ChiefsPlanet

ChiefsPlanet (http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/index.php)
-   D.C. (http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/forumdisplay.php?f=30)
-   -   Elections My favorite thing of this election so far... (http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=263488)

Direckshun 09-10-2012 09:01 PM

My favorite thing of this election so far...
 
...has to be Romney's selection of Paul Ryan as his running mate.

You guys do understand this is the guy the Obama campaign has been attempting to pin the entire Republican Party against? That polling for the DNC suggested that telling people Republicans want to privatize social security and turn Medicare into a voucher system was the ticket to victory?

So Obama mentions the guy over and over again, which further raises his profile, and he becomes a poster boy for the Republican Party, because they just can't help themselves. If Obama hates the guy, let's turn him into a hero.

Romney's own advisors, it seems, encouraged Romney not to make this selection. Reportedly it was a decision Romney and his family made intimately.

It's not exactly Sarah Palin, because Sarah Palin was an idiot, whereas Paul Ryan is very smart.

It's about how to frame yourself every election. But the Romney message would ideally being about self-reliance and individualism. Adding Ryan to the ticket takes it even further, and tells the American people: you will be on your own.

Romney and Ryan have been playing defense ever since Ryan's been added to the ticket. And Romney has done the absolute worst thing you can do with Ryan, and has handcuffed him from presenting too many specifics about what he'd like to see done with policy. You shouldn't select Ryan unless you truly unleash the guy to answer 1,001 questions about his budget, which he's willing and capable and EAGER to do.

This may have been a double-whammy, as well. If Romney loses this election, and the numbers right now don't look great, this might very well be the anchor around Ryan's national ambitions past this election.

BigRedChief 09-10-2012 09:07 PM

He also seems to play fast and loose with the truth. Not the usual politician lies but real ones.

Romeny immediately put the focus on medicare instead of the economy. Really bad poilitical move.

Swanman 09-10-2012 09:53 PM

Romney/Ryan has a chance to be a worse campaign that McCain/Palin, and I thought that was impossible. They can't even figure out what their message is.

Romney first says he wants a complete repeal of Obamacare, then says Sunday morning that he would like to keep certain things like the part about pre-existing conditions. Then later that day his staff release a press release basically saying he didn't really mean it and he wants a complete repeal.

Ryan gets asked about question about weed and he says he is ok with the states deciding on the law, then the campaign comes out the next day and says whoops, the Romney/Ryan ticket is against all weed. Not to mention, every time he opens his mouth a lie spews forth. And the fact that he looks like a creepy Bond villain.

If they don't get their stories straight before the debates, it could get real ugly for the both of them.

cosmo20002 09-11-2012 12:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swanman (Post 8900282)
Romney/Ryan has a chance to be a worse campaign that McCain/Palin, and I thought that was impossible. They can't even figure out what their message is.

Romney first says he wants a complete repeal of Obamacare, then says Sunday morning that he would like to keep certain things like the part about pre-existing conditions. Then later that day his staff release a press release basically saying he didn't really mean it and he wants a complete repeal.

Ryan gets asked about question about weed and he says he is ok with the states deciding on the law, then the campaign comes out the next day and says whoops, the Romney/Ryan ticket is against all weed. Not to mention, every time he opens his mouth a lie spews forth. And the fact that he looks like a creepy Bond villain.

If they don't get their stories straight before the debates, it could get real ugly for the both of them.

This has been Mitt's problem since the day he announced. I'm not sure if there is a single major issue that he hasn't done a 180 on dating back to when he was governor and more recently. Not just the usual political shading, but full 180-degree flips. Abortion, gay issues, healthcare, economic issues, taxes, etc. Every response he gives makes him do pretzel-like contortions.

Taco John 09-11-2012 01:33 AM

in fairness, Ryan adds an important constituency that Romney was having a very hard time getting on his own: Republican voters.

|Zach| 09-11-2012 04:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taco John (Post 8900795)
in fairness, Ryan adds an important constituency that Romney was having a very hard time getting on his own: Republican voters.

Haha.

patteeu 09-11-2012 06:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief (Post 8900090)
He also seems to play fast and loose with the truth. Not the usual politician lies but real ones.

LOL It's funny what you believe.

Lightrise 09-11-2012 06:03 AM

I was shocked by the Ryan pick. It was political suicide and so far you've seen this every day on the campaign trail since he was picked. He is an interesting guy but in my view not presidential material. He has never been able to inspire, and that's what separates the men from the boys. Santorum was the only candidate who could inspire.

It was a mistake for the republicans to float Portman for so long. It should have always been Rubio.

BucEyedPea 09-11-2012 07:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief (Post 8900090)
He also seems to play fast and loose with the truth. Not the usual politician lies but real ones.

Romeny immediately put the focus on medicare instead of the economy. Really bad poilitical move.

Like Obama, Bush and Mitt.

BucEyedPea 09-11-2012 07:13 AM

Ryan gives Mitt the values voters, but I think he was going to get them anyway. They're not going anywhere. Mitt would have been smarter to try to get the Independent voters.

DementedLogic 09-11-2012 07:32 AM

If Romney loses this election, it won't be because of Paul Ryan. It will be because he is Mitt Romney. Voters aren't looking for another moderate progressive like Bush. Independent voters don't want Obama for another 4 years, but they sure as hell don't want Romney for 8 either.

steve_minor 09-11-2012 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swanman (Post 8900282)
Romney/Ryan has a chance to be a worse campaign that McCain/Palin, and I thought that was impossible. They can't even figure out what their message is.

Romney first says he wants a complete repeal of Obamacare, then says Sunday morning that he would like to keep certain things like the part about pre-existing conditions. Then later that day his staff release a press release basically saying he didn't really mean it and he wants a complete repeal.

Ryan gets asked about question about weed and he says he is ok with the states deciding on the law, then the campaign comes out the next day and says whoops, the Romney/Ryan ticket is against all weed. Not to mention, every time he opens his mouth a lie spews forth. And the fact that he looks like a creepy Bond villain.

If they don't get their stories straight before the debates, it could get real ugly for the both of them.

Your viewpoint shows whats wrong with politics today. Where are the people that can understand politics and have an understanding of how American Government is suppose to function?

There are things in the Affordable Healthcare Act that everyone agrees on. So why when Romeny mentions some, does that void his desire to repeal it? He wants to repeal it and then replace it with some of the things in it and hopefully something that isn't a government takeover of healthcare.

Then you talk about Ryan like a bitter wife. "You NEVER take out the garbage" = You forgot for the first time in 2 months. You words "Not to mention, every time he opens his mouth a lie spews forth." Really every time ... do you have a mind that can process information?

States Rights - Do some research. Read the book "Power Divided is Power Checked"

I don't like either ticket, but will vote for Romney. I think Obama has does nothing to fix the economy in 4 years. Why would I give him 4 more?

Amnorix 09-11-2012 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief (Post 8900090)
He also seems to play fast and loose with the truth. Not the usual politician lies but real ones.

Romeny immediately put the focus on medicare instead of the economy. Really bad poilitical move.

Quote:

Originally Posted by patteeu (Post 8900845)
LOL It's funny what you believe.


From the funny and brilliant Tuesday Morning Quarterback author, Gregg Easterbrook, who is a libertarian and invariably includes political commentary (usually whacking both parties for various stupidities):


Quote:

ankrupt Logic: Organizations err, and individuals make mistakes. Trust me, I have plenty of experience! So perhaps vice presidential candidate Paul Ryan's boast that he ran a sub-three-hour marathon, when the actual time was more than four hours -- followed by his weird statement that the claim of track-star time was "the best of his recollection" -- was just a pair of dumb errors.

But there's so much difference between three-hour and four-hour marathons that this is as if a White House candidate boasted, "I won the World Series with a grand slam in the bottom of the ninth," then later said, "That was the best of my recollection. I meant to say that I play softball at picnics." When your columnist was on the dating scene, girls chased me everywhere. That's the best of my recollection, anyway.

He's also run a mile in under three minutes.
But though to err is human, it is a warning sign when politicians make things up, hoping they will never be fact-checked. In his convention speech, Ryan gave considerable emphasis to his claim that 1.4 million businesses filed for bankruptcy in 2011, far more than the 330,000 that did so in the final year of the Jimmy Carter administration. Turns out 47,086, not 1.4 million, is the correct number for 2011. Ryan drastically overstated, in order to make things sound much worse than they are. But, his campaign asserted, since the correct figure for the final Carter year is 43,694, Ryan's basic point was right -- more business bankruptcies last year under Obama than in Carter's final year.

How could Ryan have been off by such a gigantic margin? There are 6 million businesses with employees in the United States. If 1.4 million had gone bankrupt in 2011, that would mean 23 percent of American businesses folded in a single year. Calamity! Every fourth store or office you passed would be boarded up. The actual figure represents 0.7 percent of American businesses closing last year. Ryan presents himself to the electorate as a leading expert in economic policy. Yet he was able to read the claim that 1.4 million businesses folded in a single year without saying to himself, "This number cannot possibly be right." An actual expert in economic policy would have known the 1.4 million figure was way off.

Now think about Ryan's claim that regardless, his basic point was on target. Since Carter's final year in office, the U.S. population has grown 36 percent. Other things being equal, we'd expect business bankruptcies to grow by about the same percentage. Instead, 2011 business bankruptcies were 7.8 percent higher than the final Carter year -- a decline, relative to population.

Because the population is rising, practically everything sets a record each year. In 2011, there were more haircuts and cheesesteaks than during Carter's final year, too! Consider the common statement "there are more people today with cancer than ever before," which like Ryan's corrected number is true but misleading. What's important is the rate of cancer -- is it up or down per capita? ( It's down.) In economics, per capita or GDP-adjusted comparisons are what count. Ryan presents himself to the nation as an expert on economic policy. An actual expert would have used adjusted numbers.

Now let's check the tables of the American Bankruptcy Institute. During the Ronald Reagan presidency, business bankruptcies averaged 67,845 per year. During the Obama presidency, business bankruptcies have averaged 54,975. Adjusting for population growth, business bankruptcies under Obama are 40 percent lower than they were under Reagan.

Probably in both cases, Reagan and Obama, the numbers are driven largely by economic trends beyond the control of the White House. But to the extent presidential policy matters, Reagan was a free-market conservative -- the sort of person who believes a failing business should be allowed to fail. Obama is a liberal -- the sort of person who believes a failing business should get government help. No surprise, then, that far more businesses failed annually under Reagan.

Ryan denounced the automaker bailout. If government aid to business is bad, as Ryan says, then inevitably, more business bankruptcies will occur. But he also says that's bad!

http://espn.go.com/espn/playbook/sto...nfl-powerhouse

patteeu 09-11-2012 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amnorix (Post 8901143)
From the funny and brilliant Tuesday Morning Quarterback author, Gregg Easterbrook, who is a libertarian and invariably includes political commentary (usually whacking both parties for various stupidities):

Do you really think misremembering your time in a marathon from decades ago is "not the usual politician [lie] but a real one"? It's absurd to put that untruth which may or may not have been intentional above such things as "my budget will cut the deficit by $4 trillion over 10 years" or "the healthcare bill will not increase the deficit by one dime".

This effort by supporters of Barack Obama (and Bill Clinton, I might add) to define Paul Ryan as an extraordinary liar even by politician standards is absurd.

steve_minor 09-11-2012 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patteeu (Post 8901156)
Do you really think misremembering your time in a marathon from decades ago is "not the usual politician [lie] but a real one"? It's absurd to put that untruth which may or may not have been intentional above such things as "my budget will cut the deficit by $4 trillion over 10 years" or "the healthcare bill will not increase the deficit by one dime".

This effort by supporters of Barack Obama (and Bill Clinton, I might add) to define Paul Ryan as an extraordinary liar even by politician standards is absurd.

What else do they have to stand on. They can only cut down their oppenent to below their canidate. Unless they have a list of amazing things that have changed for the better in the last 4 years?


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:32 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.