Don't listen to donk revisionists....

T-post Tom · 03-12-2007, 10:51 PM

The donks are NOT benefiting from Plummer's retirement. In fact, the Bucs may have raped the donks out of $7M… all for a paltry 7th round pick. This provided a good laugh. Enjoy.

2. I think the Jake Plummer story isn't over. Not by a long shot. There are two key parts of the Plummer trade to the Broncos:

a. Denver gets a seventh-round pick in '08 if Plummer doesn't play or report to Tampa Bay or any other team by draft day '08. If he plays or reports anywhere in the next 13 months, Denver is owed a fourth-rounder.

b. I expect Tampa Bay GM Bruce Allen to give Plummer a couple of months to make a decision about whether he wants to return this year or next year. Maybe more than a couple of months. But at some point, I expect Allen to go after the pro-rated $7 million in signing-bonus money Plummer has assigned to each of the last three years of his contract -- '07, '08, '09.

There is precedent for teams to go after portions of a signing bonus if a player retires before the term of his contract expires, and I expect Allen would get this money from Plummer, which would be a heck of a good investment for a seventh-round draft choice. So the Bucs would be enriched by $7 million if they win what surely would be a grievance filed by Plummer, who wouldn't want to give the money back.

Confused? When players sign long-term contracts, for cap purposes, a pro-rated portion of the signing bonus is assigned to each year of the contract and made part of his cap number. In '03, Plummer signed a seven-year, $40 million contract. He's played four years of the deal. The assumption when a player signs a seven-year contract is that he's being paid a signing bonus commensurate with the total number of years in the contract. Now, a total of $7 million in pro-rated bonus money remains, even if Plummer chooses not to play.

There's no doubt in my mind that one of the reasons Allen made this deal is knowing that even if Plummer didn't play again, the Bucs would have the right to go after the $7 million. Remember a couple of years ago when Allen went after Keenan McCardell's $1 million roster bonus and won, when McCardell refused to play for Tampa Bay and forced a trade to San Diego? The history's there. In the end, even if Plummer doesn't play another snap in the NFL, this deal has the potential to be a very good one for Tampa Bay.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...11/mmqb/2.html

Extra Point · 03-12-2007, 11:06 PM

I hope that Plummer wins the handball doubles tourney, by using both of Shanahan's testicle in final.

FDS · 03-13-2007, 01:18 AM

(donk troll)Peter King is a dumbass and Plummer ass kisser(donk troll)

First

Down

Samie

mdstu · 03-13-2007, 07:53 PM

I thought I heard on the radio that the donks had insisted on a clause in the trade deal that if Plummer retired then they had the rights to the bonus recoup.

Maybe I'm just getting old.

Mile High Mania · 03-13-2007, 10:08 PM

At this point... I don't care what happens, I'm ready to move on. So should you. And, I could be wrong, but I think the 'benefit' came from 2007 cap relief thanks to the trade. I dunno.

Kerberos · 03-14-2007, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mile High Mania

At this point... I don't care what happens, I'm ready to move on. So should you. And, I could be wrong, but I think the 'benefit' came from 2007 cap relief thanks to the trade. I dunno.

Yeah I'd like a chance to say something..... WHAT???

So easy a caveman could do it!

**Skip Towne** · 03-14-2007, 08:48 AM

Remember Taco trying to tell us Maurice Clarett wasn't a wasted pick because it was a "free" pick?

vailpass · 03-14-2007, 08:56 AM

Suddenly Peter Eater King is a quotable, reliable source?

Eleazar · 03-14-2007, 09:02 AM

This topic ranks very high on the whogivesaripometer

Mile High Mania · 03-14-2007, 09:10 AM

Here is how a Denver reporter addressed it:

Q: Aren't the Broncos both responsible for and entitled to the signing bonuses considering they are the ones who guaranteed them? Isn't that why the cap hit for trading or cutting a player goes up so much during the year it happens, 'cause all the bonuses come due?

A: The basics of the situation are:

The Broncos have traded Plummer's rights to Tampa. Plummer has also announced his retirement twice -- once in person and once on his website.

When a player retires with a few years left on his contract, especially a high-profile player who wasn't expected to retire, teams have taken to trying to recover some of the bonus money they paid out.

Plummer has three years remaining on his contract. And while he received his bonuses a couple years ago, those bonuses are charged on a pro-rated basis to the team's salary cap over the life of the contract. So teams have had some success recovering the remaining pro-rated portions in cash.

The Dolphins won the right against running back Ricky Williams to recover a signing bonus after Williams retired, and there have been a few others. For Plummer, it amounts to about $7 million someone will try to recover.

The Broncos did pay those bonuses and under most circumstances would have the right to that money. However, that right is something they could put into a trade, and it's believed they did just that with the Buccaneers.

Right now the Broncos get a seventh-round pick in the 2008 draft if Plummer neither plays nor reports to the Buccaneers or anybody else before draft day in '08. But if he reports to Tampa or anyone else before draft day '08, the Broncos get a fourth-round pick.

To get the best possible pick -- and a fourth-rounder is about the best the Broncos were going to do, according to several personnel executives I spoke to around the league -- the Broncos are believed to have given the Buccaneers the opportunity to recover that signing bonus money in an effort to get Plummer to report.

Because if Plummer reports for the '07 season -- or any time before the '08 draft -- the Broncos get the fourth-rounder.

Now, the league operates under a collective bargaining agreement, and players certainly have the right to file a grievance for any situation like this and get a hearing. Plummer is almost certainly going to file one to see if an arbitrator can be swayed to let him retire without paying the money back.

Plummer said last Friday (March 9) that there "were some things going on'' that people might "speculate'' about. This is the situation he was talking about.

Also, he promised never to wear another NFL jersey in a game. However, it might cost him some money to keep that promise.

However, it's clear the Broncos want him to report to Tampa to get the best pick possible from the trade, and it's clear the Buccaneers want him to report as well because they were on the hunt for a veteran quarterback. Plummer would earn about $5 million in salary this season if he reports to Tampa -- his contract was traded with him.

Also, there were still plenty of folks who wanted a review of the cap situation for the Broncos with Plummer's contract overall. So, here it is:

-- Had they simply kept Plummer on the roster under his old contract, it would have counted $8.605 million against the cap this year.

-- Had they cut him before June 1, the cap charge would have been $8.556 million.

-- Had they designated him a post-June 1 cut -- each team can designate two players this way -- or released him after June 1, the cap charge would have been $2.852 million this year, $5.704 million in '08.

-- By trading him, the cap charge is still $8.556 million because the Broncos are still responsible for any pro-rated portions of previous bonuses remaining on the deal. That all counts in the year of the trade. Plummer had three years remaining on his deal, and the charge of those bonuses is $8.556 million to the Broncos salary cap.

-- Since they have traded his rights, they are still responsible for those charges because his contract is now on the books with the Buccaneers.

-- Had he retired as a member of the Broncos, the cap charge would still have been $8.556 million.

crazycoffey · 03-14-2007, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mile High Mania

Here is how a Denver reporter addressed it:

Well, someone woke up on the wrong side of the rock this morning.

Mile High Mania · 03-14-2007, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazycoffey

Well, someone woke up on the wrong side of the rock this morning.

I don't sleep near a rock.

HMc · 03-14-2007, 09:27 AM

if i were im i'd report and play, get paid 5 mil on the year and avoid the paying back of the bonus. Stink it up and get cut.

crazycoffey · 03-14-2007, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mile High Mania

I don't sleep near a rock.

Bedrock?

Kerberos · 03-14-2007, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazycoffey

Bedrock?

Does that mean he covers himself with SHEETROCK?

03-12-2007, 10:51 PM
T-post Tom Busy in a Kohl's restroom Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Milk/Honey/Gazland Casino cash: $1907293	Don't listen to donk revisionists.... The donks are NOT benefiting from Plummer's retirement. In fact, the Bucs may have raped the donks out of $7M… all for a paltry 7th round pick. This provided a good laugh. Enjoy. 2. I think the Jake Plummer story isn't over. Not by a long shot. There are two key parts of the Plummer trade to the Broncos: a. Denver gets a seventh-round pick in '08 if Plummer doesn't play or report to Tampa Bay or any other team by draft day '08. If he plays or reports anywhere in the next 13 months, Denver is owed a fourth-rounder. b. I expect Tampa Bay GM Bruce Allen to give Plummer a couple of months to make a decision about whether he wants to return this year or next year. Maybe more than a couple of months. But at some point, I expect Allen to go after the pro-rated $7 million in signing-bonus money Plummer has assigned to each of the last three years of his contract -- '07, '08, '09. There is precedent for teams to go after portions of a signing bonus if a player retires before the term of his contract expires, and I expect Allen would get this money from Plummer, which would be a heck of a good investment for a seventh-round draft choice. So the Bucs would be enriched by $7 million if they win what surely would be a grievance filed by Plummer, who wouldn't want to give the money back. Confused? When players sign long-term contracts, for cap purposes, a pro-rated portion of the signing bonus is assigned to each year of the contract and made part of his cap number. In '03, Plummer signed a seven-year, $40 million contract. He's played four years of the deal. The assumption when a player signs a seven-year contract is that he's being paid a signing bonus commensurate with the total number of years in the contract. Now, a total of $7 million in pro-rated bonus money remains, even if Plummer chooses not to play. There's no doubt in my mind that one of the reasons Allen made this deal is knowing that even if Plummer didn't play again, the Bucs would have the right to go after the $7 million. Remember a couple of years ago when Allen went after Keenan McCardell's $1 million roster bonus and won, when McCardell refused to play for Tampa Bay and forced a trade to San Diego? The history's there. In the end, even if Plummer doesn't play another snap in the NFL, this deal has the potential to be a very good one for Tampa Bay. http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...11/mmqb/2.html
Posts: 22,289

03-12-2007, 11:06 PM	#2
Extra Point MVP Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Prairie Village, KS Casino cash: $10004900	I hope that Plummer wins the handball doubles tourney, by using both of Shanahan's testicle in final. __________________ "Sometimes I sits and thinks, and sometimes I just sits." --Satchel Paige
Posts: 7,845

03-13-2007, 01:18 AM	#3
FDS Banned Join Date: Jan 2007 Casino cash: $10004900	(donk troll)Peter King is a dumbass and Plummer ass kisser(donk troll) First Down Samie
Posts: 368

03-13-2007, 07:53 PM	#4
mdstu Let's get a snack Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Cincinnati Casino cash: $-2031099	I thought I heard on the radio that the donks had insisted on a clause in the trade deal that if Plummer retired then they had the rights to the bonus recoup. Maybe I'm just getting old.
Posts: 1,390

03-13-2007, 10:08 PM	#5
Mile High Mania #triggering Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Tejas Casino cash: $1067229	At this point... I don't care what happens, I'm ready to move on. So should you. And, I could be wrong, but I think the 'benefit' came from 2007 cap relief thanks to the trade. I dunno. __________________
Posts: 30,894

03-14-2007, 08:48 AM	#7
Skip Towne Supporter Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: T-Town Casino cash: $10004900	Remember Taco trying to tell us Maurice Clarett wasn't a wasted pick because it was a "free" pick?
Posts: 69,689

03-14-2007, 08:56 AM	#8
vailpass Psycho Bag Of Squanch Join Date: Sep 2001 Casino cash: $9594244	Suddenly Peter Eater King is a quotable, reliable source? __________________ “Education is a weapon whose effect depends on who holds it in his hands and at whom it is aimed.” Joseph Stalin
Posts: 69,591

03-14-2007, 09:02 AM	#9
Eleazar Beyond the Rapids Join Date: May 2003 Location: Langley, VA Casino cash: $-370000	This topic ranks very high on the whogivesaripometer
Posts: 80,659

03-14-2007, 09:10 AM	#10
Mile High Mania #triggering Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Tejas Casino cash: $1067229	Here is how a Denver reporter addressed it: Q: Aren't the Broncos both responsible for and entitled to the signing bonuses considering they are the ones who guaranteed them? Isn't that why the cap hit for trading or cutting a player goes up so much during the year it happens, 'cause all the bonuses come due? A: The basics of the situation are: The Broncos have traded Plummer's rights to Tampa. Plummer has also announced his retirement twice -- once in person and once on his website. When a player retires with a few years left on his contract, especially a high-profile player who wasn't expected to retire, teams have taken to trying to recover some of the bonus money they paid out. Plummer has three years remaining on his contract. And while he received his bonuses a couple years ago, those bonuses are charged on a pro-rated basis to the team's salary cap over the life of the contract. So teams have had some success recovering the remaining pro-rated portions in cash. The Dolphins won the right against running back Ricky Williams to recover a signing bonus after Williams retired, and there have been a few others. For Plummer, it amounts to about $7 million someone will try to recover. The Broncos did pay those bonuses and under most circumstances would have the right to that money. However, that right is something they could put into a trade, and it's believed they did just that with the Buccaneers. Right now the Broncos get a seventh-round pick in the 2008 draft if Plummer neither plays nor reports to the Buccaneers or anybody else before draft day in '08. But if he reports to Tampa or anyone else before draft day '08, the Broncos get a fourth-round pick. To get the best possible pick -- and a fourth-rounder is about the best the Broncos were going to do, according to several personnel executives I spoke to around the league -- the Broncos are believed to have given the Buccaneers the opportunity to recover that signing bonus money in an effort to get Plummer to report. Because if Plummer reports for the '07 season -- or any time before the '08 draft -- the Broncos get the fourth-rounder. Now, the league operates under a collective bargaining agreement, and players certainly have the right to file a grievance for any situation like this and get a hearing. Plummer is almost certainly going to file one to see if an arbitrator can be swayed to let him retire without paying the money back. Plummer said last Friday (March 9) that there "were some things going on'' that people might "speculate'' about. This is the situation he was talking about. Also, he promised never to wear another NFL jersey in a game. However, it might cost him some money to keep that promise. However, it's clear the Broncos want him to report to Tampa to get the best pick possible from the trade, and it's clear the Buccaneers want him to report as well because they were on the hunt for a veteran quarterback. Plummer would earn about $5 million in salary this season if he reports to Tampa -- his contract was traded with him. Also, there were still plenty of folks who wanted a review of the cap situation for the Broncos with Plummer's contract overall. So, here it is: -- Had they simply kept Plummer on the roster under his old contract, it would have counted $8.605 million against the cap this year. -- Had they cut him before June 1, the cap charge would have been $8.556 million. -- Had they designated him a post-June 1 cut -- each team can designate two players this way -- or released him after June 1, the cap charge would have been $2.852 million this year, $5.704 million in '08. -- By trading him, the cap charge is still $8.556 million because the Broncos are still responsible for any pro-rated portions of previous bonuses remaining on the deal. That all counts in the year of the trade. Plummer had three years remaining on his deal, and the charge of those bonuses is $8.556 million to the Broncos salary cap. -- Since they have traded his rights, they are still responsible for those charges because his contract is now on the books with the Buccaneers. -- Had he retired as a member of the Broncos, the cap charge would still have been $8.556 million. __________________
Posts: 30,894

03-14-2007, 09:27 AM	#13
HMc from the very deep south. Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Sydney, Australia. Casino cash: $9944900	if i were im i'd report and play, get paid 5 mil on the year and avoid the paying back of the bonus. Stink it up and get cut.
Posts: 2,792