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-   -   Obama **The Obamacare Shitfest thread** (http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=278100)

petegz28 10-29-2013 07:38 PM

**The Obamacare Shitfest thread**
 
At the rate this thing is falling apart I figures it's time for a game-style thread for this abortion of a law.

This is what we get from lawmakers who don't even read the law...

1. Web site crashes...no one tested it
2. Insurance policies being canceled even after Obama stated multiple times you can keep your insurance if you like it
3. Valerie Jarrett says blame the insurance companies
4. Insurance companies say "we are just following the law"
5. HHS neutered the "Grandfather" clause with multiple regulations
6. Jay Carney tells us what the President "really meant" and that we were all just too stupid to "get it"
7. IRS knew as soon as 2010 that over 50% of individual insurance policy holders would lose coverage
8. Men are being forced to carry "maternity coverage"
9. Women who cannot get pregnant are being forced to carry "maternity coverage"
10. We keep getting told this is "affordable" yet deductible seem to be going up as well as premiums on balance
11. The Fed Gov won't tell us how many people have actually signed up
13. Obama knew nothing about any of it

LiveSteam 10-29-2013 07:41 PM

#13. is Big Red Bloody Vagina's favorite

petegz28 10-29-2013 08:01 PM

#14. Web site and crashed.......again

LiveSteam 10-29-2013 08:02 PM

#15. Obama killed all the bad guys,all by himself

dirk digler 10-29-2013 08:07 PM

I would like to know more about:

5. HHS neutered the "Grandfather" clause with multiple regulations

petegz28 10-29-2013 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirk digler (Post 10139771)
I would like to know more about:

5. HHS neutered the "Grandfather" clause with multiple regulations

They made regulations stating that if your current "Grandfathered" policy changed for anything at all, e.g., higher premium, change of doctor list, change in deductible, etc., it was no longer considered "Grandfathered".


So basically they said any change to a plan regardless of how small would disqualify it from being Grandfathered.

petegz28 10-29-2013 08:11 PM

Listening to Dems try and spin this is some of the best entertainment I have seen in a long, long time.

petegz28 10-29-2013 08:13 PM

Basically, Dirk, if a Doctor retired thus causing your insurance company to revise your list of available doctors then it lost it's Grandfathered status.

So while one side of the mouth was saying you you could keep your plan if you liked it, the other side of the mouth was engineering it so you couldn't.

dirk digler 10-29-2013 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by petegz28 (Post 10139782)
They made regulations stating that if your current "Grandfathered" policy changed for anything at all, e.g., higher premium, change of doctor list, change in deductible, etc., it was no longer considered "Grandfathered".


So basically they said any change to a plan regardless of how small would disqualify it from being Grandfathered.

Thanks. I knew about most of that just not the change of doctor one. Seems somewhat petty

petegz28 10-29-2013 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirk digler (Post 10139797)
Thanks. I knew about most of that just not the change of doctor one. Seems somewhat petty

I think there are a total of 6 or 7 regulations that basically **** your current plan. They knew what they were doing. They knew they had to force as many people as they could into this cluster ****.

dirk digler 10-29-2013 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by petegz28 (Post 10139805)
I think there are a total of 6 or 7 regulations that basically **** your current plan. They knew what they were doing. They knew they had to force as many people as they could into this cluster ****.

You have to wonder though how much the insurance companies are really to blame\happy about this. They knew the rules yet changed some of their plans.

If everyone was honest the ACA is a big-giveaway to the insurance companies. The ACA gives them a convienent excuse by allowing them to replace low-profit-margin insurance with more expensive policies, many of which will be supported with government subsidies.

petegz28 10-29-2013 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirk digler (Post 10139842)
You have to wonder though how much the insurance companies are really to blame\happy about this. They knew the rules yet changed some of their plans.

If everyone was honest the ACA is a big-giveaway to the insurance companies. The ACA gives them a convienent excuse by allowing them to replace low-profit-margin insurance with more expensive policies, many of which will be supported with government subsidies.

Okay, the part you are missing is they were FORCED to change their plans to comply with the Obamacare laws. Obamacare says your plan now must cover X,Y and Z. If your current plan didn't provide things like maternity coverage then they were forced to change.

I am not disagreeing it's a boon for insurance companies but I really don't give a ****. The problem is the impact it is having on the individual. Most individual policy holders will not receive subsidies ...that is a myth that they will.

So you are off base on your thinking. They didn't use Obamacare as an excuse to change.....there were forced to eliminate plans because they didn't meet the Obamacare criteria.

In other words, Dirk, the Democrats know what's best for you better than you do.

dirk digler 10-29-2013 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by petegz28 (Post 10139874)
Okay, the part you are missing is they were FORCED to change their plans to comply with the Obamacare laws. Obamacare says your plan now must cover X,Y and Z. If your current plan didn't provide things like maternity coverage then they were forced to change.

I am not disagreeing it's a boon for insurance companies but I really don't give a ****. The problem is the impact it is having on the individual. Most individual policy holders will not receive subsidies ...that is a myth that they will.

So you are off base on your thinking. They didn't use Obamacare as an excuse to change.....there were forced to eliminate plans because they didn't meet the Obamacare criteria.

In other words, Dirk, the Democrats know what's best for you better than you do.

No I am talking about the grandfathered plans. It is my understanding that all health insurance plans were grandfathered in. As you pointed out above if the insurance companies made any changes they lost that status. The minimum standard plans I believe are for any plan sold 2012 or 2013, could be wrong on that.

HonestChieffan 10-29-2013 08:43 PM

10 minimum requirements:

Essential health benefits requirements will go into effect for new plans in the individual and small- group markets on January 1, 2014.3 The essential health benefits package includes—at a minimum—10 categories of defined essential health benefits: ambula- tory patient services; emergency services; hospitaliza- tion; maternity and newborn care; mental health and substance use disorder services, including behavioral health treatment; prescription drugs; rehabilitative and habilitative services and devices; laboratory services; preventive and wellness services and chronic disease management; and pediatric services, including oral and vision care.

dirk digler 10-29-2013 08:46 PM

Pete this explains it better than I could.

Quote:

Let's start with the very basics here. About 15 million people purchase health insurance policies on the individual market. That's about 5 percent of the population. When they do so, they typically purchase a 12-month contract with an insurance company. And when that contract runs out, both the individual and the insurance plan have an escape hatch. The individual can decide to no longer purchase the plan -- and the insurance company can decide to no longer offer the plan.

Most individuals don't stay in the individual market very long: One study, published in the journal Health Affairs, found that 17 percent of individual market subscribers purchased the same plan for two straight years or longer.

There are some restrictions on how insurance companies can terminate products. HIPAA, a health law passed in the 1990s, does require that insurance companies offer subscribers the opportunity to renew their policy, so long as they continue to pay monthly premiums. If they want to discontinue a subscriber's policy, the insurance plan must provide 90 days notice and "the option to purchase any other individual health insurance coverage currently being offered by the issuer for individuals in that market."

And these are the notices that insurance plans are sending out right now, to hundreds of thousands of subscribers: notices saying that they do not plan to offer the policy anymore, and information about what policies will be available.

Some -- or maybe even most -- of the plans offered on the individual insurance market right now don't meet certain requirements in the health-care law. They may not offer preventive care without co-payment, for example, or leave out coverage of maternity care, one of the health-care law's 10 essential benefits.

Some of these plans have stuck around for a little bit. The health law allowed plans that existed back in March 2010, when it became a law, to keep selling coverage. These are known as "grandfathered plans:" They don't meet the health law's requirements, but as long as they don't change much, insurers can keep offering them.

Insurance companies typically do like to change their insurance plans, making changes to cost-sharing or the benefits they offer. That means that grandfathered plans have disappeared. We don't have great data about how quickly this is happening in the individual market, but we do see it in this Kaiser Family Foundation survey of the employer market.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...ered-plans.png

These cancellations are, essentially, a lot of grandfathered plans exiting the insurance marketplace. From an insurance company's vantage point, grandfathered plans are a bit of a dead end: They can't enroll new subscribers and are really constrained in their ability to tweak the benefit package or cost-sharing structure. There's not a whole lot of business sense, for a managed care company, in maintaining a health plan that doesn't meet the health law's new requirements.


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