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Old 03-08-2012, 12:50 PM  
Bump Bump is offline
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Neighborhood watch captain shoots innocent black youth and doesn't even get arrested

http://news.yahoo.com/family-florida...044537742.html




ORLANDO, Florida (Reuters) - The family of a 17-year-old African-American boy shot to death last month in his gated Florida community by a white Neighborhood Watch captain wants to see the captain arrested, the family's lawyer said on Wednesday.

Trayvon Martin was shot dead after he took a break from watching NBA All-Star game television coverage to walk 10 minutes to a convenience store to buy snacks including Skittles candy requested by his 13-year-old brother, Chad, the family's lawyer Ben Crump said.

"He was a good kid," Crump said in an interview, adding that the family would issue a call for the Watch captain's arrest at a news conference on Thursday. "On his way home, a Neighborhood Watch loose cannon shot and killed him."

[Related: Fla. teen avoids deportation]

Trayvon, who lived in Miami with his mother, had been visiting his father and stepmother in a gated townhome community called The Retreat at Twin Lakes in Sanford, 20 miles north of Orlando.

As Trayvon returned to the townhome, Sanford police received a 911 call reporting a suspicious person.

Although names are blacked out on the police report, Crump and media reports at the time of the shooting identified the caller as George Zimmerman who is listed in the community's newsletter as the Neighborhood Watch captain.

Without waiting for police to arrive, Crump said, Zimmerman confronted Trayvon, who was on the sidewalk near his home. By the time police got there, Trayvon was dead of a single gunshot to the chest.

"What do the police find in his pocket? Skittles," Crump said. "A can of Arizona ice tea in his jacket pocket and Skittles in his front pocket for his brother Chad."

Zimmerman could not be reached for comment on Wednesday evening at a phone number listed for him on the community's newsletter.

Crump said the family was concerned that police might decide to consider the shooting as self defense, and that police have ignored the family's request for a copy of the original 911 call, which they think will shed light on the incidents.

"If the 911 protocol across the country held to form here, they told him not to get involved. He disobeyed that order," said Ryan Julison, a spokesman for the family.

"He (Zimmerman) didn't have to get out of his car," said Crump, who has prepared a public records lawsuit to file on Thursday if the family doesn't get the 911 tape. "If he never gets out of his car, there is no reason for self-defense. Trayvon only has skittles. He has the gun."

Since Trayvon, a high school junior who wanted to be a pilot, was black and Zimmerman is white, Crump said race is "the 600 pound elephant in the room."

"Why is this kid suspicious in the first place? I think a stereotype must have been placed on the kid," Crump said.

(Editing By Cynthia Johnston and Peter Bohan)

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Old 04-20-2012, 10:13 PM   #3106
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****, Pawnmower, that might be your best post.

errr, in other words, THIS.
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Old 04-21-2012, 03:01 AM   #3107
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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
Who was the moron?
Why is it always one side is fully at fault to you, when bad things happen?

I agree, as stated by others that it was both. Both misread the situation and both overreacted to it. This lead to a series of unfortunate events for both of them. The worst for Trayvon.

I wonder if Zimmerman can file for bankruptcy to avoid paying any damages in any civil suit? Lawyers please provide counsel.
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Old 04-21-2012, 04:22 AM   #3108
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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
Not guilty will make lib heads spin a 360. The more you read about Trayvon the better it looks for George.
Interesting notion. Call me naive but I think a crime should be judged on its own and not on its victim. Judging the victim is probably the american way.
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Old 04-21-2012, 09:25 AM   #3109
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Originally Posted by bandwagonjumper View Post
Interesting notion. Call me naive but I think a crime should be judged on its own and not on its victim. Judging the victim is probably the american way.
Judging the actions of both participants is important to determine what, if any, crime was committed in the first place. Prejudging the situation by assuming a crime was committed and calling one of the participants the victim is inappropriate. But since you're naive, you're forgiven.
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Old 04-21-2012, 10:05 PM   #3110
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Originally Posted by InChiefsHell View Post
I've thought about this alot since it happened. I live in a pretty quiet neighborhood. Had I seen someone I don't know at all whom I thought was suspicious, I'd call the cops. But I can see myself following the guy. I don't have a conceal carry permit, so I wouldn't have a gun on me. But say the guy I'm following, IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD, decides he doesn't like it and turns around and proceeds to kick my ass. It's my right to defend myself.

Trayvon was likely a lively young punkass who fancied calling himself a ****a or whatever on his twitter account...he's a young man looking for respect. This asshole following him needs to learn some respect. He decided to teach Zimmerman a lesson. He gets shot because he's young and dumb. End of tragic ****in' story.

Zimmerman is probably ( I don't know without seeing ALL the evidence) NOT guilty of 2nd degree murder. But, his life is over now as well. He'll have to go into protective custody just to stay alive.
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Old 04-21-2012, 11:52 PM   #3111
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I'm still unaware of the crime Zimmerman witnessed to precipitate this drastic action?

What, exactly, did he see that required immediate citizens involvement? protect your neighborhood? i couldnt be more for it, but dont overstep your bounds.. thats still my take.

George Zimmerman overstepped his authority, by a mile.
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Old 04-22-2012, 04:36 AM   #3112
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Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
Judging the actions of both participants is important to determine what, if any, crime was committed in the first place. Prejudging the situation by assuming a crime was committed and calling one of the participants the victim is inappropriate. But since you're naive, you're forgiven.
Thank you for your kindness.
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Old 04-22-2012, 08:03 AM   #3113
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Originally Posted by scott free View Post
I'm still unaware of the crime Zimmerman witnessed to precipitate this drastic action?

What, exactly, did he see that required immediate citizens involvement? protect your neighborhood? i couldnt be more for it, but dont overstep your bounds.. thats still my take.

George Zimmerman overstepped his authority, by a mile.
he's an honorary police officer, therefore he can chase civilians down for no reason and kill them. duh.

and don't get it twisted -- this is not about the fact they let him go without charges as the thread title indicates and several posters like you and I pointed out, it's about race
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Old 04-22-2012, 09:21 AM   #3114
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Originally Posted by InChiefsHell View Post
I've thought about this alot since it happened. I live in a pretty quiet neighborhood. Had I seen someone I don't know at all whom I thought was suspicious, I'd call the cops. But I can see myself following the guy. I don't have a conceal carry permit, so I wouldn't have a gun on me. But say the guy I'm following, IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD, decides he doesn't like it and turns around and proceeds to kick my ass. It's my right to defend myself.

Trayvon was likely a lively young punkass who fancied calling himself a ****a or whatever on his twitter account...he's a young man looking for respect. This asshole following him needs to learn some respect. He decided to teach Zimmerman a lesson. He gets shot because he's young and dumb. End of tragic ****in' story.

Zimmerman is probably ( I don't know without seeing ALL the evidence) NOT guilty of 2nd degree murder. But, his life is over now as well. He'll have to go into protective custody just to stay alive.
I still haven't heard an answer to this and I'm looking for someone with knowledge of the law.

Shouldn't it matter that Zimmerman was apparently briefed on patrol responsibilities? It sounded like he was pretty clearly told to be the eyes and ears of the police and nothing more, and that he should avoid confronting suspicious persons. If he was properly trained, he would have also been informed that he was not supposed to carry a gun, which is a standard for neighborhood watch programs. That's key because we know for an absolute fact that Zimmerman violated two key responsibilities: 1) he carried a gun while in pursuit of a suspicious person. Given that he was in his car and got out to pursue Trayvon Martin, that indicates that he had the ability to unarm himself before leaving the car; 2) most importantly, he got out of his car to pursue Trayvon Martin, which he was specifically informed he was not to do (I'm not talking about the 911 call. I'm talking about the officer who trained him to not pursue suspicious people and leave that in the hands of the police).

So if this is the case... Zimmerman was a moron about something he was trained to do. Martin was probably never trained on how to defend yourself from someone he thought might be a threat. I don't think that translates into murder charges, but isn't that essentially gross negligence that Zimmerman created a situation because of a complete violation of what he was trained to do?
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Old 04-22-2012, 09:48 AM   #3115
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Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 View Post
I still haven't heard an answer to this and I'm looking for someone with knowledge of the law.

Shouldn't it matter that Zimmerman was apparently briefed on patrol responsibilities? It sounded like he was pretty clearly told to be the eyes and ears of the police and nothing more, and that he should avoid confronting suspicious persons. If he was properly trained, he would have also been informed that he was not supposed to carry a gun, which is a standard for neighborhood watch programs. That's key because we know for an absolute fact that Zimmerman violated two key responsibilities: 1) he carried a gun while in pursuit of a suspicious person. Given that he was in his car and got out to pursue Trayvon Martin, that indicates that he had the ability to unarm himself before leaving the car; 2) most importantly, he got out of his car to pursue Trayvon Martin, which he was specifically informed he was not to do (I'm not talking about the 911 call. I'm talking about the officer who trained him to not pursue suspicious people and leave that in the hands of the police).

So if this is the case... Zimmerman was a moron about something he was trained to do. Martin was probably never trained on how to defend yourself from someone he thought might be a threat. I don't think that translates into murder charges, but isn't that essentially gross negligence that Zimmerman created a situation because of a complete violation of what he was trained to do?

Well, what's the question you're asking? Are you asking if he should have been charged with some sort of criminal negligence, or if he'll probably get sued in civil court?
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Old 04-22-2012, 10:15 AM   #3116
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Well, what's the question you're asking? Are you asking if he should have been charged with some sort of criminal negligence, or if he'll probably get sued in civil court?
A little bit of both.

But also whether that negligence has potential to damage Zimmerman's case to defend against murder charges. Given that he is no ordinary citizen, but rather one well versed in how to handle the situation, does that change him from a guy doing his duty to a vigilante? Which I think changes the tone of the case quite a bit. Much of the tone to date is that the guy was doing his job and was a little overzealous. Does this damage his ability to claim self defense if he was initiating behavior he was clearly told would lead to a confrontation? And if he was carrying a gun but was explicitly told not to, then what about that?
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Old 04-22-2012, 11:47 AM   #3117
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Originally Posted by scott free View Post
I'm still unaware of the crime Zimmerman witnessed to precipitate this drastic action?

What, exactly, did he see that required immediate citizens involvement? protect your neighborhood? i couldnt be more for it, but dont overstep your bounds.. thats still my take.

George Zimmerman overstepped his authority, by a mile.
What drastic action are you referring to?
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Old 04-22-2012, 11:53 AM   #3118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scott free View Post
I'm still unaware of the crime Zimmerman witnessed to precipitate this drastic action?

What, exactly, did he see that required immediate citizens involvement? protect your neighborhood? i couldnt be more for it, but dont overstep your bounds.. thats still my take.

George Zimmerman overstepped his authority, by a mile.
Wrong.....

Asking someone what they're doing in your neighborhood is not 'drastic' nor over stepping any boundaries. Punching someone is though. Attacking someone is.
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Old 04-22-2012, 12:18 PM   #3119
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Originally Posted by BigCatDaddy View Post
What drastic action are you referring to?
Getting out of his car is action enough.... Zimmerman isn't a cop and should have stayed his ass in his car.
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Old 04-22-2012, 12:36 PM   #3120
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Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
Wrong.....

Asking someone what they're doing in your neighborhood is not 'drastic' nor over stepping any boundaries. Punching someone is though. Attacking someone is.
I really have not paid much attention to this. Other than a glimpse at the usual worthless shitbags that showed up to stir the pot. One fact that cannot be denied is when a man confronts another man and has a gun, he has using it in his mind. I have no idea what happened or what was said. There was a fight and the the guy with the gun won. Had Zimmerman been confronted and ended up shooting the guy I would have much stronger feelings on the subject. As it is I will wait for the facts to come out~
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