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Old 03-08-2012, 11:50 AM  
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Neighborhood watch captain shoots innocent black youth and doesn't even get arrested

http://news.yahoo.com/family-florida...044537742.html




ORLANDO, Florida (Reuters) - The family of a 17-year-old African-American boy shot to death last month in his gated Florida community by a white Neighborhood Watch captain wants to see the captain arrested, the family's lawyer said on Wednesday.

Trayvon Martin was shot dead after he took a break from watching NBA All-Star game television coverage to walk 10 minutes to a convenience store to buy snacks including Skittles candy requested by his 13-year-old brother, Chad, the family's lawyer Ben Crump said.

"He was a good kid," Crump said in an interview, adding that the family would issue a call for the Watch captain's arrest at a news conference on Thursday. "On his way home, a Neighborhood Watch loose cannon shot and killed him."

[Related: Fla. teen avoids deportation]

Trayvon, who lived in Miami with his mother, had been visiting his father and stepmother in a gated townhome community called The Retreat at Twin Lakes in Sanford, 20 miles north of Orlando.

As Trayvon returned to the townhome, Sanford police received a 911 call reporting a suspicious person.

Although names are blacked out on the police report, Crump and media reports at the time of the shooting identified the caller as George Zimmerman who is listed in the community's newsletter as the Neighborhood Watch captain.

Without waiting for police to arrive, Crump said, Zimmerman confronted Trayvon, who was on the sidewalk near his home. By the time police got there, Trayvon was dead of a single gunshot to the chest.

"What do the police find in his pocket? Skittles," Crump said. "A can of Arizona ice tea in his jacket pocket and Skittles in his front pocket for his brother Chad."

Zimmerman could not be reached for comment on Wednesday evening at a phone number listed for him on the community's newsletter.

Crump said the family was concerned that police might decide to consider the shooting as self defense, and that police have ignored the family's request for a copy of the original 911 call, which they think will shed light on the incidents.

"If the 911 protocol across the country held to form here, they told him not to get involved. He disobeyed that order," said Ryan Julison, a spokesman for the family.

"He (Zimmerman) didn't have to get out of his car," said Crump, who has prepared a public records lawsuit to file on Thursday if the family doesn't get the 911 tape. "If he never gets out of his car, there is no reason for self-defense. Trayvon only has skittles. He has the gun."

Since Trayvon, a high school junior who wanted to be a pilot, was black and Zimmerman is white, Crump said race is "the 600 pound elephant in the room."

"Why is this kid suspicious in the first place? I think a stereotype must have been placed on the kid," Crump said.

(Editing By Cynthia Johnston and Peter Bohan)

Last edited by Bump; 07-12-2013 at 11:19 PM..
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Old 03-25-2012, 10:56 AM   #1441
Just Passin' By Just Passin' By is offline
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Originally Posted by VAChief View Post
Yes, he clearly had a brutal beat down. A bloody nose and some grass stains, while a kid has bullet in his chest. That is some twisted logic.
Assuming Zimmerman's injuries are legitimate injuries and from a confrontation with Martin, and assuming Martin attacked first, exactly how much of a beating should Zimmerman allowed himself to take before drawing his weapon?
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Old 03-25-2012, 10:57 AM   #1442
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Originally Posted by pr_capone View Post
the kid did not live in that gated community. he was visiting his father.

http://www.myfoxtampabay.com/dpp/new...erman-03232012

Witness: Martin attacked Zimmerman

I know... the thread is tl;dr. I get it, jumping to conclusions is a whole lotta fun
And Zimmerman once assaulted a cop, had a history of calling the police over the simplest of infractions. He was a time-bomb waiting to happen and he was let go without even an afterthought that maybe his story had a few holes.

The police completely botched this whole thing. They didn't even take Barney's gun. This wasn't a fender bender this was someone's life. I would expect more diligence than what transpired.
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Old 03-25-2012, 10:58 AM   #1443
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Originally Posted by Just Passin' By View Post
Assuming Zimmerman's injuries are legitimate injuries and from a confrontation with Martin, and assuming Martin attacked first, exactly how much of a beating should Zimmerman allowed himself to take before drawing his weapon?

Zimmerman should have taken several possible brain damaging blows before he decided he had enough..
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Old 03-25-2012, 11:00 AM   #1444
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Originally Posted by VAChief View Post
And Zimmerman once assaulted a cop, had a history of calling the police over the simplest of infractions. He was a time-bomb waiting to happen and he was let go without even an afterthought that maybe his story had a few holes.

The police completely botched this whole thing. They didn't even take Barney's gun. This wasn't a fender bender this was someone's life. I would expect more diligence than what transpired.
His record was clean enough to get a CCW and that's not easy here, they checked me out fully, even called my Dr.
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Old 03-25-2012, 11:07 AM   #1445
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Originally Posted by Just Passin' By View Post
Assuming Zimmerman's injuries are legitimate injuries and from a confrontation with Martin, and assuming Martin attacked first, exactly how much of a beating should Zimmerman allowed himself to take before drawing his weapon?
That's a pretty big leap, but no I don't think getting punched in the face by a 140 pound kid warrants the leap to pulling your 9mm to cap someone.

I think the more likely assumption was that Zimmerman was the aggressor. Who was following who? Who was making the false accusations? What rights did Martin have to defend himself?

We are left to take the word of the only person with a deadly weapon. Someone with a history of his own vigilante justice.
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Old 03-25-2012, 11:11 AM   #1446
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His record was clean enough to get a CCW and that's not easy here, they checked me out fully, even called my Dr.
Only because he entered a first offender diversion course. He was charged with a felony which would have precluded him with getting his permit.

I wonder if the police would have been so willing to accept his story had they looked a little deeper at the time. They don't usually take too kindly to that sort of behavior. It certainly demonstrates an inclination to not thinking things through very well.
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Old 03-25-2012, 11:18 AM   #1447
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Originally Posted by R8ers View Post
Zimmerman should have taken several possible brain damaging blows before he decided he had enough..
Was his brain damaged with the blows he took? What reason are you using to say that subsequent "blows" would be more damaging? At what point should he have maybe...I don't know...tried to get away?

Can you possibly take the poor kids point of view and imagine what a guy who has been following you pulls a gun? What rights for defense does he have?

Who is responsible for the confrontation? A kid is dead because Zimmerman followed him with a gun and confronted him. The police inexplicably released him with his gun. Even if they had every reason to believe him, prudence would say confiscate it for evidence to prove that belief.
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Old 03-25-2012, 11:26 AM   #1448
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Originally Posted by VAChief View Post
That's a pretty big leap, but no I don't think getting punched in the face by a 140 pound kid warrants the leap to pulling your 9mm to cap someone.

I think the more likely assumption was that Zimmerman was the aggressor. Who was following who? Who was making the false accusations? What rights did Martin have to defend himself?

We are left to take the word of the only person with a deadly weapon. Someone with a history of his own vigilante justice.
You're avoiding the question, which is a legitimate question in response to your post

Quote:
Yes, he clearly had a brutal beat down. A bloody nose and some grass stains, while a kid has bullet in his chest. That is some twisted logic.
and has nothing to do with the size or age of either party, and everything to do with your dismissal of Zimmerman's injuries, so let me ask it again. Assuming Zimmerman's injuries are legitimate injuries and from a confrontation with Martin, and assuming Martin attacked first, exactly how much of a beating should Zimmerman have allowed himself to take before drawing his weapon?
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Old 03-25-2012, 11:28 AM   #1449
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Originally Posted by VAChief View Post
Was his brain damaged with the blows he took? What reason are you using to say that subsequent "blows" would be more damaging? At what point should he have maybe...I don't know...tried to get away?

Can you possibly take the poor kids point of view and imagine what a guy who has been following you pulls a gun? What rights for defense does he have?

Who is responsible for the confrontation? A kid is dead because Zimmerman followed him with a gun and confronted him. The police inexplicably released him with his gun. Even if they had every reason to believe him, prudence would say confiscate it for evidence to prove that belief.
I am not going thru all this shit again as all this has already been answered 20 times in this thread...

If the kid attacked Zimmerman he made a grave mistake... Sorry he is dead but when you choose to take the law into your own hands, sometimes things like this happen...

Not a fan of Zimmerman but I am a fan of the law allowing a person that is attacked to be able to defend himself up to and including deadly force...

Don't want to get shot? Don't attack people...
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Old 03-25-2012, 11:31 AM   #1450
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Originally Posted by R8ers View Post
I am not going thru all this shit again as all this has already been answered 20 times in this thread...

If the kid attacked Zimmerman he made a grave mistake... Sorry he is dead but when you choose to take the law into your own hands, sometimes things like this happen...

Not a fan of Zimmerman but I am a fan of the law allowing a person that is attacked to be able to defend himself up to and including deadly force...

Don't want to get shot? Don't attack people...
Yes, Martin should have just let Zimmerman shoot him.
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Old 03-25-2012, 11:36 AM   #1451
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SANFORD, Fla. — There is a great deal of misinformation surrounding the Trayvon Martin shooting. Here are some of the most prominent misunderstandings:

—Cops returned the gun to shooter George Zimmerman.

Untrue, according to police. Sanford Officer Tim Smith handcuffed Zimmerman, and then pulled from a holster in Zimmerman’s waistband the black Kel Tec 9 mm PF9, a semiautomatic. The gun is now in the possession of authorities, officially part of the evidence in the case.

Zimmerman, though, still has a valid concealed-weapons permit.

—Cops believed Zimmerman had a “squeaky clean” criminal record.

Untrue, according to Sanford City Manager Norton Bonaparte Jr. During an early meeting with Trayvon’s father, a Sanford police investigator told him Zimmerman described himself as being “squeaky clean.” Trayvon’s father “may have misconstrued” that the investigator was merely relaying Zimmerman’s claim, Bonaparte Jr. wrote in a public statement.

In reality, Zimmerman had been arrested in 2005 at a UCF-area bar and charged with resisting arrest without violence. He completed a pretrial-diversion program, meaning the case was officially dropped, and he wound up with no conviction on his record. It’s not clear when, but police did check Zimmerman’s criminal record and know about that arrest.

—The cops tested Trayvon for drugs but not Zimmerman.

True, according to authorities. Trayvon underwent an autopsy, the same as in every other suspicious death in Florida, and as part of that, was tested for drugs. Zimmerman was not tested because he was not arrested.

Sanford cops usually call a prosecutor to the scene of a homicide but did not that night.

True, according to police and the State Attorney’s Office in Seminole-Brevard. Police talked to a prosecutor by phone that night, but she did not go to the scene. Based on the evidence they gathered that night, police believed they did not have enough evidence to arrest Zimmerman on a manslaughter charge because of his account of what happened and claim of self-defense.

—Zimmerman fired twice, a warning shot and a kill shot.

Untrue, according to several witnesses and law enforcement. Two loud bangs can be heard on one 911 call, and family attorneys said last week that that was evidence of two shots, but several witnesses who’ve spoken publicly about what they heard all describe a single shot. And a source close to the investigation told The Orlando Sentinel just one shot was fired from Zimmerman’s gun.
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Old 03-25-2012, 11:37 AM   #1452
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You're avoiding the question, which is a legitimate question in response to your post



and has nothing to do with the size or age of either party, and everything to do with your dismissal of Zimmerman's injuries, so let me ask it again. Assuming Zimmerman's injuries are legitimate injuries and from a confrontation with Martin, and assuming Martin attacked first, exactly how much of a beating should Zimmerman have allowed himself to take before drawing his weapon?

I answered your asinine assumptions. More than a bloody nose and some grass stains. I don't believe that rises to "fearing for your life."

It is interesting that you are so willing to believe the clear aggressor in this situation. What is he supposed to say..."Well I told him to stop, he wouldn't I put my hands on him and he punched me in the face I got pissed, pulled my piece and shot him in the chest."

My beef is not convicting the guy before presenting evidence, but that no apparent thought was given to maybe his story was full of crap and self serving.
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Old 03-25-2012, 11:42 AM   #1453
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In a dramatic press conference on Tuesday, the Martin family’s lawyer Benjamin Crump detailed how the unnamed girl – a minor who was so traumatised by Martin’s death she was taken to hospital at his wake – was talking to him on his cell phone in the minutes leading up to his death, and heard the altercation with his killer.[...]

“He says: ‘Oh, he’s right behind me. He’s right behind me again,’” Crump said the girl told him. “She says: ‘Run.’ He says: ‘I’m not going to run, I’m just going to walk fast.’

She then heard Martin saying “Why are you following me” and another voice saying “What are you doing here?” She told Crump they both repeated themselves, and then she thinks she heard Zimmerman push Martin “because his voice changes, like something interrupted his speech.” She heard an altercation and then the phone call was cut off, Crump said.
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Old 03-25-2012, 11:53 AM   #1454
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Originally Posted by VAChief View Post
I answered your asinine assumptions. More than a bloody nose and some grass stains. I don't believe that rises to "fearing for your life."
You haven't answered anything. You changed the facts/assumptions to suit your position instead of anwering the question.

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Originally Posted by VAChief View Post
It is interesting that you are so willing to believe the clear aggressor in this situation. What is he supposed to say..."Well I told him to stop, he wouldn't I put my hands on him and he punched me in the face I got pissed, pulled my piece and shot him in the chest."
I don't know what's interesting to you, since my position has been that we don't know what happened. I don't believe anyone at this point.

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Originally Posted by VAChief View Post
My beef is not convicting the guy before presenting evidence, but that no apparent thought was given to maybe his story was full of crap and self serving.
Your beef seems to be with fairness and honesty, since you're just making shit up now to suit your position.
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Old 03-25-2012, 12:06 PM   #1455
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Originally Posted by Just Passin' By View Post
Assuming Zimmerman's injuries are legitimate injuries and from a confrontation with Martin, and assuming Martin attacked first, exactly how much of a beating should Zimmerman allowed himself to take before drawing his weapon?
Drawing his weapon? That sounds like a good start. It's not the drawing, its the firing.

I've already said that I believe a thorough ass kicking isn't justification for killing another human imo. 99.99% of fights don't end in someone being beat to death.
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