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Old 02-24-2014, 07:22 PM   Topic Starter
mlyonsd mlyonsd is offline
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The new environmental activist tactic - censorship

Heating up: Climate change advocates try to silence Krauthammer

By Howard Kurtz
Published February 24, 2014FoxNews.com

Charles Krauthammer says it right up front in his Washington Post column: “I’m not a global warming believer. I’m not a global warming denier.”

He does, however, challenge the notion that the science on climate change is settled and says those who insist otherwise are engaged in “a crude attempt to silence critics and delegitimize debate.”

How ironic, then, that some environmental activists launched a petition urging the Post not to publish Krauthammer’s column on Friday.

Their response to opinions they disagree with is to suppress the speech.

Brad Johnson (@ClimateBrad), the editor of HillHeat.com and a former Think Progress staffer, boasted on Twitter that 110,000 people had urged the newspaper “to stop publishing climate lies” like the Krauthammer piece.

I understand that many people are passionate about global warming and consider skeptics to be flat-earthers. Those who don’t like the arguments by Krauthammer, a Fox News contributor, should by all means criticize, dispute, denounce and otherwise go at him. That’s how debate takes place in a country with a vibrant media culture.

Instead, these folks believe that censorship is preferable. Why engage Krauthammer when they might just be able to employ pressure tactics to silence him? And what’s the difference between this and shouting down a speaker at a town hall?

Krauthammer told me the petition-signers “showed up just in time to make precisely the point I made in the column.”

When it comes to free speech, he says, “they don’t even hide it anymore. Now they proudly want certain arguments banished from discourse. The next step is book burning. So the question of the day is: Can you light a Kindle?

“Is there anything more anti-scientific than scientific truths being determined by petition and demonstration?”

Maybe this reflects a broader trend in which people want to wall themselves off from contrary information — and wall off others as well. Debating a complicated subject like climate change — and, equally important, what to do about it — is difficult. Attempting to silence the other side is the easy way out.

Of course, most climate-change proponents are perfectly willing to argue their case on the merits. Unfortunately, that doesn’t apply to everyone.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014...e-krauthammer/
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Old 02-24-2014, 07:29 PM   #2
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Yeah, I say this earlier today. It's akin to those folks who basically said after 2012, "Elections have consequences" and that the opposition should just shut up and do whatever Obama wants.

Probably the same folks, now that I think about it.
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Old 02-24-2014, 08:05 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mlyonsd View Post
“Is there anything more anti-scientific than scientific truths being determined by petition and demonstration?”
No worse than thinking they are determined by public debate among lay people.

>99% of the population doesn't understand enough of the basic science to even have an informed opinion on anthropogenic climate change, and I'm pretty sure that the 99% includes Charles Krauthammer. What are his qualifications for being granted space in the Washington Post to air his views on science? Why should anyone care what he thinks about something that he has no training in and hasn't spent enough time to come to a high level of understanding?
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Old 02-24-2014, 10:18 PM   #4
cosmo20002 cosmo20002 is offline
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Someone doesn't know what censorship means.
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Old 02-25-2014, 05:10 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by cosmo20002 View Post
Someone doesn't know what censorship means.
Oh? Do tell.
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Old 02-25-2014, 06:24 PM   #6
cosmo20002 cosmo20002 is offline
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Originally Posted by mlyonsd View Post
Oh? Do tell.
I don't want to get into a pateeu-type semantics debate, but "censorship" and raising "free speech" issues generally imply a govt suppression of speech, which obviously isn't the case here.

The Washington Post certainly has a right to "censor" its own content, and what happened here was people asking the WP not to publish what they think is false information.

If people telling a newspaper it shouldn't publish something false is suppressing free speech what is telling those people that they shouldn't make the request? Howard Kurtz, Fox, and Charles Krauthammer hate free speech!
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Old 02-25-2014, 07:00 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cosmo20002 View Post
I don't want to get into a pateeu-type semantics debate, but "censorship" and raising "free speech" issues generally imply a govt suppression of speech, which obviously isn't the case here.

The Washington Post certainly has a right to "censor" its own content, and what happened here was people asking the WP not to publish what they think is false information.

If people telling a newspaper it shouldn't publish something false is suppressing free speech what is telling those people that they shouldn't make the request? Howard Kurtz, Fox, and Charles Krauthammer hate free speech!
It's not semantics when you get the definition wrong, it's just wrong. mlyonsd used "censorship" correctly in the thread title. Give the dictionary a try.
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Old 02-25-2014, 07:02 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cosmo20002 View Post
I don't want to get into a pateeu-type semantics debate, but "censorship" and raising "free speech" issues generally imply a govt suppression of speech, which obviously isn't the case here.

The Washington Post certainly has a right to "censor" its own content, and what happened here was people asking the WP not to publish what they think is false information.

If people telling a newspaper it shouldn't publish something false is suppressing free speech what is telling those people that they shouldn't make the request? Howard Kurtz, Fox, and Charles Krauthammer hate free speech!
This could be your weakest post ever.
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Old 02-25-2014, 06:46 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cosmo20002 View Post
Someone doesn't know what censorship means.
My guess is that it's you.
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Old 02-25-2014, 06:12 AM   #10
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
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No worse than thinking they are determined by public debate among lay people.

>99% of the population doesn't understand enough of the basic science to even have an informed opinion on anthropogenic climate change, and I'm pretty sure that the 99% includes Charles Krauthammer. What are his qualifications for being granted space in the Washington Post to air his views on science? Why should anyone care what he thinks about something that he has no training in and hasn't spent enough time to come to a high level of understanding?
They don't need to if they know who is behind pushing it and read about the scientists who oppose these claims. All one has to do is look at the solutions being promoted. It's about global socialism.

It not surprising that the commies get called watermelons. Calling people uneducated enough to understand is censorship, particularly when some of them are a doctor like Krauthammer.
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Old 02-25-2014, 07:42 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
They don't need to if they know who is behind pushing it and read about the scientists who oppose these claims. All one has to do is look at the solutions being promoted. It's about global socialism.
Can you give us a link to these solutions being promoted?
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Old 02-25-2014, 08:07 AM   #12
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
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Originally Posted by Fish View Post
Can you give us a link to these solutions being promoted?
It's been posted before throughout numerous climate-change threads since 2006. Happy searching....and reading.
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Old 02-25-2014, 08:09 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
It's been posted before throughout numerous climate-change threads since 2006. Happy searching....and reading.
Right. Just confirming that you didn't actually know what you're talking about. Again.
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Old 02-25-2014, 09:33 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Fish View Post
Can you give us a link to these solutions being promoted?
Wouldn't that be the ones that HONESTLY scared you yesterday?

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Originally Posted by Baby Lee View Post
I agree with Fish, particularly the bolded. But people who wholly believe climate change, but hold a view akin to Fish's , need to realize that they have vultures on their shoulder very much like Al Gore who are seeking to enact sweeping socialization to oversee and dictate an immense part of individual and societal activity.

It's not partisan, it's ideological

Your toilet paper
How often you flush
how much TV you watch
How often you cook food
your lights
oil
coal
natural gas
nuclear
how much you drive
where you live
where you work in relation to where you live
how much you surf the internet or do web searches
your lawn
if and where you golf, or play pickup sports


They want the government to pressure you to reduce all of these things and countless more, and for consumption of them to be much more expensive.

It's paternal and elitist, and it'll hurt the poor and middle class the worst.
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I fully acknowledge this, and it honestly scares me. I think this exact thing will hurt our future study and taint the underlying effort. Which is why I think it's so important to draw a very distinct separation between the politics of climate change and the actual science. Sadly, I still see the idiot politicians winning the battle before science has enough data to actually address what might need done. Governments are going to propose action before we're justified, and it's going to make people even more resistant to the overall idea.
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Old 02-25-2014, 09:54 AM   #15
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Wouldn't that be the ones that HONESTLY scared you yesterday?
Missing the point....

My point is that politicians are the ones proposing solutions right now. Scientists are not. And the only realistic solutions put forth involve emissions reductions, taxes, penalties, and other money making political ventures.

If you just listen to actual scientists and ignore idiot politicians, you'll find that we're still searching for real solutions and politicians are just looking for income from something they don't understand. Gypsy woman doesn't understand the difference.
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