Misc Why Monogamy is Ridiculous

Skyy God · 01-26-2011, 11:09 AM

http://bigthink.com/ideas/24738

Dan Savage: Yeah, absolutely we need to rethink love and commitment. You know 60 years ago was when we decided that men had to be monogamous too. Men were not monogamous. For all of recorded human history men had concubines and whores, and 60 years ago straight relationships began to become more egalitarian and it was less of a property transaction—a marriage had been a property transaction for most of recorded human history—and it became a union of two equals. And at that moment instead of deciding to allow women to have the same sort of freedom and leeway that men did we decided to let men have the same limitations, impose the same limitations what women had and we put monogamous sexual commitment at the heart of all relationships, all long-term commitments, all marriages and we have watched.

We should now be able to recognize the consequences of that, which are a lot of short-term relationships, a lot of divorce. Because monogamy is ridiculous and people aren’t any good at it. We’re not wired for it. We didn’t evolve to be. It’s unnatural and it places a tremendous strain on our marriages and our long-term commitments to expect them to be effortlessly monogamous. Because what we said is "If you’re in love you shouldn’t... you won’t want to have sex with anybody else and what we need to tell people is that if you’re in love you can make a monogamous commitment and you will refrain from having sex with other people, but you will still desperately want to f**k the shit out of other people." But people understand love means I don’t want to f**k other people because of these misconceptions pumped into people’s heads about romance, love and what it means. And so they meet somebody else that they’re attracted to and they’re attracted to this other person. They go "Well, I must not be in love with my partner anymore otherwise I wouldn’t be attracted to this person." Or they feel threatened when their partners are attracted to other people because it makes them feel insecure and we just need to get passed that and we talk about monogamy the way we talk about virginity, that you’re monogamous until you f**k somebody else and they’re you’re not. You’ve ruined it. You popped your monogamy hymen and destroyed your monogamous relationship.

We need to talk about monogamy the way we talk about sobriety, which you can be monogamous and fall off the wagon and then sober back up. You can monogamous back up and get back on the wagon. And the truth of the matter is that if you’re with somebody for 40, 50 years and they only cheated on you a few times they were good at being monogamous, not bad at being monogamous. They were good at it. So I do think there needs to be some leeway. And a lot of really good loving relationships are destroyed because somebody wants a little variety or isn’t getting a need met and feels they have to step out and it explodes the relationship. I'm conservative. I think that we should do what we can to preserve marriages and long-term relationships, and one way to do that is to encourage people to have more realistic attitudes about sexual exclusivity.

tooge · 01-26-2011, 11:12 AM

this should be interesting

**luv** · 01-26-2011, 11:12 AM

That's great for men. Women would still be whores.

tooge · 01-26-2011, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luv

That's great for men. Women would still be whores.

and?

Skyy God · 01-26-2011, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luv

That's great for men. Women would still be whores.

+1

**loochy** · 01-26-2011, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luv

That's great for men. Women would still be whores.

Well yeah.

Go make me a sandwich while I get some strange.

**luv** · 01-26-2011, 11:17 AM

You could become old school Mormon.

**jAZ** · 01-26-2011, 11:18 AM

Monogamy isn't that hard.

**loochy** · 01-26-2011, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jAZ

Monogamy isn't that hard.

This is just more excuse for people to do something that is wrong, bad, or irresponsible, then have something to blame it on. It is the way of today's society.

tooge · 01-26-2011, 11:22 AM

actually, the OP is stating a fact. One of the reasons mankind has been so successful over time is that there has always been a dual role structure in the relationship. Mama sat in the cave and took care of junior, thus increasing the odds that junior would grow up and populate. Meanwhile, dad was out getting as much ass as possible. Again, increasing the odds that he was increasing not only the population as a whole, but his genetic fingerprint on it. Tha is why we have evolved so quickly, while most other species have either died out, or are very similar to what they were a million years ago. If people were completely monogamous from the get go, we would have died out long ago when the population bottleneck occured and took us down to around 5,000 individuals thousands of years ago.

Skyy God · 01-26-2011, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jAZ

Monogamy isn't that hard when your opportunity is limited.

Fixed.

**DaFace** · 01-26-2011, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jAZ

Monogamy isn't that hard.

Heh...you said "hard."

**luv** · 01-26-2011, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaFace

Heh...you said "hard."

blaise · 01-26-2011, 11:23 AM

That's all well and good, but the person you would need to sell that to is the person you're with, and good luck with that.
And I bet most people that say monogamy is outdated would probably have a change of heart the first time their wife got all dolled up and picked up at the house by some dude, and then didn't come home until 10:30 the next day.

**luv** · 01-26-2011, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blaise

That's all well and good, but the person you would need to sell that to is the person you're with, and good luck with that.
And I bet most people that say monogamy is outdated would probably have a change of heart the first time their wife got all dolled up and picked up at the house by some dude, and then didn't come home until 10:30 the next day.

We've already established this is only acceptable for men.

01-26-2011, 11:09 AM
Skyy God 11-5, baby Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Livin the dream Casino cash: $2191557	Why Monogamy is Ridiculous http://bigthink.com/ideas/24738 Dan Savage: Yeah, absolutely we need to rethink love and commitment. You know 60 years ago was when we decided that men had to be monogamous too. Men were not monogamous. For all of recorded human history men had concubines and whores, and 60 years ago straight relationships began to become more egalitarian and it was less of a property transaction—a marriage had been a property transaction for most of recorded human history—and it became a union of two equals. And at that moment instead of deciding to allow women to have the same sort of freedom and leeway that men did we decided to let men have the same limitations, impose the same limitations what women had and we put monogamous sexual commitment at the heart of all relationships, all long-term commitments, all marriages and we have watched. We should now be able to recognize the consequences of that, which are a lot of short-term relationships, a lot of divorce. Because monogamy is ridiculous and people aren’t any good at it. We’re not wired for it. We didn’t evolve to be. It’s unnatural and it places a tremendous strain on our marriages and our long-term commitments to expect them to be effortlessly monogamous. Because what we said is "If you’re in love you shouldn’t... you won’t want to have sex with anybody else and what we need to tell people is that if you’re in love you can make a monogamous commitment and you will refrain from having sex with other people, but you will still desperately want to fk the shit out of other people." But people understand love means I don’t want to fk other people because of these misconceptions pumped into people’s heads about romance, love and what it means. And so they meet somebody else that they’re attracted to and they’re attracted to this other person. They go "Well, I must not be in love with my partner anymore otherwise I wouldn’t be attracted to this person." Or they feel threatened when their partners are attracted to other people because it makes them feel insecure and we just need to get passed that and we talk about monogamy the way we talk about virginity, that you’re monogamous until you f**k somebody else and they’re you’re not. You’ve ruined it. You popped your monogamy hymen and destroyed your monogamous relationship. We need to talk about monogamy the way we talk about sobriety, which you can be monogamous and fall off the wagon and then sober back up. You can monogamous back up and get back on the wagon. And the truth of the matter is that if you’re with somebody for 40, 50 years and they only cheated on you a few times they were good at being monogamous, not bad at being monogamous. They were good at it. So I do think there needs to be some leeway. And a lot of really good loving relationships are destroyed because somebody wants a little variety or isn’t getting a need met and feels they have to step out and it explodes the relationship. I'm conservative. I think that we should do what we can to preserve marriages and long-term relationships, and one way to do that is to encourage people to have more realistic attitudes about sexual exclusivity.
Posts: 22,416

01-26-2011, 11:12 AM	#2
tooge MVP Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Liberty, MO Casino cash: $804112	this should be interesting
Posts: 17,144

01-26-2011, 11:12 AM	#3
luv You think you can get by this? Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Springfield, MO Casino cash: $-1170000	That's great for men. Women would still be whores.
Posts: 63,558

01-26-2011, 11:17 AM	#7
luv You think you can get by this? Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Springfield, MO Casino cash: $-1170000	You could become old school Mormon.
Posts: 63,558

01-26-2011, 11:18 AM	#8
jAZ Supporter Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Tucson, AZ Casino cash: $9817493	Monogamy isn't that hard.
Posts: 24,800

01-26-2011, 11:22 AM	#10
tooge MVP Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Liberty, MO Casino cash: $804112	actually, the OP is stating a fact. One of the reasons mankind has been so successful over time is that there has always been a dual role structure in the relationship. Mama sat in the cave and took care of junior, thus increasing the odds that junior would grow up and populate. Meanwhile, dad was out getting as much ass as possible. Again, increasing the odds that he was increasing not only the population as a whole, but his genetic fingerprint on it. Tha is why we have evolved so quickly, while most other species have either died out, or are very similar to what they were a million years ago. If people were completely monogamous from the get go, we would have died out long ago when the population bottleneck occured and took us down to around 5,000 individuals thousands of years ago.
Posts: 17,144

01-26-2011, 11:23 AM	#14
blaise In Search of a Life Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Plano, TX Casino cash: $9989900	That's all well and good, but the person you would need to sell that to is the person you're with, and good luck with that. And I bet most people that say monogamy is outdated would probably have a change of heart the first time their wife got all dolled up and picked up at the house by some dude, and then didn't come home until 10:30 the next day.
Posts: 22,189