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Old 02-20-2014, 01:35 PM  
Saccopoo Saccopoo is offline
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2014 NFL Combine - Players - The WRs

Wide Receivers:

Jared Abbrederis, Wisconsin
6'1", 195 lb., 31 3/8" arms, 9 5/8" hands

Davante Adams, Fresno State
6'1", 212 lb., 32 5/8" arms, 9" hands

Odell Beckham, LSU
5'11 1/4", 198 lb., 32 3/4" arms, 10" hands

Kelvin Benjamin, Florida State
6'5", 240 lb., 34 7/8" arms, 10 1/4" hands

Christopher Boyd, Vanderbilt
6'4", 206 lb., 32 5/8" arms, 9 3/8" hands

Philly Brown, Ohio State
5'11", 178 lb., 31 3/4" arms, 9 3/8" hands

John Brown, Pittsburg State
5'11", 179 lb., 30 1/2" arms, 8 1/2" hands

Martavis Bryant, Clemson
6'3 1/2", 211 lb., 32 5/8" arms, 9 1/2" hands

Isaiah Burse, Fresno State
5'10", 188 lb., 30 1/4" arms, 8 3/8" hands

Michael Campanaro, Wake Forest
5'9", 192 lb., 30" arms, 9 3/4" hands

Brandon Coleman Rutgers
6'6", 225 lb., 34" arms, 9 1/4" hands

Kain Colter, Northwestern
5'10", 198 lb., 31" arms, 10" hands

Brandin Cooks, Oregon State
5'9 1/2", 189 lb., 30 1/2" arms, 9 5/8" hands

Damian Copeland, Louisville
5'11", 184 lb., 31 3/8" arms, 9" hands

Mike Davis, Texas
6'0", 197 lb., 32 3/4" arms, 10" hands

Bruce Ellington, South Carolina
5'9 1/4", 197 lb., 31" arms, 9 5/8" hands

Quincy Enunwa, Nebraska
6'2", 225 lb., 32 5/8" arms, 9 1/2" hands

Mike Evans, Texas A&M
6'4 1/2", 231 lb., 35 1/8" arms, 9 5/8" hands

Shaq Evans, UCLA
6'1", 213 lb., 32" arms, 9 3/8" hands

Bennie Fowler, Michigan State
6'1", 217 lb., 32" arms, 9 3/8" hands

Austin Franklin, New Mexico State
5'11", 189 lb., 31 1/4" arms, 10" hands

Jeremy Gallon, Michigan
5'7", 185 lb., 29 1/2" arms, 9 3/8" hands

Ryan Grant, Tulane
6'0", 199 lb., 31" arms, 9 5/8" hands

Matt Hazel, Coastal Carolina
6'1", 198 lb., 31 2/8" arms, 9 1/8" hands

Robert Herron, Wyoming
5'9", 193 lb., 30 1/2" arms, 9 3/4" hands

Cody Hoffman, BYU
6'4", 223 lb., 33 1/4" arms, 9 3/4" hands

Josh Huff, Oregon
5'11", 206 lb., 31 1/4" arms, 9 3/8" hands

Allen Hurns, Miami (FL)
6'1", 198 lb., 32" arms, 9 1/4" hands

Jeff Janis, Saginaw Valley State
6'3", 219 lb., 32 1/2" arms, 9" hands

T.J. Jones, Notre Dame
6'0", 188 lb., 30 5/8" arms, 10" hands

Jarvis Landry, LSU
5'11 1/4", 198 lb., 31 1/4" arms, 10 1/4" hands

Cody Latimer, Indiana
6'2", 215 lb., 32 5/8" arms, 9 5/8" hands

Marqise Lee, USC
5'11 1/2", 192 lb., 31 1/4" arms, 9 1/2" hands

Marcus Lucas, Missouri
6'4", 218 lb., 33 5/8" arms, 9 3/8" hands

Jordan Matthews, Vanderbilt
6'3", 212 lb., 33 1/4" arms, 10 3/4" hands

Donte Moncrief, Mississippi
6'2", 221 lb., 32 2/8" arms, 9 1/8" hands

Kevin Norwood, Alabama
6'2", 198 lb., 32 1/8" arms, 10" hands

Walt Powell, Murray State
5'11", 189 lb., 31 5/8" arms, 9 1/2" hands

Tevin Reese, Baylor
5'10", 163 lb., 31 5/8" arms, 8 5/8" hands

Paul Richardson, Colorado
6'0", 175 lb., 32 5/8" arms, 8 7/8" hands

Allen Robinson, Penn State
6'2 1/4", 220 lb., 32" arms, 9 1/2" hands

Jalen Saunders, Oklahoma
5'9", 163 lb., 30" arms, 8 7/8" hands

Willie Snead, Ball State
5'11", 195 lb., 31" arms, 10 1/4" hands

Josh Stewart, Oklahoma State
5'10", 178 lb., 30" arms, 9 3/8" hands

Devin Street, Pittsburgh
6'3", 198 lb., 33 2/8" arms, 9 1/4" hands

L'Damian Washington, Missouri
6'4", 195 lb., 33 3/8" arms, 9" hands

Sammy Watkins, Clemson
6'0 1/2", 211 lb., 32" arms, 9 5/8" hands

Albert Wilson, Georgia State
5'9", 202 lb., 30 3/8" arms, 9 1/8" hands


2013 Top WR Drafted & Combine Results:

Tavon Austion, West Virginia
5'8", 174 lb., 30" arms, 9 1/8" hands
Bench: 14 reps
40: 4.34 seconds
Vertical: 32.0"
Broad Jump: 120.0"
20 Yard Shuttle: 4.01 seconds

Last edited by Saccopoo; 02-21-2014 at 09:51 PM..
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Old 02-26-2014, 10:23 AM   #46
saphojunkie saphojunkie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frosty View Post
Cooks broke the Combine record for the 60 yard shuttle and tied the Combine for the 20 yard shuttle. He also had a 36" vertical which was upper mid-pack. That doesn't sound that impressive until you realize that Cooks is one of the shorter WRs at the Combine. Watkins has 3" on him and 4" longer arms, yet had a 34" vertical. Cooks is fast and shifty. He can also go up and get the ball in traffic.

Compared to Tavon Austin last year (Cooks in red):

Tavon Austion, West Virginia
5'8", 174 lb., 30" arms, 9 1/8" hands
5'9 1/2", 189 lb., 30 1/2" arms, 9 5/8" hands
Bench: 14 reps
Bench: 16 reps
40: 4.34 seconds
40: 4.33 seconds
Vertical: 32.0"
Vertical: 36.0"
Broad Jump: 120.0"
Broad Jump: 120.0"
20 Yard Shuttle: 4.01 seconds
20 Yard Shuttle: 3.81 seconds
I'd prefer if our first round receiver did better than 400 yards receiving in his rookie year.

Cooks is an excellent pick for a team that already has weapons in the passing game. That's not us. We need a legit #1 receiver or tight end.

If we were able to trade back from 23 to say... 26 and pick up a 2nd rounder, then I could see us going Amaro in the first and coming back for a WR with the next pick.
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Old 02-26-2014, 10:23 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by Frosty View Post
Cooks broke the Combine record for the 60 yard shuttle and tied the Combine for the 20 yard shuttle. He also had a 36" vertical which was upper mid-pack. That doesn't sound that impressive until you realize that Cooks is one of the shorter WRs at the Combine. Watkins has 3" on him and 4" longer arms, yet had a 34" vertical. Cooks is fast and shifty. He can also go up and get the ball in traffic.
So if Cooks jumps 36", his reach and catch radius would still be considerably smaller than Watkins, so what was the point in posting that? Lol. If he had a 40" vertical and Watkins only jumped 30", then you could make a case. But a 2" difference in their verticals doesn't make up for about 8" in reach.
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Old 02-26-2014, 10:32 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OldSchool View Post
So if Cooks jumps 36", his reach and catch radius would still be considerably smaller than Watkins, so what was the point in posting that? Lol. If he had a 40" vertical and Watkins only jumped 30", then you could make a case. But a 2" difference in their verticals doesn't make up for about 8" in reach.
Two very different WRs that will fill very different roles on whatever team they land on.
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Old 02-26-2014, 10:37 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by saphojunkie View Post
I'd prefer if our first round receiver did better than 400 yards receiving in his rookie year.

Cooks is an excellent pick for a team that already has weapons in the passing game. That's not us. We need a legit #1 receiver or tight end.

If we were able to trade back from 23 to say... 26 and pick up a 2nd rounder, then I could see us going Amaro in the first and coming back for a WR with the next pick.
Riley doesn't play his freshmen very much. The Beavers were also uber-bad that year, with a freshman QB (who played out of necessity).

For the Chiefs, I personally believe that a fast TE or a pass rushing OLB would have the biggest impact on the Chiefs. My post was more about being a fan of Cooks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OldSchool View Post
So if Cooks jumps 36", his reach and catch radius would still be considerably smaller than Watkins, so what was the point in posting that? Lol. If he had a 40" vertical and Watkins only jumped 30", then you could make a case. But a 2" difference in their verticals doesn't make up for about 8" in reach.
My point was about his athleticism for those morons that say he is only a slot receiver in the NFL. As for your point, Cooks is faster with better change of direction than Watkins, which may make up for some of that "catch radius" (note - this is not a bash on Watkins; just a comparison with arguably the best WR in this draft).
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Old 02-26-2014, 10:45 AM   #50
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Beckham, Moncrief and Mathews are my personal draft crushes at WR.
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Old 02-26-2014, 11:17 AM   #51
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My point was about his athleticism for those morons that say he is only a slot receiver in the NFL. As for your point, Cooks is faster with better change of direction than Watkins, which may make up for some of that "catch radius" (note - this is not a bash on Watkins; just a comparison with arguably the best WR in this draft).
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sport...elite-wr_x.htm
Quote:
When asked how Smith compensates for his lack of height, Henning laughs.

"With a 43-inch vertical jump," he says. "You're talking about a guy who can dunk backwards. He explodes to the ball, even when he's trying to jump over people. He gets tall in a hurry."
That's 7" more vertical range than Cooks.

Cooks is a lot closer to Austin than he is to Steve Smith. He's a slot guy and you would be a fool to try to depend on him as an outside #1 type receiver. Let him play in the slot and work in space where he's best at. Sure you can line him up outside, but he's going to have limited success there. You want him facing the 3rd best corner on the other team, not the top 2 cover guys.
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Old 02-26-2014, 11:18 AM   #52
saphojunkie saphojunkie is offline
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Originally Posted by Frosty View Post
Riley doesn't play his freshmen very much. The Beavers were also uber-bad that year, with a freshman QB (who played out of necessity).

For the Chiefs, I personally believe that a fast TE or a pass rushing OLB would have the biggest impact on the Chiefs. My post was more about being a fan of Cooks.
I was actually talking about Tayvon Austin last year in St. Louis. Personally I never really liked that pick. I know he's a playmaker, but that team needed a workhorse.

The funny thing is that they'll probably get one now in either Watkins or Evans. And then Tayvon will blow up.

Which could be Cooks for us... But I think I'd just rather go with Beckham or Lee - someone who can take over for Bowe in a couple years. I'm not saying Cooks is a gimmick WR - he's definitely not a midget like McCluster or Devon Wylie (!), but I'm just... I don't know.

****ing Baldwin has just made me totally gunshy on receivers across the board. But we absolutely need one.
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Old 02-26-2014, 11:22 AM   #53
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Even without Albert, I think our line just needs shuffled and has the potential to be really good.

LT fisher
Lg Hudson
C Kush
RG Schwartz
RT Stephenson

That line has the makings of a really solid unit.
Schwartz is on his way out according to some rumors.
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Old 02-26-2014, 11:31 AM   #54
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Beckham, Moncrief and Mathews are my personal draft crushes at WR.
I would like Moncreif if he didn't drop the ball so much and just look plain lazy at times. For a WR of his size, his run blocking leaves something to be desired as he can get pushed around by much smaller corners. Reminds me way too much of Dwayne Bowe.

Matthews is a try-hard with an incredible work ethic and great measurables; I'm just not sure that he has the ability to separate at the NFL level because he struggled with it in college against decent corners. Also, for how big his hands are, he was inconsistent at catching the ball in 2013, just like Moncreif.

Beckham has fringe #1 measurables. Best thing about him is his ability to go up and get the ball and his bigger than normal hands for his size as well as his relatively long arms at 32 3/4". Explosive player with a 38.5" vertical and it's on display in game tape as well so he's not just a workout warrior. He has the catch radius of a much larger WR with the ability of a smaller WR to create separation with his explosion. He does have concentration issues once in a while though and will look to run before securing the catch. Needs to be more consistent in reeling in contested catches as well, his hands are too strong for him to drop as many passes as he does.

This is ridiculous:


And here against my favorite corner in this draft, sorry Verrett, he got you good on this one:



If he were more consistent with everything that he flashes as a WR, Beckham would be in discussions with Watkins as the top WR in this class.
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Old 02-26-2014, 11:50 AM   #55
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http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sport...elite-wr_x.htm


That's 7" more vertical range than Cooks.
That's cool and all, Bob, but he jumped 34" at the Combine, 2" less than Cooks. Since we don't know their starting points in the vertical, you can't accurately compare the two. However, assuming Watkins' height isn't a result of a freakishly long head, Watkins has 3" on height and 1.5" on arm length, with the same size hands. Subtract out the 2" difference in the jump, you have Watkins with a max 2.5" difference.

As for the catch radius, Watkins' arms are an 1.5" longer, so it's not like there is a huge difference in the catch radius.

This argument is stupid and pointless (big surprise there, Bob). The point wasn't to bash Watkins or to say Cooks is better; it was just to say Cooks isn't that far off from the best.

Cooks wasn't a household name because he played at Oregon State, not USC or in the SEC, so it appears that people here don't know him or have watched him play (except for Pest and his awesome wife). I was trying to put in a perspective of someone who had watched him play a lot. I am also not pushing for the Chiefs to draft him (though I would be cool with it).

However, you're the guy that said you would rather have Josh Huff over Brandin Cooks (lol), so I figure you're just another delusional Ducks fan.
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Old 02-26-2014, 12:11 PM   #56
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Cooks wasn't a household name because he played at Oregon State, not USC or in the SEC, so it appears that people here don't know him or have watched him play (except for Pest and his awesome wife). I was trying to put in a perspective of someone who had watched him play a lot. I am also not pushing for the Chiefs to draft him (though I would be cool with it).

However, you're the guy that said you would rather have Josh Huff over Brandin Cooks (lol), so I figure you're just another delusional Ducks fan.
Cooks was ineffective when he lined up against Ekpre Olomu. I'm from California, I went to UC Berkeley. I'm well aware of the fact that Cooks feasted on inferior CB talent in the Pac-12. The only true potential starting NFL level corner that Cooks faced was Ekpre Olomu out of Oregon. Here were the targets he had against Ekpre Olomu.

1st target: 8 yard hitch, complete for 1st down. 0 YAC.

2nd target: 6 yard in route, result- Pass broken up by Ekpre Olomu, Cooks stopped his route cause he had nowhere to go.

3rd target: Deep post in the end zone, result- INT by Ekpre Olomu, no separation created by Cooks. He didn't even fight for the ball and Olomu is just as small as he is.

4th target: Another post about 10 yards, result: Incomplete pass broken up by Ekpre Olomu, again, Cooks had zero separation against the only potential NFL starting caliber CB he faced.

Etc etc. Get the picture? Whenever Cooks lined up outside against a good CB, he couldn't do anything. His only real damage that he did against Oregon in that game was via little underneath screen plays or against the significantly less talented Terrence Mitchell. Cooks is not a #1 WR and should not be thought of as such. He will not have consistent success going up against #1 cover corners in this league. His place is in the slot where he can do his damage against lesser opponents like Victor Cruz does.
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Old 02-26-2014, 12:15 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by OldSchool View Post
I would like Moncreif if he didn't drop the ball so much and just look plain lazy at times. For a WR of his size, his run blocking leaves something to be desired as he can get pushed around by much smaller corners. Reminds me way too much of Dwayne Bowe.

Matthews is a try-hard with an incredible work ethic and great measurables; I'm just not sure that he has the ability to separate at the NFL level because he struggled with it in college against decent corners. Also, for how big his hands are, he was inconsistent at catching the ball in 2013, just like Moncreif.

Beckham has fringe #1 measurables. Best thing about him is his ability to go up and get the ball and his bigger than normal hands for his size as well as his relatively long arms at 32 3/4". Explosive player with a 38.5" vertical and it's on display in game tape as well so he's not just a workout warrior. He has the catch radius of a much larger WR with the ability of a smaller WR to create separation with his explosion. He does have concentration issues once in a while though and will look to run before securing the catch. Needs to be more consistent in reeling in contested catches as well, his hands are too strong for him to drop as many passes as he does.

This is ridiculous:


And here against my favorite corner in this draft, sorry Verrett, he got you good on this one:



If he were more consistent with everything that he flashes as a WR, Beckham would be in discussions with Watkins as the top WR in this class.
Re: Moncrief, are we talking about the same guy? He's a great blocker. He also never seems to get caught from behind. He's a vertical threat compared to Bowe's. I think he takes the top off of defenses but will fight for the ball also.

I agree that Matthews is a motor guy...which is what I like about him. He probably learned that from his older cousin. But he's not slow like you're suggesting. 4.46 is a very solid WR speed.
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Old 02-26-2014, 12:19 PM   #58
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Re: Moncrief, are we talking about the same guy? He's a great blocker. He also never seems to get caught from behind. He's a vertical threat compared to Bowe's. I think he takes the top off of defenses but will fight for the ball also.

I agree that Matthews is a motor guy...which is what I like about him. He probably learned that from his older cousin. But he's not slow like you're suggesting. 4.46 is a very solid WR speed.
Yes, same Moncrief. To me he looks like he takes plays off.

As far as Matthews goes, he does not look like a 4.46 guy at all; which is why I was surprised when he timed that fast in the 40.
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Old 02-26-2014, 12:29 PM   #59
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Cooks was ineffective when he lined up against Ekpre Olomu. I'm from California, I went to UC Berkeley. I'm well aware of the fact that Cooks feasted on inferior CB talent in the Pac-12. The only true potential starting NFL level corner that Cooks faced was Ekpre Olomu out of Oregon. Here were the targets he had against Ekpre Olomu.

1st target: 8 yard hitch, complete for 1st down. 0 YAC.

2nd target: 6 yard in route, result- Pass broken up by Ekpre Olomu, Cooks stopped his route cause he had nowhere to go.

3rd target: Deep post in the end zone, result- INT by Ekpre Olomu, no separation created by Cooks. He didn't even fight for the ball and Olomu is just as small as he is.

4th target: Another post about 10 yards, result: Incomplete pass broken up by Ekpre Olomu, again, Cooks had zero separation against the only potential NFL starting caliber CB he faced.

Etc etc. Get the picture? Whenever Cooks lined up outside against a good CB, he couldn't do anything. His only real damage that he did against Oregon in that game was via little underneath screen plays or against the significantly less talented Terrence Mitchell. Cooks is not a #1 WR and should not be thought of as such. He will not have consistent success going up against #1 cover corners in this league. His place is in the slot where he can do his damage against lesser opponents like Victor Cruz does.

You make it sound like Ekpre Olomu covered him one on one in the Civil War. The Ducks rolled their coverage towards Cooks and did everything they could to take him out of the game. They paid so much attention to Cooks, the Beavers were able to run at will, something they hadn't been able to do all season.

The Cal connections explains a lot.
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Old 02-26-2014, 12:40 PM   #60
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Yes, same Moncrief. To me he looks like he takes plays off.

As far as Matthews goes, he does not look like a 4.46 guy at all; which is why I was surprised when he timed that fast in the 40.
I have watched mostly highlights and reviews and not heard (or seen) that on Moncrief. Can you point me to something that demonstratights that?

The highlights I've seen show Mathews has some speed...but he was also hampered with a QB that really didn't have much of an arm. I see him adjusting his routes quite a bit.
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