Chiefs Packers Also offered a 3rd Rounder - Page 3

Bill Lundberg · 10-15-2008, 10:48 AM

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=806267

Bid to land Gonzalez falls short
Chiefs were willing to deal star tight end for second-round pick
By BOB McGINN
bmcginn@journalsentinel.com
Posted: Oct. 15, 2008
Green Bay - The Green Bay Packers could have acquired tight end Tony Gonzalez from the Kansas City Chiefs on Tuesday but they refused to part with a second-round draft choice.

A source familiar with negotiations told the Journal Sentinel that Chiefs President Carl Peterson ultimately decided to retain Gonzalez after turning down the best offer from Green Bay, which was a third-round selection. The source said Peterson wanted a second-rounder to make the deal.

The decision by general manager Ted Thompson not to send the second-round pick to Kansas City was made just minutes before the National Football League trading deadline of 3 p.m.

During a day of talks between Green Bay and Kansas City, the Packers increased their compensation offer several times. A source said Gonzalez had told the Chiefs that he would accept a trade to the Packers, and planned to play three more seasons.

This was another example of Thompson’s unwillingness to pull the trigger on a blockbuster trade to obtain another weapon on offense.
In 2006, Thompson had the chance to send a high draft choice to San Diego Chargers for running back Michael Turner.

A year later, Thompson didn’t push hard enough to get wide receiver Randy Moss under contract and watched the New England Patriots acquire him from the Oakland Raiders for a fourth-round selection.

Adam Schefter of the NFL Network reported that Philadelphia, the New York Giants and Buffalo also were negotiating with the Chiefs. He reported that one team offered a third-round pick, another team offered a fourth-round pick and another team offered an unidentified choice plus a player.

An NFL source told the Journal Sentinel that the Bills weren’t a factor because Gonzalez didn’t want to play for them.

According to the source, Gonzalez was livid that the rebuilding Chiefs (1-4), for whom he has caught tight-end record totals of 841 passes for 10,075 yards and 68 touchdowns, refused to let him go for a third-round pick.

Gonzalez, who made the Pro Bowl for a record ninth straight time last season, was highly regarded by coach Mike McCarthy and several members of his staff in Green Bay.

McCarthy coached quarterbacks in Kansas City in 1997 and ’98, Gonzalez’s first two seasons there. Several of his coaches, including Tom Clements, Mike Stock, Carl Hairston and Kurt Schottenheimer, also spent time in Kansas City during Gonzalez’s career, as did vice president Russ Ball and personnel director John Schneider.

As it stands now, the Packers will have their seven choices in the 2009 draft plus a sixth-round pick from New Orleans and no worse than a fourth-round pick from the New York Jets in the trade for Brett Favre.

The compensation for Favre reportedly will increase to a third if Favre plays at least 50% of the snaps, and to a second if he plays at least 70% and the Jets reach the playoffs.

If the trade with Green Bay had been consummated, the Packers would have picked up the final 3½ years of Gonzalez’s contract, or a total amount of $19.397 million.

This year, Green Bay would have had to pay 11/17ths of his guaranteed $1 million base salary, or $647,059. His contract included base salaries of $4 million in 2009 (all guaranteed), $4.5 million in 2010 ($1.75 million guaranteed) and $5.75 million in 2011, and roster bonuses of $500,000 in ’09, $2 million in ’10 and $2 million in ’11.

The Packers currently stand $20.05 million beneath the salary cap, a total exceeded by only Tampa Bay and Kansas City among the 32 teams.

By adding Gonzalez, the Packers’ weapons on offense would have compared favorably with any team in the NFL. His ability to make clutch possession catches and stretch the field was evident last season in Week 8, when he caught 10 passes for 109 yards and one touchdown against Green Bay.

Gonzalez recently requested a trade from the Chiefs because he wanted the chance to play for a playoff contender.

“I’m winding down in my career and I’m thinking this is not what I signed on for last year when I redid my deal,” Gonzalez said in August. “I haven’t even won a playoff game. You can look back and say you had a pretty good career, but I want to be able to say I went to the playoffs, I won some playoff games and I went to the Super Bowl.”

The Packers signed tight end Donald Lee to a four-year, $11.88 million deal last November when he was an integral part of their passing game. But Lee has been less involved with Aaron Rodgers at quarterback.

Tory Humphrey is the No. 2 tight end and rookie Jermichael Finley, a third-round draft choice, is No. 3. Finley has been slow to develop and doesn’t have a reception.

Under Thompson, the Packers have drafted eight players in the second round. The list include Nick Collins, Terrence Murphy, Daryn Colledge, Greg Jennings, Brandon Jackson, Jordy Nelson, Brian Brohm and Pat Lee.

Tom Silverstein of the Journal Sentinel staff contributed to this report.

**Bowser** · 10-15-2008, 12:55 PM

Jesus. This organization is 1990's Cardinals bad.

philfree · 10-15-2008, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkman

No.

It was fair market value.

I'm not sure we agree about that. The 22nd pick or worse in the 3rd round? I'm guessing where the Pack will pick in the 2009 draft but I can't be far off. Maybe the top five in the 3rd round would have been okay. Tony is still a great player as he showed in the Denver game when he made that great catch for a TD. Looking at what Dallas gave for Williams I think a 2nd was more fair for the Chiefs. That said I'm glad Tony is still a Chief for now.

PhilFree

**HemiEd** · 10-15-2008, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PastorMikH

No, I don't think Herm has any of the veteran respect outside of maybe Waters.

I thought it was pretty clear yesterday in the interview the way Herm reacted when asked about what it says about the organization when TG asks to be traded. He got really defensive. There is unrest between players and Herm or he wouldn't have acted that way.

Also, on the press conference yesterday, what does it say about a HC that doesn't at least communicate with his best players? He hasn't talked with LJ about the off-the-field problems that might affect him playing? He hasn't talked with Tony about Tony's wanting to be traded?

Herm's more lost than Gunther was as HC.

I agree 100%, in fact the Gunther statement is perfect. Herm makes Gunther look like a genius.

The good news, there no longer is management unity, I love that. It is only a matter of time, before this house of cards has to come down. It bothered me when they appeared united behind this retart.

The wild card is Clark, how will he handle it. I wish we knew more about him and what type of person he is, maybe we would have some idea.

milkman · 10-15-2008, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philfree

I'm not sure we agree about that. The 22nd pick or worse in the 3rd round? I'm guessing where the Pack will pick in the 2009 draft but I can't be far off. Maybe the top five in the 3rd round would have been okay. Tony is still a great player as he showed in the Denver game when he made that great catch for a TD. Looking at what Dallas gave for Williams I think a 2nd was more fair for the Chiefs. That said I'm glad Tony is still a Chief for now.

PhilFree

The fact that several teams were interested in Tony, but none offered more than a third round pick established his value at third round.

Roy Williams is young WR with potentailly a number of great years ahead of him, but the Cowboys did overpay.

But a WR has a higher value in this league.

Frankie · 10-15-2008, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkman

And the NFL teams interested just essentially told you and Carl that you must be ****ing high.

Evidently GB came real close. Carl and I weren't that far off.

philfree · 10-15-2008, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkman

The fact that several teams were interested in Tony, but none offered more than a third round pick established his value at third round.

Roy Williams is young WR with potentailly a number of great years ahead of him, but the Cowboys did overpay.

But a WR has a higher value in this league.

Tony is worth more than that to the Chiefs. Also once on a different team, a good team, his performance would far exceed that of a third round pick. He still performs at the highest level. As far as Williams is concerned WRs do hold more value then TEs in general, however there is a point where the quality of the players in question make a difference. Tony is a better player then Williams and he will be for a couple more years and maybe longer than that even. A 2nd round pick as compared to what Williams was traded for is plenty of difference in compensation between a great TE and a so so WR with some untapped potential. Well IMO.

PhilFree

**dirk digler** · 10-15-2008, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

PLANNED to play 3 more years. For the Packers. Not the Chiefs.

I PLAN on having my degree by the end of 2009. But I'm not guaranteeing it, because life happens, and I reserve the right to change my mind.

I didn't see anywhere in that article that he said he'd guarantee his new team he'd play 3 more years.

It's a moot point anyway, seeing as how he wasn't traded.

Cmon Warpath he can't guarantee anything. He could go out next week and blow both of his knees out and never play again.

I have said along that he has stated he could play a few more years if he stayed healthy.

**Bowser** · 10-15-2008, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philfree

Tony is worth more than that to the Chiefs. Also once on a different team, a good team, his performance would far exceed that of a third round pick. He still performs at the highest level. As far as Williams is concerned WRs do hold more value then TEs in general, however there is a point where the quality of the players in question make a difference. Tony is a better player then Williams and he will be for a couple more years and maybe longer than that even. A 2nd round pick as compared to what Williams was traded for is plenty of difference in compensation between a great TE and a so so WR with some untapped potential. Well IMO.

PhilFree

I disagree. Tony is not going to make a bit of difference to this team the rest of this year, because we are just that bad. Tony MAY be the difference between us going 4-12 as opposed to 2-14 without him. On a contender like an Arizona or a Green Bay, he gives them an instant weapon in the red zone that could help them get over the hump. Tony wouldn't have to carry his new team, like he does here. And even Tony can't carry this train wreck of a team.

Now, if you meant Tony is more important to this team from a PR position from where the GM sits, I completely agree. Unfortunately, I think this whole situation is going to blow up in Carl's face before it's all said and done.

milkman · 10-15-2008, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frankie

Evidently GB came real close. Carl and I weren't that far off.

There is no idication that the Pack came real close.

The article says:

Quote:

A source familiar with negotiations told the Journal Sentinel that Chiefs President Carl Peterson ultimately decided to retain Gonzalez after turning down the best offer from Green Bay, which was a third-round selection. The source said Peterson wanted a second-rounder to make the deal.

There is no indication whatsoever that the Pack even considered that 2nd rounder.

His market value was set.

Third round.

milkman · 10-15-2008, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philfree

Tony is worth more than that to the Chiefs. Also once on a different team, a good team, his performance would far exceed that of a third round pick. He still performs at the highest level. As far as Williams is concerned WRs do hold more value then TEs in general, however there is a point where the quality of the players in question make a difference. Tony is a better player then Williams and he will be for a couple more years and maybe longer than that even. A 2nd round pick as compared to what Williams was traded for is plenty of difference in compensation between a great TE and a so so WR with some untapped potential. Well IMO.

PhilFree

TE is one of the least valuable positions on the football field.

A talented WR is always going to be worth more.

okcchief · 10-15-2008, 01:32 PM

The big problem was waiting until the 11th hour to decide they wanted to clean house. If they had started doing this in the off season they probably could have gotten decent value for TG and LJ. Now we have a couple of high paid players who don't want to be here. That's just fuggin great.

I can't put in to words how much I hate Carl Peterson. If a 32 year old player wants out after he has busted his ass for you for 11 years then you should respect that and make the deal. Keeping him against his will does this organization no good. Even if it was a 4th or 5th rounder just to get rid of his salay is best for the organization at this point.

As much as I love Tony they should have never re-signed him or LJ last year. I felt that way at the time and I feel that way now. They were obviously rebuilding even though they claimed differently. However, I have to also blame Tony for signing with the Chiefs. If you couldn't tell this team had no chance to contend last year you were in complete denial.

Thig Lyfe · 10-15-2008, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milkman

TE is one of the least valuable positions on the football field.

Really? Even a TE who can stretch the field just as well as he can go underneath? A TE who can block just as well as he can catch?

A typical TE maybe isn't particularly valuable, but Tony Gonzalez is not a typical TE.

Sure-Oz · 10-15-2008, 01:37 PM

If Carl wanted a 2nd so bad he could've thrown in a late rounder to get it

milkman · 10-15-2008, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SportsRacer

Really? Even a TE who can stretch the field just as well as he can go underneath? A TE who can block just as well as he can catch?

A typical TE maybe isn't particularly valuable, but Tony Gonzalez is not a typical TE.

Let's look at it like this.

Tony in his prime or Jerry Rice in his prime.

Who's more valuable?

Or another way.

The two greatest receivers in Chiefs history are Tony and Otis Taylor.

Tony's going to go into the HoF, Otis probably not.

In their primes, you couldn't trade Tony straight up for Otis.

**jjchieffan** · 10-15-2008, 01:43 PM

I, personally, applaud Carl for standing firm. TG is worth more to this team than a 3rd round pick. TG is my favorite current Chief, and I would have been PISSED to see him go for anything less than a second. He wants out? Too bad. He should not have limited KC's choices on where he could go.

10-15-2008, 10:48 AM
Bill Lundberg American Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Overland Park Casino cash: $10004925	Packers Also offered a 3rd Rounder http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=806267 Bid to land Gonzalez falls short Chiefs were willing to deal star tight end for second-round pick By BOB McGINN bmcginn@journalsentinel.com Posted: Oct. 15, 2008 Green Bay - The Green Bay Packers could have acquired tight end Tony Gonzalez from the Kansas City Chiefs on Tuesday but they refused to part with a second-round draft choice. A source familiar with negotiations told the Journal Sentinel that Chiefs President Carl Peterson ultimately decided to retain Gonzalez after turning down the best offer from Green Bay, which was a third-round selection. The source said Peterson wanted a second-rounder to make the deal. The decision by general manager Ted Thompson not to send the second-round pick to Kansas City was made just minutes before the National Football League trading deadline of 3 p.m. During a day of talks between Green Bay and Kansas City, the Packers increased their compensation offer several times. A source said Gonzalez had told the Chiefs that he would accept a trade to the Packers, and planned to play three more seasons. This was another example of Thompson’s unwillingness to pull the trigger on a blockbuster trade to obtain another weapon on offense. In 2006, Thompson had the chance to send a high draft choice to San Diego Chargers for running back Michael Turner. A year later, Thompson didn’t push hard enough to get wide receiver Randy Moss under contract and watched the New England Patriots acquire him from the Oakland Raiders for a fourth-round selection. Adam Schefter of the NFL Network reported that Philadelphia, the New York Giants and Buffalo also were negotiating with the Chiefs. He reported that one team offered a third-round pick, another team offered a fourth-round pick and another team offered an unidentified choice plus a player. An NFL source told the Journal Sentinel that the Bills weren’t a factor because Gonzalez didn’t want to play for them. According to the source, Gonzalez was livid that the rebuilding Chiefs (1-4), for whom he has caught tight-end record totals of 841 passes for 10,075 yards and 68 touchdowns, refused to let him go for a third-round pick. Gonzalez, who made the Pro Bowl for a record ninth straight time last season, was highly regarded by coach Mike McCarthy and several members of his staff in Green Bay. McCarthy coached quarterbacks in Kansas City in 1997 and ’98, Gonzalez’s first two seasons there. Several of his coaches, including Tom Clements, Mike Stock, Carl Hairston and Kurt Schottenheimer, also spent time in Kansas City during Gonzalez’s career, as did vice president Russ Ball and personnel director John Schneider. As it stands now, the Packers will have their seven choices in the 2009 draft plus a sixth-round pick from New Orleans and no worse than a fourth-round pick from the New York Jets in the trade for Brett Favre. The compensation for Favre reportedly will increase to a third if Favre plays at least 50% of the snaps, and to a second if he plays at least 70% and the Jets reach the playoffs. If the trade with Green Bay had been consummated, the Packers would have picked up the final 3½ years of Gonzalez’s contract, or a total amount of $19.397 million. This year, Green Bay would have had to pay 11/17ths of his guaranteed $1 million base salary, or $647,059. His contract included base salaries of $4 million in 2009 (all guaranteed), $4.5 million in 2010 ($1.75 million guaranteed) and $5.75 million in 2011, and roster bonuses of $500,000 in ’09, $2 million in ’10 and $2 million in ’11. The Packers currently stand $20.05 million beneath the salary cap, a total exceeded by only Tampa Bay and Kansas City among the 32 teams. By adding Gonzalez, the Packers’ weapons on offense would have compared favorably with any team in the NFL. His ability to make clutch possession catches and stretch the field was evident last season in Week 8, when he caught 10 passes for 109 yards and one touchdown against Green Bay. Gonzalez recently requested a trade from the Chiefs because he wanted the chance to play for a playoff contender. “I’m winding down in my career and I’m thinking this is not what I signed on for last year when I redid my deal,” Gonzalez said in August. “I haven’t even won a playoff game. You can look back and say you had a pretty good career, but I want to be able to say I went to the playoffs, I won some playoff games and I went to the Super Bowl.” The Packers signed tight end Donald Lee to a four-year, $11.88 million deal last November when he was an integral part of their passing game. But Lee has been less involved with Aaron Rodgers at quarterback. Tory Humphrey is the No. 2 tight end and rookie Jermichael Finley, a third-round draft choice, is No. 3. Finley has been slow to develop and doesn’t have a reception. Under Thompson, the Packers have drafted eight players in the second round. The list include Nick Collins, Terrence Murphy, Daryn Colledge, Greg Jennings, Brandon Jackson, Jordy Nelson, Brian Brohm and Pat Lee. Tom Silverstein of the Journal Sentinel staff contributed to this report.
Posts: 3,919

10-15-2008, 12:55 PM	#31
Bowser sorta mod-ish Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: KC North Casino cash: $-48384	Jesus. This organization is 1990's Cardinals bad.
Posts: 106,658

10-15-2008, 01:32 PM	#41
okcchief MVP Join Date: Jul 2008 Casino cash: $9849890	The big problem was waiting until the 11th hour to decide they wanted to clean house. If they had started doing this in the off season they probably could have gotten decent value for TG and LJ. Now we have a couple of high paid players who don't want to be here. That's just fuggin great. I can't put in to words how much I hate Carl Peterson. If a 32 year old player wants out after he has busted his ass for you for 11 years then you should respect that and make the deal. Keeping him against his will does this organization no good. Even if it was a 4th or 5th rounder just to get rid of his salay is best for the organization at this point. As much as I love Tony they should have never re-signed him or LJ last year. I felt that way at the time and I feel that way now. They were obviously rebuilding even though they claimed differently. However, I have to also blame Tony for signing with the Chiefs. If you couldn't tell this team had no chance to contend last year you were in complete denial.
Posts: 6,703

10-15-2008, 01:43 PM	#45
jjchieffan Supporter Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Highlandville, MO Casino cash: $72248	I, personally, applaud Carl for standing firm. TG is worth more to this team than a 3rd round pick. TG is my favorite current Chief, and I would have been PISSED to see him go for anything less than a second. He wants out? Too bad. He should not have limited KC's choices on where he could go. __________________ Genesis 1:1 In the beginning, God created the Heavens and the Earth. Following the historical accounts and the genealogy from that point on, the age of the Earth is approximately 6000-7000 years old. The Big Bullshit Theory is a lie. It and the evolution theory go against real science. Satan has used our public school system to brainwash everyone into believing these lies. Be not decieved.
Posts: 13,320