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Old 02-23-2014, 08:50 PM  
Easy 6 Easy 6 is offline
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The "Fed"

I've brought this up a few times recently, and its nothing new here in DC, but it never seems to gain much traction... why do we have a COMPLETELY independent entity in charge of our money?

Its just a series of simple questions that add up to an ugly answer IMO... why are they called Federal, when they're not Federal at all.

Why are they allowed to control the American taxpayers money when they're NOT bound by FEDERAL law?

If they're not bound by our laws, if a US Congressman or committee cant force them to answer where billions and trillions of OUR money have gone, what law ARE they bound by?

I've read explanations here from both sides in the distant past, but nothing sticks out to me as a "oh, ok that makes perfect sense" answer... the reasons are vague and full of ambiguity, IIRC they're the kind of answers that even very educated people are confused by, but they make excuses for this "system" just because "that's the way things have been since 1913"

It seems like these guys fly under the radar 24/7... the media wont cover it and it isn't even possible to get a message board to address it seems, so I ask again... why are they necessary and who do they answer to? in todays world, why should we trust a group of bankers who answer to no KNOWN body?
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:56 PM   #2
KC native KC native is offline
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1. The Fed doesn't control tax payer money. They influence banks and credit (creation and destruction).

2. The Fed discloses where money goes and regularly releases that information. The anti-Fed types ignore that information.

3. The Federal Reserve was set up the way it is to keep it independent of political pressure. Since Greenspan, we've seen a lot less independence but historically the Fed has been independent so neither political party can assert they've taken actions to either goose or crash the economy for a certain political party.
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:04 PM   #3
petegz28 petegz28 is offline
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This is an important and fundamental question that no one can ever give a good answer to. I mean the entire meeting of the people that formed the Fed was so secret they only used first names at the meeting. President Wilson conceded after he signed it into law that he did a bad thing.

Some would argue that keeping it independent keeps it free from political influence and what not which is true but also irrelevant. It caters to the bankers and feeds corporate cronyism.

As we speak they are keeping and have been keeping rates at what most would call artificially low levels. Who benefits from that? Pretty much corporate America and that's it.

What they are doing is de-valuing the $ and the middle\lower classes. You can't even get a savings account that pays the current rate of inflation. In other words they are eroding the spending power of the 99%. The stock market has gone up significantly under Obama and why? Primarily because of Fed policy. These people are legal crooks and at the least should have to be audited on a regular basis.

I mean it's a pretty sweet gig when you can print money, set the rate of lending and then force banks to have to come to you for $. People are in prison for doing similar but the Fed can do it clean and clear and hide their books at that.
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:05 PM   #4
Easy 6 Easy 6 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KC native View Post
1. The Fed doesn't control tax payer money. They influence banks and credit (creation and destruction).

2. The Fed discloses where money goes and regularly releases that information. The anti-Fed types ignore that information.

3. The Federal Reserve was set up the way it is to keep it independent of political pressure. Since Greenspan, we've seen a lot less independence but historically the Fed has been independent so neither political party can assert they've taken actions to either goose or crash the economy for a certain political party.
#1 is an interesting thought... but how is it they loaned out 2.2 trillion, did they just imagine that money up to loan to God knows who?

Doesn't bank money atleast partially flow from taxpayers, is all of the money they control a banking/corporate construct?

Even if it comes from corporations and all of the arcane to the layman meanings and mechanisms of money, why is it that they are not forced to answer for where it goes... in short, who do they answer to?
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:05 PM   #5
petegz28 petegz28 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KC native View Post
1. The Fed doesn't control tax payer money. They influence banks and credit (creation and destruction).

2. The Fed discloses where money goes and regularly releases that information. The anti-Fed types ignore that information.

3. The Federal Reserve was set up the way it is to keep it independent of political pressure. Since Greenspan, we've seen a lot less independence but historically the Fed has been independent so neither political party can assert they've taken actions to either goose or crash the economy for a certain political party.
For as smart as I know you are when it comes to economics, that is a very na´ve post and I think deep down you know that.
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:09 PM   #6
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Really pay attention at around 10:40
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:25 PM   #7
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You seem to me to have a pretty solid handle on the basics of this, Pete... what bothers me is that you take so much flack from the older guys here for challenging the status quo.

I've never once seen you advocate for taking money from "the 1%" or any of that nonsense... they earned it, they keep it is fine by me and you as well as far as I can tell, we don't want anyone elses money, just a chance for Americans to earn their own... but you, and others, seem to be relentlessly attacked and ridiculed for even mentioning that something is terribly wrong, something is ruining this country.

The people in question point to "the other" party, but its becoming plain to see that both parties are beholden to the same interests and are both complicit in whats happening.
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:30 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KC native View Post
1. The Fed doesn't control tax payer money. They influence banks and credit (creation and destruction).

2. The Fed discloses where money goes and regularly releases that information. The anti-Fed types ignore that information.

3. The Federal Reserve was set up the way it is to keep it independent of political pressure. Since Greenspan, we've seen a lot less independence but historically the Fed has been independent so neither political party can assert they've taken actions to either goose or crash the economy for a certain political party.
Native finally said something factual. Also E&Y or a major accounting firm does regular audits.
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:34 PM   #9
petegz28 petegz28 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scott free View Post
You seem to me to have a pretty solid handle on the basics of this, Pete... what bothers me is that you take so much flack from the older guys here for challenging the status quo.

I've never once seen you advocate for taking money from "the 1%" or any of that nonsense... they earned it, they keep it is fine by me and you as well as far as I can tell, we don't want anyone elses money, just a chance for Americans to earn their own... but you, and others, seem to be relentlessly attacked and ridiculed for even mentioning that something is terribly wrong, something is ruining this country.

The people in question point to "the other" party, but its becoming plain to see that both parties are beholden to the same interests and are both complicit in whats happening.
This is exactly it. It's a shame, really. I have family members who own their own businesses and make a good living and I don't think they should have to give their money away at the whim of some politician preaching "fairness".

What rich people don't seem to get is that the money is going to leave their pockets in one form or another. Either by paying good salaries and benefits or by being taxed to pay for an increasing welfare state. They have more control and stand to benefit more from the former, of course.
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:34 PM   #10
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Sadly, JFK had signed an Executive Order which would've pretty much put the Federal Reserve out of the money printing business. He was assassinated soon after and the Order was pretty much swept under the rug.
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:38 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
Native finally said something factual. Also E&Y or a major accounting firm does regular audits.
Who is E&Y... why doesn't the fed chairman have to tell Congress where the money is going?

There isn't a real explanation for... why aren't they accountable to Congress... Bernanke had the guts to tell Congress to go pound sand when asked to account for himself, if its all common knowledge thanks to "E&Y", is Congress not privy to the "E&Y" reports?

Why ask Bernanke if its all so readily available and transparent?
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:39 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by rockymtnchief View Post
Sadly, JFK had signed an Executive Order which would've pretty much put the Federal Reserve out of the money printing business. He was assassinated soon after and the Order was pretty much swept under the rug.
Whole nother subject, but lets not get too deep into it lest we're laughed off of the Planet... some things just don't want to be known.
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:40 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by scott free View Post
Who is E&Y... why doesn't the fed chairman have to tell Congress where the money is going?

There isn't a real explanation for... why aren't they accountable to Congress... Bernanke had the guts to tell Congress to go pound sand when asked to account for himself, if its all common knowledge thanks to "E&Y", is Congress not privy to the "E&Y" reports?

Why ask Bernanke if its all so readily available and transparent?
Don't buy this crap about the audits. During all the TARP hoopla, the Fed was allowed to hide where all the money was going. It took the SCOTUS ruling several years after the fact that they had to disclose. Also on a more personal level, Bernanke is a ****ing idiot. The man was never right about 1 ****ing thing during is time as Fed Chair.
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:46 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KC native View Post
1. The Fed doesn't control tax payer money. They influence banks and credit (creation and destruction).

2. The Fed discloses where money goes and regularly releases that information. The anti-Fed types ignore that information.

3. The Federal Reserve was set up the way it is to keep it independent of political pressure. Since Greenspan, we've seen a lot less independence but historically the Fed has been independent so neither political party can assert they've taken actions to either goose or crash the economy for a certain political party.


This is a bunch of bullshit.
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Old 02-23-2014, 09:47 PM   #15
petegz28 petegz28 is offline
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Just remember 1 thing, the Fed prints money that is backed by nothing more than the full faith and credit of the USA. In other words, the ****ing tax payers.
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