

Collinsworth said many times that Cassels problem early on and till about week 11 or 12 was that if his first two reads were covered, he took his eyes off his recievers and focused them on the passrush. Once he overcame that, he really excelled. Hopefully he continues to progress and doesnt fall back on bad habits for us when players arent routinely open as was the case in NE.

I look for Cassel to start kinda slow, but show mental toughness well enough to pull out of it and have some great games in the second half of the year.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 04:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939788)
No. But he can throw a tight spiral.

Does he do it consistently, and in the face of pressure?

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 04:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 5939786)

Cassel isnt bad at throwing passes over 30 yards, he was TERRIBLE at it...3-26 over the course of the year.

His receivers weren't great at catching them. I saw Moss drop at LEAST two passes over 30 yards. Gaffney dropped one.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 04:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots (Post 5939791)
Does he do it consistently, and in the face of pressure?

That wasn't what you insinuated. You insinuated he couldn't do it. Of course you also think he trots.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 04:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939789)
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That was one LOVELY wobble-rocket!

Yeah, yeah; it worked.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 04:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raised On Riots (Post 5939795)
That was one LOVELY wobble-rocket!

Yeah, yeah; it worked.

It was raining you dipshit.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 04:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939796)
It was raining you dipshit.

ROFL Keep 'em coming Howard Cosell.

Mojo Rising 08-01-2009 04:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939789)
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If Croyle had the time and a big, fast WR like Moss to throw to he could have hit him too. Cassell will not have a pocket to step into. He does not have WR's who will get the type of seperation he is used to.

I do not think he will last until...IF....the new regime does support him with talent. Albert might last.

Derrick Johnson, Tamba Hali, Dorsey...even Dwayne Bowe do not live up to there 1st round selections. You can not have that many misses and expect to compete. Cassell might have been a good player but no one will know because of where he came from and what he is walking into.

Mecca 08-01-2009 04:17 AM

Even if you add those in it's still a very poor number, he doesn't have a bad deep because of a bad arm, his arm is above average. He's just not accurate with his throws down the field, some of them looked like he just threw to a wide open area of field where no one really had any chance of catching it on either team.

His issues are things that can be worked upon, as of now those are his most pressing issues he needs to improve on.

Also that gif is a bad example because the way a guy moves when he's moving to throw and moving to run aren't the same. Matt Cassel is athletic when he tucks and runs like that he can move pretty well. Most guys trot when they move to throw because no one wants to throw while running at full speed because it jacks with your motion.

If Cassel can vastly improve his play from center while showing better deep ball accuracy that would be a huge huge improvement to his game. His middle of the field stuff you would think would come with time and playing more.

I expect more picks because I don't think the Chiefs are going to tell him if your first read isn't open take the sack, but that goes with the process. I want to see fast reads and progressions and the ball coming out at a good rate.

Mecca 08-01-2009 04:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mojo Rising (Post 5939802)
If Croyle had the time and a big, fast WR like Moss to throw to he could have hit him too. Cassell will not have a pocket to step into. He does not have WR's who will get the type of seperation he is used to.

I do not think he will last until...IF....the new regime does support him with talent. Albert might last.

Derrick Johnson, Tamba Hali, Dorsey...even Dwayne Bowe do not live up to there 1st round selections. You can not have that many misses and expect to compete. Cassell might have been a good player but no one will know because of where he came from and what he is walking into.

If Bowe isn't good this year he'll have no one to throw too....I do have some wonder if they'll be able to get enough out of the Oline so Cassel can survive the first 2 months.

Pioli Zombie 08-01-2009 04:19 AM

That sounds like a bullshit statistic. I'm curious, what was Peyton Mannings over 30 yards ratio? I doubt there are too many qbs with a good one.

Its like the "record vs playoff teams". Like when you hear "this guy sucks. In his career he wins 80 percent against team with losing records but only 46 against playoff teams". Duh. No shit.
Posted via Mobile Device

Mecca 08-01-2009 04:22 AM

It's not even so much the stat, if you've watched him play or talk to people that have on a consistent basis his deep ball is the first thing that is brought up as something he doesn't do well.

He's just not accurate with it at all, he hit a few and missed badly with alot. No one respects your deep ball if when you throw it you miss by a huge degree.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 04:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mojo Rising (Post 5939802)
If Croyle had the time and a big, fast WR like Moss to throw to he could have hit him too. Cassell will not have a pocket to step into. He does not have WR's who will get the type of seperation he is used to.

Sorry, this is just ridiculous.

Cassel looked awesome throwing to JABAR GAFFNEY.

Is Jabar Gaffney better than Dwayne Bowe?

Is he even better than Bobby Engram or Mark Bradley?

Pioli Zombie 08-01-2009 04:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca (Post 5939808)
It's not even so much the stat, if you've watched him play or talk to people that have on a consistent basis his deep ball is the first thing that is brought up as something he doesn't do well.

He's just not accurate with it at all, he hit a few and missed badly with alot. No one respects your deep ball if when you throw it you miss by a huge degree.

I watched consistantly and by the end of the season he was throwing them fine. Matt Cassel is hardly the thing Chiefs fans need to worry about.
Posted via Mobile Device

Mojo Rising 08-01-2009 04:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca (Post 5939804)
If Bowe isn't good this year he'll have no one to throw too....I do have some wonder if they'll be able to get enough out of the Oline so Cassel can survive the first 2 months.

Bowe = Lamar Odom. Physical skills that should determine dominance matched with an inconsistent effort. They will come up big in games that you don't need. Disappear in games that you need. Without Kobe, and Phil...Lamrs fate would be the same as Bowe's.

I can see Bowe walking as a FA because he is a CP guy. Then dogging it in the playoffs and then making the SB winning 1st down or TD for the Eagles, Pats or Giants.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 04:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca (Post 5939803)
I expect more picks because I don't think the Chiefs are going to tell him if your first read isn't open take the sack

What the hell.

Cassel was a hell of a lot more than a one-read quarterback last year.

Sweet Daddy Hate 08-01-2009 04:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca (Post 5939808)
It's not even so much the stat, if you've watched him play or talk to people that have on a consistent basis his deep ball is the first thing that is brought up as something he doesn't do well.

He's just not accurate with it at all, he hit a few and missed badly with alot. No one respects your deep ball if when you throw it you miss by a huge degree.

Not to be overly obvious, but it's a nice threat to have. Especially when the modern air-game so dominantly 30 yards or less per-pass distance on average.

BossChief 08-01-2009 04:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939793)
His receivers weren't great at catching them. I saw Moss drop at LEAST two passes over 30 yards. Gaffney dropped one.

you talking the Moss that broke the nfl record for td receptions the year before?

Cassel overthrew many more passes to Moss than he actually dropped.

After ten or so games, he got much better at timing with his recievers and I look for it to take at least 6 or seven before he does here as well. His deep ball will take more time.

I wish Gaffney hadnt signed with Denver so quick, he would have been a good addition we surely would have added.

Hammock Parties 08-01-2009 04:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 5939817)
you talking the Moss that broke the nfl record for td receptions the year before?
.

Yes, I am.

And Moss dropped AT LEAST three touchdown passes last year.

Mecca 08-01-2009 04:32 AM

Actually it's a valid concern because the talent he's playing with is vastly different.

Cassel could have a horrendous year while doing exactly what he did in NE and people will completely flip out if it happens.

I don't think any receiver the Chiefs send out will get a double team, so someone is going to have to establish themselves as someone the defense is worried about. Bowe is the likely candidate but he'll have to prove he can he's always just been singled before with Gonzalez being here.

A lot of how Cassel looks this year is going to come down to Larry Johnson, if he can atleast be good enough I think Cassel will be alright, if he's not Cassel is going to get his brains beat in behind the line.

Mecca 08-01-2009 04:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939814)
What the hell.

Cassel was a hell of a lot more than a one-read quarterback last year.

He was only more than 1 read when he was in the shotgun...late in the year he was exclusively in the shotgun because of how wide of a difference he is from that to under center.

But it was also obvious when watching them play that was told at some point not to take huge chances and to take a sack or tuck it and run instead of turning it over.

I think his sack number from last year is a little overblown because he took some sacks instead of taking a risk numerous times.

I think he'll get sacked less and probably not hold the ball as long but end up throwing more picks because of the different situation and team.

Rausch 08-01-2009 04:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 5939789)
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**** this.

Here's where I have to step in.

You don't get to quote Dr. Cox.

EVER.

Not for any reason, or to help relay any thought you might have that he could clearly better illustrate.

YOU ARE DR. DORIAN.

You're the guy Cox would ****ing ridicule until the sun set and when he went to sleep would dream of new ways to emasculate come the morning.


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