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Old 01-05-2009, 03:54 PM   #1
eazyb81 eazyb81 is offline
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Originally Posted by Darth CarlSatan View Post
Define "adversity" in this case please.
Playing for a team like USC that is loaded with talent and always the favorite, you rarely are put in opportunities where you need to perservere against difficult odds. USC is always the favorite, always has more talent, and the goal is basically to not choke.

That's different than what someone like Matt Ryan, Eli Manning, Jay Cutler, etc. had to deal with in college, and I wonder if that lack of adversity has limited his growth.
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:02 PM   #2
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Originally Posted by eazyb81 View Post
That's different than what someone like Matt Ryan, Eli Manning, Jay Cutler, etc. had to deal with in college, and I wonder if that lack of adversity has limited his growth.
Limited his growth? Starting for a year and half for one of the best overall football teams in the country could somehow limit his growth?

This makes no sense. Are you implying that good QB's who play for shitty teams are ready-made for the NFL? If so, why did it take Eli Manning nearly four full seasons before the game began to click for him?

I'm sorry but this is a completely illogical viewpoint.
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:11 PM   #3
eazyb81 eazyb81 is offline
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Limited his growth? Starting for a year and half for one of the best overall football teams in the country could somehow limit his growth?
No, what I said is that his lack of adversity could limit his growth. Playing on a team that is loaded with talent is great in college, but I'm not at all convinced it's a great environment for a college QB. He hasn't had any adversity in his playing career, and no matter who he goes to next year, he's going to have a ton of adversity. Is he prepared for that?

Quote:
This makes no sense. Are you implying that good QB's who play for shitty teams are ready-made for the NFL? If so, why did it take Eli Manning nearly four full seasons before the game began to click for him?

I'm sorry but this is a completely illogical viewpoint.
No it's not. Physical talent being equal, a QB that has not faced adversity and has great players around him that help him win will be less prepared for the NFL than a QB that had the burden of being "the man" on his team and his team's only hope to win.

The latter player was not insulated in a comfortable environment, and should be more capable of handling the obvious adversity new QBs in the NFL face.
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:13 PM   #4
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Originally Posted by eazyb81 View Post
No, what I said is that his lack of adversity could limit his growth. Playing on a team that is loaded with talent is great in college, but I'm not at all convinced it's a great environment for a college QB. He hasn't had any adversity in his playing career, and no matter who he goes to next year, he's going to have a ton of adversity. Is he prepared for that?



No it's not. Physical talent being equal, a QB that has not faced adversity and has great players around him that help him win will be less prepared for the NFL than a QB that had the burden of being "the man" on his team and his team's only hope to win.

The latter player was not insulated in a comfortable environment, and should be more capable of handling the obvious adversity new QBs in the NFL face.
Yeah, those guys Elway, Marino, Montana, Young, Peyton Manning, Troy Aikman, Tom Brady - whew, those guys had it TOUGH in college.

JFC.
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:15 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
Yeah, those guys Elway, Marino, Montana, Young, Peyton Manning, Troy Aikman, Tom Brady - whew, those guys had it TOUGH in college.

JFC.
Do you realize that if you put Marino's college stats on a QB today nobody on this board would want to draft him?
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:16 PM   #6
OnTheWarpath15 OnTheWarpath15 is offline
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Do you realize that if you put Marino's college stats on a QB today nobody on this board would want to draft him?
Yeah, because the game hasn't changed a bit in 25 years.
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:17 PM   #7
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They'd still be trying to break Marino's records if he played CFB the way it is now.
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:18 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58 View Post
Yeah, because the game hasn't changed a bit in 25 years.
His accuracy and TD/INT ratio. They probably would have him in a spread today and everybody would be talking about how spread QB's don't make it in the NFL.
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:17 PM   #9
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Originally Posted by Chiefnj2 View Post
Do you realize that if you put Marino's college stats on a QB today nobody on this board would want to draft him?
Well, it's safe to say that practically no one "on this board" wanted Ryan last year either. Or Flacco.

So with all due respect save for a few people, I generally disregard 99% of the "opinions" around here regarding the draft.
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:21 PM   #10
eazyb81 eazyb81 is offline
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Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
Well, it's safe to say that practically no one "on this board" wanted Ryan last year either. Or Flacco.

So with all due respect save for a few people, I generally disregard 99% of the "opinions" around here regarding the draft.
Wrong. Luckily we have a neat little archive feature that allows us to see what people said last year before the draft.

I was a huge Ryan fan, I know Mecca was too, and I'm sure there were a few others. But most people focused too much on his INTs and blew him off.
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:18 PM   #11
eazyb81 eazyb81 is offline
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Yeah, those guys Elway, Marino, Montana, Young, Peyton Manning, Troy Aikman, Tom Brady - whew, those guys had it TOUGH in college.

JFC.
Are you ****ing kidding me?

Elway didn't even make a bowl game while at Stanford. THAT IS ADVERSITY. THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT.

Do more research on the programs of the rest of the QBs you named, and then compare them to what USC is now.

Give me a f'n break.
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:30 PM   #12
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Originally Posted by eazyb81 View Post
Are you ****ing kidding me?

Elway didn't even make a bowl game while at Stanford. THAT IS ADVERSITY. THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT.

Do more research on the programs of the rest of the QBs you named, and then compare them to what USC is now.

Give me a f'n break.
Ewww, Elway didn't make a bowl game.

Uh, he went to Stanford. He was regarded as the number one athlete in football and baseball.

There's nothing that would have stopped him from being successful in either sport.

Get it?
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:39 PM   #13
eazyb81 eazyb81 is offline
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Ewww, Elway didn't make a bowl game.

Uh, he went to Stanford. He was regarded as the number one athlete in football and baseball.

There's nothing that would have stopped him from being successful in either sport.

Get it?
WTF? Do you still not understand? Has the California air paralyzed your brain?

Elways faced ADVERSITY in his college career because his team SUCKED. He was always, ALWAYS, expected to carry the team; he had to work harder to prepare for teams with more talent; and he had to do it on his own, without great receivers, without a great o-line, without a great defense to keep him in the game.

The fact that he went to Stanford has NOTHING to do with it. The fact that he was a stud athlete has NOTHING to do with it.

Elway had to deal with challenges and adversity that Sanchez has not had to deal with.

My God, and you seriously sit here and act like you don't have a USC bias.
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:04 PM   #14
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Playing for a team like USC that is loaded with talent and always the favorite, you rarely are put in opportunities where you need to perservere against difficult odds. USC is always the favorite, always has more talent, and the goal is basically to not choke.

That's different than what someone like Matt Ryan, Eli Manning, Jay Cutler, etc. had to deal with in college, and I wonder if that lack of adversity has limited his growth.
I'll agree that they don't have to play Oregon every week, and in the case of a lesser athlete the concern is a valid one.
That said, I scarcely doubt you put Sanchez behind the Chiefs O-Line as it stands right now, and everything he has learned just crumbles to dust as the wheels fall off the wagon.

I'm sure our rookies who came from winning programs didn't much care for going 2-14, but that's not going to make them call it quits and give up. If Sanchez becomes the Chiefs QBOTF, he'll roll with the punches and more than likely adapt faster than any other guy we could pick this year.
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Old 01-05-2009, 04:09 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Darth CarlSatan View Post
I'll agree that they don't have to play Oregon every week, and in the case of a lesser athlete the concern is a valid one.
That said, I scarcely doubt you put Sanchez behind the Chiefs O-Line as it stands right now, and everything he has learned just crumbles to dust as the wheels fall off the wagon.

I'm sure our rookies who came from winning programs didn't much care for going 2-14, but that's not going to make them call it quits and give up. If Sanchez becomes the Chiefs QBOTF, he'll roll with the punches and more than likely adapt faster than any other guy we could pick this year.
ADDENDUM:

How the **** could I forget this?!

Who's the coach of that team Mark plays for? Has he coached at the pro level before?

Exactly.
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