The myth of Pioli

[B_Ambuehl]

LOL I wonder if he's sharing that loaded contract he got from Clark with Bellichik.

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/c...148&position=0

This time it’s personnel
Building to collapse
By Ron Borges
Monday, December 7, 2009 - Updated 4m ago
+ Recent Articles

MIAMI - Slowly but inexorably they are dissolving in front of our eyes. It is a process that didn’t begin this year for the New England Patriots [team stats] but way back in 2004, when nobody was paying attention to much else but the lifting of another Super Bowl banner.

That season they won their third Super Bowl in four seasons but also began a widely ignored decline that manifested itself emphatically the past month and came to a sad head yesterday at Land Shark Stadium when they lost for the third time in four weeks, blowing a 14-0 lead to be beaten at the buzzer by the Miami Dolphins [team stats], 22-21.

Five years ago, the Patriots draft garnered two starters, both on the first round. Not another player drafted in April of 2004 is still in uniform. That fallowness continued in 2005 when they again picked only two current starters. In 2006, they got only one, running back Laurence Maroney [stats], plus kicker Stephen Gostkowski. Then came the disaster of 2007, when only first-round pick Brandon Meriweather was good enough to still be in pro
football.

It is a bit early to know about 2008 but other than linebacker Jerod Mayo it again appears to be a sad lot. Second- and third-round picks Terrence Wheatley and Shawn Crable seldom see the field (Crable never has) and it is becoming increasingly more disastrous that cornerback Jonathan Wilhite sees so much of it. In those five years, the Patriots drafted 41 players and got eight starters, six on the first round. Otherwise they got what Bill Belichick kept saying was “value.” Yesterday, it didn’t look that way.

Free agency has produced similarly skimpy results. Early hits were made on Rodney Harrison [stats] and Mike Vrabel, but after that the cupboard has been bare. They paid $30 million to Adalius Thomas and promised he could cover Ocho Cinco and sack Peyton Manning. He’s done neither. Shawn Springs signed a three-year, $10.5 million deal last spring and hasn’t played a snap in a month, while poor Wilhite struggles out of position because he’s a nickel back asked to play corner and rookie Darius Butler goes out and proves that while he has potential he never saw receivers at UConn like the ones catching balls behind and in front of him now, as Greg Camarillo did on fourth-and-6 on the game’s most critical play yesterday.

While there were fruitful trades for Randy Moss and Wes Welker, they have netted big numbers but no championships, which is the same amount Moss’ teams have won since he first came into the NFL.

These facts led New Orleans Saints coach Sean Payton to tell his team before last Monday night’s game to be stout hearted and unafraid because “this isn’t the team that accomplished all that stuff.” Although his language was more colorful, his point was clear. These Patriots aren’t those Patriots.

“It’s not for lack of effort,” center Dan Koppen said not long after Dolphins kicker Dan Carpenter nailed a 41-yard field goal and Tom Brady [stats] responded by throwing his second interception of the day with :35 to play as Cameron Wake hammered him.

Koppen is right. The Patriots’ problems are not from lack of effort or lack of planning. They are from lack of talent. Not so lacking that they aren’t competitive, but lacking enough that most every game is a struggle now.

Today everyone will say, “They need a better pass rush.” From whom?

They will say, “They need better pass coverage.” From whom?

Some will say they need to run the ball more to take pressure off Brady and his ailing ring finger, sore shoulder and aching ribs. By whom?

Years ago, Chuck Fairbanks said it best. “It’s not about X’s and O’s. It’s about Jimmys and Joes.” For half a decade with the Pats people believed otherwise. In Bill We Trust became the motto, but does anyone honestly believe Bill Belichick forgot how to coach? A guy who has been watching game film since he was 6 now can’t break down film and discover a team’s weaknesses?

That’s not the problem. The problem is he can’t ask people to do what they are not capable of doing. Or, worse, he does and you end up with Sam Aiken, a guy brought here to replace Larry Izzo [stats] on special teams, as your third receiver making one great catch for a touchdown and dropping two key ones. Did he have a great game or a disastrous one? Probably both, which is A) not his fault because he’s playing a role he was never supposed to, and B) not something Belichick can change.

“We’ve got to find a way to play better football for 60 minutes in all phases,” Brady said. “Everyone has to focus on what they need to do better. I think that’s the most important thing. And be mentally tough to overcome adversity and if things don’t go your way, you’ve got to fight back. That’s a challenge for all of us. At times I think we do, and other times, I don’t think we fight very hard.”

The latter is a damning statement, but it’s also part of what separates the 2001 Pats from today’s. Remaining undaunted is a skill too and not everyone has it.

“We have leads in the second half, and leads in the fourth quarter,” Brady continued. “We’re just not closing the game out when we have the opportunity to. We’re searching for the answers, too.

“Coach always says, ‘You get what you deserve.’ In too many ways, you don’t deserve to win when you make as many mistakes as we do.”

That’s true whether you make them on the field or in the front office.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

I don't think it's too early to tell at all.

Honestly tell me who we've acquired since February that you think even has the remote possibility of becoming a core player here.

Here's my list:

Succop
Jackson


And Jackson is a case of "I hope" and not, "I think."

The rest have shown nothing to lead someone to believe that they'll be anything more than role players, rotational guys or special teamers - at best.

When his best move was the drafting of a kicker, that should send up a giant red flag.

[SAUTO]

Originally Posted by FAX

Not necessarily "optimistic", but maybe tone down the screaming and wailing just a tad. You're waking the baby.

Look, so far, the worst thing Pioli has done is give the contract to Cassel. That's 28 million guaranteed (not necessarily the 60 million people like to talk about). Worst case (and assuming that Pioli can't unload him), he becomes an over-paid backup ... and a pretty decent backup, at that.

As for the other coaching and personnel moves, don't forget that Pioli was hired late - that's on Clark. Haley was, therefore, hired late and the inventory of staff coaches was depleted by then. We were stuck.

The personnel stuff was Pioli responding to urgent needs and problems. Some of those worked and some didn't. However, (and this is important) would you prefer that Pioli play all year with the hand he was dealt ala Peterson? I think not.

Temper fury with reason, for God's sake.

FAX

28 mil is LESS MONEY THAN WE WOULD HAVE GIVEN HIM FOR TWO YEARS FRANCHISED. LESS. (not pointed at you fax) how can people not get that?

[Titty Meat]

Originally Posted by GoChiefs

Question: why couldn't we have seen that improvement THIS YEAR?

3 wins over 2 wins with 4 games left to play isn't an improvement?

[DaWolf]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Xanders+McDaniel> Pioli+Haley.

The results on the field this year speaks for itself. However, I wonder if you handed Pioli + Haley Mike Shanarat's team, and handed Xanders + McDaniels Carl's team, and had McDaniels trade for Cassel, which he obviously would have done, whether Xanders + McDaniels would still be > than Pioli + Haley...

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by JASONSAUTO

ok hamas what EXACTLY DID pioli do in NE? enlighten us.

He was basically a consultant.

It is well established that Belichick is the guy in complete control there. Hell, when NE replaced Pioli, they brought in a consultant to do so.

Guys like Bill Simmons (who have inside contacts w/ the Patriots organization) have said that Belichick wields all the power.)

Worst spin-off of the decade: Joey Tribbiani getting his own show, Heidi Montag's music career or Scott Pioli getting his own team? (Waiting.) Do you need more time? Fine, you can have more time. Just remember, my peeps back in New England always swore that Belichick made every minor/major decision for the Pats -- literally, every single one -- while Pioli was along for the ride like DJ Jazzy Jeff. Actually, that's an insult to DJ Jazzy Jeff. But you get the idea.

[DeezNutz]

Originally Posted by The Bad Guy

It's hilarious that the ones bitching about Tyson Jackson are likely the same ones who were saying that Glenn Dorsey needs time to develop because the DL is the toughest position for a rookie.

Well, I would fit into this category, and I will defend Jackson from anyone who wants to call him a bust anytime soon.

But I'm still not 100 percent over this organization, IMO, blowing what was arguably the most important draft in team history.

Jackson can end up being great at what he does, his role, and the draft will still be a failure, and that's depressing.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by DaWolf

The results on the field this year speaks for itself. However, I wonder if you handed Pioli + Haley Mike Shanarat's team, and handed Xanders + McDaniels Carl's team, and had McDaniels trade for Cassel, which he obviously would have done, whether Xanders + McDaniels would still be > than Pioli + Haley...

Well one thing is for sure McDaniels rarely if ever looks as in over his head as Haley does.

[DeezNutz]

Originally Posted by JASONSAUTO

28 mil is LESS MONEY THAN WE WOULD HAVE GIVEN HIM FOR TWO YEARS FRANCHISED. LESS. (not pointed at you fax) how can people not get that?

I could care less about the money, to be honest, because we have the cap space to eat it this year and next.

What troubles me is the commitment that the $$$ signifies.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by The Bad Guy

It's hilarious that the ones bitching about Tyson Jackson are likely the same ones who were saying that Glenn Dorsey needs time to develop because the DL is the toughest position for a rookie.

I personally haven't seen that Frank.

My argument for Dorsey is that he was mis-used his rookie year, and now moved to a position that he really doesn't fit at, but could make work because of his overall talent level.

I think both Jackson and Dorsey will be serviceable players and have long careers.

I expect more than serviceable out of two Top-5 picks we have over $60M invested in, however.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

A "culture of losing" is a myth. When talented players and coaches are acquired, most teams tend to win.

Talking about fighting a "culture" is what losers do when they're not seeing results. It's a prolonged justification, citing something that is not quantifiable.

We haven't had a "losing culture" in KC; we've had a dog shit talent pool, on the 53 man roster and in the front office.

The real bitch is that those two clowns stumbled in to Brady, won three SB's, remained competitive even when they DIDN'T go the SB, fancied themselves gridiron geniuses, wrote a whole idiotic manifesto about their philosophy, and the majority of football bans bought that Hubbard-esque pile of shit as The Gospel, and now the Chiefs get to be yet another NFL franchise to demonstrate why it was ALL ****ING LUCK TO BEGIN WITH.

[Titty Meat]

Yea and Cassel sucked cuz he didn't win 16 games like Brady. Now it looks like Brady won't win the 11 games Cassel won. Keep the contradictions coming boys.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

I personally haven't seen that Frank.

My argument for Dorsey is that he was mis-used his rookie year, and now moved to a position that he really doesn't fit at, but could make work because of his overall talent level.

I think both Jackson and Dorsey will be serviceable players and have long careers.

I expect more than serviceable out of two Top-5 picks we have over $60M invested in, however.

I think the switching to the 3-4 was an absolute asinine move.

[dirk digler]

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

A "culture of losing" is a myth. When talented players and coaches are acquired, most teams tend to win.

Talking about fighting a "culture" is what losers do when they're not seeing results. It's a prolonged justification, citing something that is not quantifiable.

We haven't had a "losing culture" in KC; we've had a dog shit talent pool, on the 53 man roster and in the front office.

I agree with you about acquiring talented players and coaches but I also think once losing starts to set in it is hard to reverse that and takes awhile to get it turned around.

Some teams acquire alot of talent but still lose so I think there is some mental aspect of this.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

I could care less about the money, to be honest, because we have the cap space to eat it this year and next.

What troubles me is the commitment that the $$$ signifies.

Yep. Time.

Another wasted 3 years.

Then 2+ years of growing pains with a rookie QB.

Instead, we're getting 3 years of growing pains with a 27 year old.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by billay

Yea and Cassel sucked cuz he didn't win 16 games like Brady. Now it looks like Brady won't win the 11 games Cassel won. Keep the contradictions coming boys.

After watching Cassel play this year I don't know how anyone can defend him. Yea he sucked throwing the deep ball cause Moss was dogging it right? Yea guess what he still ****ing sucks throwing the deep ball, he's still inaccurate as ****, he still has no pocket awareness at all.

He has more games of under 100 yards passing than over 250, this is suppose to be our franchise guy.