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Old 09-18-2012, 06:48 AM  
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Raise your hand if you're surprised: Romney trashes the two-state solution in Israel.

And the melding of the Likud and the GOP is now complete.

We have ourselves now a transnational political party. Any light that existed between these two organizations is now gone.

The GOP, at least its foreign policy wing, is officially led by Benjamin Netanyahu. If it hadn't been already for years, which I suspect it has.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/...dle-east-peace

SECRET VIDEO: On Israel, Romney Trashes Two-State Solution
At a private fundraiser, the GOP candidate calls Middle East peace "almost unthinkable" and says he would "kick the ball down the field."
—By David Corn
Tue Sep. 18, 2012 3:00 AM PDT

At the private fundraiser held May 17 where Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney candidly spoke about political strategy—noting that he saw half of the American electorate as freeloaders and "victims" who do not believe in personal responsibility—he discussed various foreign policy positions, sharing views that he does not express in public, including his belief that peace in the Middle East is not possible and a Palestinian state is not feasible.

Mother Jones has obtained video of Romney at this intimate dinner and has confirmed its authenticity. The event was held at the home of controversial private equity manager Marc Leder in Boca Raton, Florida, with tickets costing $50,000 a plate. During the freewheeling conversation, a donor asked Romney how the "Palestinian problem" can be solved. Romney immediately launched into a detailed reply, asserting that the Palestinians have "no interest whatsoever in establishing peace, and that the pathway to peace is almost unthinkable to accomplish."

Romney spoke of "the Palestinians" as a united bloc of one mindset, and he said: "I look at the Palestinians not wanting to see peace anyway, for political purposes, committed to the destruction and elimination of Israel, and these thorny issues, and I say there's just no way."

Romney was indicating he did not believe in the peace process and, as president, would aim to postpone significant action: "[S]o what you do is, you say, you move things along the best way you can. You hope for some degree of stability, but you recognize that this is going to remain an unsolved problem…and we kick the ball down the field and hope that ultimately, somehow, something will happen and resolve it."

Romney did note there was another perspective on this knotty matter. He informed his donors that a former secretary of state—he would not say who—had told him there was "a prospect for a settlement between the Palestinians and the Israelis." Romney recalled that he had replied, "Really?" Then he added that he had not asked this ex-secretary of state for further explanation.

Here's Romney's full response; he starts out saying he has "two perspectives," but as he answers the question, it turns out that's not really the case:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=ukhFBJgrZxM

Quote:
I'm torn by two perspectives in this regard. One is the one which I've had for some time, which is that the Palestinians have no interest whatsoever in establishing peace, and that the pathway to peace is almost unthinkable to accomplish. Now why do I say that? Some might say, well, let's let the Palestinians have the West Bank, and have security, and set up a separate nation for the Palestinians. And then come a couple of thorny questions. And I don't have a map here to look at the geography, but the border between Israel and the West Bank is obviously right there, right next to Tel Aviv, which is the financial capital, the industrial capital of Israel, the center of Israel. It's—what the border would be? Maybe seven miles from Tel Aviv to what would be the West Bank…The other side of the West Bank, the other side of what would be this new Palestinian state would either be Syria at one point, or Jordan. And of course the Iranians would want to do through the West Bank exactly what they did through Lebanon, what they did near Gaza. Which is that the Iranians would want to bring missiles and armament into the West Bank and potentially threaten Israel. So Israel of course would have to say, "That can't happen. We've got to keep the Iranians from bringing weaponry into the West Bank." Well, that means that—who? The Israelis are going to patrol the border between Jordan, Syria, and this new Palestinian nation? Well, the Palestinians would say, "Uh, no way! We're an independent country. You can't, you know, guard our border with other Arab nations." And now how about the airport? How about flying into this Palestinian nation? Are we gonna allow military aircraft to come in and weaponry to come in? And if not, who's going to keep it from coming in? Well, the Israelis. Well, the Palestinians are gonna say, "We're not an independent nation if Israel is able to come in and tell us what can land in our airport." These are problems—these are very hard to solve, all right? And I look at the Palestinians not wanting to see peace anyway, for political purposes, committed to the destruction and elimination of Israel, and these thorny issues, and I say, "There's just no way." And so what you do is you say, "You move things along the best way you can." You hope for some degree of stability, but you recognize that this is going to remain an unsolved problem. We live with that in China and Taiwan. All right, we have a potentially volatile situation but we sort of live with it, and we kick the ball down the field and hope that ultimately, somehow, something will happen and resolve it. We don't go to war to try and resolve it imminently. On the other hand, I got a call from a former secretary of state. I won't mention which one it was, but this individual said to me, you know, I think there's a prospect for a settlement between the Palestinians and the Israelis after the Palestinian elections. I said, "Really?" And, you know, his answer was, "Yes, I think there's some prospect." And I didn't delve into it.
After saying all that, Romney emphasized that he was against applying any pressure on Israel: "The idea of pushing on the Israelis to give something up to get the Palestinians to act is the worst idea in the world."

On his campaign website, Romney, whose foreign policy advisers include several neocons known for their hawkish support for Israel, does not explicitly endorse the peace process or a two-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. But the Republican Party platform does state unequivocal backing for this outcome: "We envision two democratic states—Israel with Jerusalem as its capital and Palestine—living in peace and security." The platform adds, "The US seeks a comprehensive and lasting peace in the Middle East, negotiated between the parties themselves with the assistance of the US."

In public, Romney has not declared the peace process pointless or dismissed the two-state solution. In July, when the Israeli newspaper Haaretz asked Romney if he supports a two-state solution and the creation of a Palestinian state, he replied, "I believe in a two-state solution which suggests there will be two states, including a Jewish state." Yet Romney’s remarks to these funders—this was one of his longest answers at the fundraiser—suggest he might be hiding his true beliefs regarding Israel and the peace process and that on this subject he is out of sync with the predominant view in foreign policy circles that has existed for decades.

Throughout the hourlong fundraiser, Romney discussed other foreign policy matters with his patrons, especially Iran. He repeated the tough talk he has issued on the campaign trail, but he also provided an odd reason for drawing a red line with Tehran about its nuclear program:

Quote:
If I were Iran, if I were Iran—a crazed fanatic, I'd say let's get a little fissile material to Hezbollah, have them carry it to Chicago or some other place, and then if anything goes wrong, or America starts acting up, we'll just say, "Guess what? Unless you stand down, why, we're going to let off a dirty bomb." I mean this is where we have—where America could be held up and blackmailed by Iran, by the mullahs, by crazy people. So we really don't have any option but to keep Iran from having a nuclear weapon.
Romney didn't appear to understand that a dirty bomb—an explosive device that spreads radioactive substances—does not require fissile material from a nuclear weapons program. Such a bomb can be produced with, say, radioactive medical waste. If Iran's nuclear program poses a threat, it is not because this project will yield a dirty bomb.

Talking to these funders, Romney also demonstrated that his campaign-long efforts to criticize Obama's handling of foreign policy in simplistic and exaggerated terms—he's an appeaser, he's an apologist—are not reserved for public consumption. Romney told these well-to-do backers that the president is a naïf with an oversized ego:

Quote:
The president's foreign policy, in my opinion, is formed in part by a perception he has that his magnetism, and his charm, and his persuasiveness is so compelling that he can sit down with people like Putin and Chávez and Ahmadinejad, and that they'll find that we're such wonderful people that they'll go on with us, and they'll stop doing bad things. And it's an extraordinarily naive perception.
Romney did share a disappointment with his patrons, noting it was "frustrating" to him that on a "typical day" when he does several fundraising events, "the number of foreign policy questions I get are between zero and one." He complained that "the American people are not concentrated at all on China, on Russia, Iran, Iraq." But at this fundraiser, Romney received several queries related to national security—and was afforded the opportunity to tell his financial backers what he does not (and will not) tell the public.
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Old 09-18-2012, 07:59 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
A two-state solution will reduce violence.
Duh. The question was whether or not a two-state solution can be achieved, not what the results of such an achievement would be. If you're saying that the two states should come first and hope that the peace follows, you're black for ridiculous.
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Old 09-18-2012, 08:24 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
Of course. Criticizing the GOP/Likud alliance means I hate Jews. Got it.
Well, THAT is the NeoCon way.
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Old 09-18-2012, 08:27 AM   #18
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Not the least of which, btw, is the lack of interest in a two state solution on the part of the palestinians.
The whole two-state solution is not wanted by the extremists on both sides. THAT is the problem.
Likud wants a Greater Israel—period. Ariel Sharon ( Likud) instigated the second Intifada in order to justify taking more land by inciting violence.

Don't generalize.
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Old 09-18-2012, 08:28 AM   #19
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I don't know whether you do or not.
Of course you don't. Why should you? I support the two-state solution, a known position for j00 haters going on 4 years in GOP Land. I can understand the confusion you must be experiencing.

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But accusing Romney of being led by Netanyahu or accusing the GOP of having merged with Likud is the kind of red meat a person would feed to his would-be-allies in the anti-Semite world.
I don't give two shits where it plays, I care if it's true, brother.

And it is. There is no light between the GOP and the Likud, a fact that's been apparent for years now.
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Old 09-18-2012, 08:30 AM   #20
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There you go again. Shameful.
He admitted to blowing off a secretary of state, despite being on the weakest FP ticket in modern history, in order to default to Netanyahu's platform.

The GOP and Likud have merged. Romney is a puppet of Netanyahu.
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Old 09-18-2012, 08:35 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
Of course you don't. Why should you? I support the two-state solution, a known position for j00 haters going on 4 years in GOP Land. I can understand the confusion you must be experiencing.



I don't give two shits where it plays, I care if it's true, brother.

And it is. There is no light between the GOP and the Likud, a fact that's been apparent for years now.
It's not true, it's a smear designed to play for anti-semites.
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Old 09-18-2012, 08:42 AM   #22
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His position is that he's in favor of Israel and the palestinians continuing to talk as long as both parties are interested in talking. He's made it clear that he would break from Obama's shift toward the palestinians and that he would oppose the larger global effort to delegitimize Israel and to force unilateral concessions from her.
Talk about what? He doesn't think Israel should compromise.

This is as radical a position as the GOP candidate has taken in a general election that normally demands moderation. It's a brush aside of the past half-century-plus of diplomacy. It's a sign that Israel does not have to even come close to establishing good faith in negotiations, they can just do as they please with no remote concern of anything but total American approval.

This is extremely radical, but it's where the GOP is today. It's where the Likud are as well.
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Old 09-18-2012, 08:43 AM   #23
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It's not true, it's a smear designed to play for anti-semites.
What's not true?

The fact that there is no light between the GOP and the Likud anymore?

They have merged in all but name. They are a transnational political party dedicated to defying the two-state solution.
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Old 09-18-2012, 08:54 AM   #24
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Doesn't seem to me like Obama believes in a two state solution either, if you know what I mean.
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Old 09-18-2012, 09:03 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
Talk about what? He doesn't think Israel should compromise.

This is as radical a position as the GOP candidate has taken in a general election that normally demands moderation. It's a brush aside of the past half-century-plus of diplomacy. It's a sign that Israel does not have to even come close to establishing good faith in negotiations, they can just do as they please with no remote concern of anything but total American approval.

This is extremely radical, but it's where the GOP is today. It's where the Likud are as well.
He doesn't have anything against Israel compromising if Israel comes to the conclusion that compromise is warranted. He's against outside pressure on Israel to compromise against her will. You're confused.
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Old 09-18-2012, 09:05 AM   #26
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What's not true?
That the GOP and Likud have merged and that Romney is a puppet of Netanyahu. Anti-semite baiting is no better than race baiting.
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Old 09-18-2012, 09:12 AM   #27
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It's laughable to accuse Romney of lacking patience. There's nothing in this article that even suggests such a thing.
Frankly it's astonishing there are still people on the planet that do not know of Romney's patience problem. We saw it less than a week ago when he made statements without all the facts. We've seen it numerous times on the campaign trail not thinking first....corporations are people too? The patience problem has surfaced several times in Fox News interviews, was demonstrated in the manner in which he ran Bain, at the Olympics in London and often in the primary debates. One dramatic example is the people of foreign policy he has as advisors in the campaign. One of them failed to get a senate confirmation for a foreign policy appointment, and in large part it was because of his demeanor and lack of patience. That is very rare in American history.

Impatience, misinformed decision making, perpetration of lies, hypocrisy, and the outright begging of the party establishment to give him the nomination personify the wimp that Mitt Romney is. There is no honor, patience and vision to lead the greatest nation on earth.

If you only bury your head in an article you miss what millions of Americans have been seeing for months, even years.
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Old 09-18-2012, 10:00 AM   #28
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Frankly it's astonishing there are still people on the planet that do not know of Romney's patience problem. We saw it less than a week ago when he made statements without all the facts. We've seen it numerous times on the campaign trail not thinking first....corporations are people too? The patience problem has surfaced several times in Fox News interviews, was demonstrated in the manner in which he ran Bain, at the Olympics in London and often in the primary debates. One dramatic example is the people of foreign policy he has as advisors in the campaign. One of them failed to get a senate confirmation for a foreign policy appointment, and in large part it was because of his demeanor and lack of patience. That is very rare in American history.

Impatience, misinformed decision making, perpetration of lies, hypocrisy, and the outright begging of the party establishment to give him the nomination personify the wimp that Mitt Romney is. There is no honor, patience and vision to lead the greatest nation on earth.

If you only bury your head in an article you miss what millions of Americans have been seeing for months, even years.
If you mean he isn't paralyzed when under pressure to perform, I agree. He's a leader, not a guy who is going to delegate that leadership task to Congress and then head out to the links.
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Old 09-18-2012, 10:20 AM   #29
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He doesn't have anything against Israel compromising if Israel comes to the conclusion that compromise is warranted. He's against outside pressure on Israel to compromise against her will. You're confused.
I'm confused? Wherever you're getting those statements from, my guess is you're getting them from when Romney is in front of voters, in front of cameras, mic'd up and ready to sell.

Behind closed doors, he's saying exactly what AIPAC is paying him to: "the Palestinians" don't want peace, Israel shouldn't have to compromise, the two-state solution is folly, the '67 borders are BS. On and on.

The Republican Party nor the Likud want a two-state solution. They want Israel for Israelis, period. And they've married one another to accomplish it.
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Old 09-18-2012, 10:21 AM   #30
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That the GOP and Likud have merged and that Romney is a puppet of Netanyahu. Anti-semite baiting is no better than race baiting.
There is no light between the GOP and the Likud, anymore. They have merged in all but name. They are a transnational political party dedicated to defying the two-state solution.

Romney/Ryan entered this ticket with absolutely no serious FP credentials, so their FP is now dictated in Tel Aviv.
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This is a test for a client's site.
A new website that shows member-created construction site listings that need fill or have excess fill. Dirt Monkey @ https://DirtMonkey.net
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