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Old 02-09-2012, 12:30 AM  
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Drafting a nose = bad idea this year.

Nose tackle prospects in the draft:

Dontari Poe, Memphis -- raw, from small school, inconsistent motor.
Alameda Ta'amu, Washington -- looks great one moment, notsogreat the next, more of a 1 gap
Josh Chapman, Alabama -- a little undersized, coming off ACL injury
Nick Jean-Baptiste, Baylor -- poor man's Phil Taylor
Henry Fangupo, BYU -- old rookie, completely raw from a goofy system, will needs a couple years

Everybody else is from a small school, or is a nobody getting attention for their size alone and is raw as red meat.

Now, check this out:

Nose tackle prospects in free agency:

Paul Soliai, Dolphins -- massive 2-gap hole-clogger, no longer fits Dolphins defense
Sione Pouha, Jets -- experienced 2-gapper, talented but past prime, could put in a solid season
Sammy Lee Hill, Lions -- huge, could be a decent value acquisition, not sure how he'd fit in a 2-gap
Antonio Garay, Chargers -- more of a 1-gapper
Kelly Gregg, Chiefs -- just sayin'
Shaun Rogers, Saints -- good one-year rental for the position
Aubrayu Franklin, Saints -- more of a 1-gapper
Casey Hampton, Steelers -- outside chance he lands on the market
Amon Gordon, Chiefs -- knows our system, Crennel likes him
Bryant McKinnie, Ravens -- could fill the role
Howard Green, Packers -- more of a 1-gapper but he did crack Cassel's ribs in the preseason, soooo...

My conclusion is that the draft is very shallow at the nose position.

It's not much better in free agency, but at least you've got guys that can play there.
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Old 05-03-2012, 07:11 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by aturnis View Post
Not only this, but how many teams NEED a starting NT? For teams other than the Chiefs, depth doesn't usually get drafted until round 4. Bubb has been making me scratch my head a lot lately.

Same thing happened to Stanzi. Teams that NEEDED QB's took them early. Not only that, but he was passed up for guys he was ranked higher than universally b/c they were several picks. i.e. He doesn't have a hand cannon, but gets great placement on the deep ball.
Better examples are both Cody and Powe.

Those guys both went a couple of rounds later than anyone thought they would because there just isn't an incredible need for 3-4 NT.

So a guy like Chapman that's not going to be exciting for a 4-3 team or even a 1-gap 3-4 team is going to slide because the Chiefs are about the only 2-gap 3-4 team that was stupid enough to go without a NT for 2 years.

I think Pioli just completely blew the demand for the NT position and reached on Poe.

Kid had better end up a hell of a lot more than just a serviceable NT. We've had our shot at several serviceable NTs in this draft and the last couple.
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Old 05-03-2012, 07:55 PM   #77
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Moreover, John Jenkins is coming out from Georgia next year, and that guy is a legit nose tackle with size and production in the SEC, probably the best NT prospect in years. Brockers is probably the best five-tech prospect in years. We could have built a crazy d-line.
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Old 05-03-2012, 08:04 PM   #78
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Moreover, John Jenkins is coming out from Georgia next year, and that guy is a legit nose tackle with size and production in the SEC, probably the best NT prospect in years. Brockers is probably the best five-tech prospect in years. We could have built a crazy d-line.
No shit.

Play Powe, see what he has - if it isn't there, then you can draft any of these guys next year and bookend them with Jackson and Brockers:

Starlite Lotulelei, Utah
- Shared the PAC 12 lineman of the year award with Kalil this past season. Guy is an absolutely beast.

John Hankins, Ohio State

Kwame Geathers, Georgia

Wishful thinking at this point as Brockers is now a Ram. Jesus, that would have been an insane defensive line...

Which gets me to thinking, I wonder if the 2010 and 2011 drafts were so good due to Haley being here versus letting Pioli completely run the show.

It just seems that the 2009 and 2012 drafts are eerily similar in terms of questionable picks that don't really address the needs of the team.
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Old 05-03-2012, 08:59 PM   #79
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Originally Posted by Saccopoo View Post

Which gets me to thinking, I wonder if the 2010 and 2011 drafts were so good due to Haley being here versus letting Pioli completely run the show.

It just seems that the 2009 and 2012 drafts are eerily similar in terms of questionable picks that don't really address the needs of the team.
Paging BossChief... you have a call regarding Phil Emery on Line 2...
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Old 05-03-2012, 11:56 PM   #80
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Paging BossChief... you have a call regarding Phil Emery on Line 2...
Im actually pleasantly surprised that we drafted as well as we did.

I was prepared for total Armageddon after the Poe pick.
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Old 05-04-2012, 08:28 AM   #81
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Or perhaps the other teams that knew they had a need crossed us off their list of competitors and knew they could get their guy later in the draft.
Stanzi last year?
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Old 05-04-2012, 09:07 AM   #82
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Moreover, John Jenkins is coming out from Georgia next year, and that guy is a legit nose tackle with size and production in the SEC, probably the best NT prospect in years. Brockers is probably the best five-tech prospect in years. We could have built a crazy d-line.
I'm actually not sure if John Jenkins is coming out.

His teammate Geathers is, but Jenkins is clearly the superior prospect.

My guess is Jenkins comes out in 2014. But who knows, I'm not even that familiar with how close they are to graduation, I've just seen them on tape.
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Old 05-04-2012, 09:08 AM   #83
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And the idea that Brockers is the best five-tech prospect in years?

While I have no doubt that Pioli loved Brockers, that is a laughable statement.
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Old 05-04-2012, 09:12 AM   #84
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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And one other thing, Nightfyre! LOL

I'll bet all the money in my pockets that the Chiefs are looking for heavy ammunition to trade up and get a franchise QB next year. So the nose tackle prospects coming out next year, and really all the non-QB prospects in the first three rounds, are irrelevent, because that's what it's going to take (and then some).

Pioli drafts for need. As of 2013, this team will have no greater need than QB.

There will be slight needs at DE, CB, RB, and ILB. But the QB position will be the one we invest our time in.
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Old 05-04-2012, 12:25 PM   #85
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Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
And one other thing, Nightfyre! LOL

I'll bet all the money in my pockets that the Chiefs are looking for heavy ammunition to trade up and get a franchise QB next year. So the nose tackle prospects coming out next year, and really all the non-QB prospects in the first three rounds, are irrelevent, because that's what it's going to take (and then some).

Pioli drafts for need. As of 2013, this team will have no greater need than QB.

There will be slight needs at DE, CB, RB, and ILB. But the QB position will be the one we invest our time in.
I sure hope they make a move for a qb. Pioli and crennel are also pretty good at selecting and developing d lineman, so I hope they prove me wrong. I personally would have taken brockers. I can't think of a better five tech since maybe Suh? And he would be wasted as a 5 tech.
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Old 05-04-2012, 12:35 PM   #86
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As of 2013, this team will have no greater need than QB.

.
I think I read that 5 years ago.
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Old 05-04-2012, 03:41 PM   #87
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Stanzi last year?
Don't think that quite fits. There were other QBs selected before Stanzi.
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Old 05-04-2012, 07:24 PM   #88
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Not only this, but how many teams NEED a starting NT? For teams other than the Chiefs, depth doesn't usually get drafted until round 4. Bubb has been making me scratch my head a lot lately.

Same thing happened to Stanzi. Teams that NEEDED QB's took them early. Not only that, but he was passed up for guys he was ranked higher than universally b/c they were several picks. i.e. He doesn't have a hand cannon, but gets great placement on the deep ball.
I knew Indy needed a starting NT for their new 3-4 defense they're going to institute. Sure enough they got Josh Chapman conveniently in the middle rounds.

And if he's not the answer leave it to the ****ing Colts to get lucky again and waltz into the draft next year with one of the better NT prospects in a few years waiting right there for them.

Draft an outstanding prospect at the most important position on offense: Check

Draft an outstanding prospect at the most important position on defense: Check

In two years they have two of "their guys". Realistically if both Luck and their NT pan out, they don't need much of a team around them. Those two guys alone plus the skeleton of a team they have right now will get them 7, 8, or 9 wins- records that we consistently strive for and embrace.

I love being a Chiefs fan.
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Old 05-04-2012, 10:43 PM   #89
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I knew Indy needed a starting NT for their new 3-4 defense they're going to institute. Sure enough they got Josh Chapman conveniently in the middle rounds.

And if he's not the answer leave it to the ****ing Colts to get lucky again and waltz into the draft next year with one of the better NT prospects in a few years waiting right there for them.

Draft an outstanding prospect at the most important position on offense: Check

Draft an outstanding prospect at the most important position on defense: Check

In two years they have two of "their guys". Realistically if both Luck and their NT pan out, they don't need much of a team around them. Those two guys alone plus the skeleton of a team they have right now will get them 7, 8, or 9 wins- records that we consistently strive for and embrace.

I love being a Chiefs fan.
Plus they drafted a stud OT in Anthony Costanzo last year to protect Luck's blind side.

With a OT, QB and NT set, that's a nice foundation to work with. Then they pick up two stud TE's and grabbed a very nice running back in Vick Ballard in the fifth. Colts had a nice draft.

It's funny that some teams just stay competitve all the time and others suck dog nuts all the time...
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Old 05-04-2012, 10:57 PM   #90
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As mentioned Star Lotulelei (Utah) and Johnathan Jenkins (Georgia) are the two main NT's that catch my attention.

It is also a good year in the SEC for 5-Tech DE's. Bama has two 5-Tech type DE's in Dial and Square. Kapron Lewis-Moore from Notre Dame (6'4", 300) and Margus Hunt from SMU (6'7", 290) are interesting prospects there also. Hunt is also a world class discuss thrower and from Estonia.

OLB's and ILB's look good also.
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