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Old 11-07-2012, 09:33 AM  
Saul Good Saul Good is offline
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Democrats: Help me find common ground.

The people have spoken. Obama gets four more years. Congress remains split. It's compromise or gridlock, but is compromise possible? Everyone talks about bipartisanship, but they usually mean unconditional surrender by the other side.

It's pretty well known around here that I am a conservative. Liberals out there, let's pretend we're in congress. Pick an issue that you would like to address, and let's see if we can really agree to meet somewhere in the middle.

Tax rates, abortion, drug legalization...whatcha got?
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:29 PM   #91
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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For conservatives this election was about the economy, and about removing O from office. We failed. It is what it is...
Which is exactly why the Right lost.

There is far more to life these days than just the economy. Social issues prevail, especially in the population centers, which Obama happened to win.
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:30 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by htismaqe View Post
I don't know if the local paper keeps digital archives nor do I really have the time or ambition to go microfiche diving but it has been a steady stream of lawsuits since the day they opened their doors.
Which local paper? Which company? I've tried searching on Google and can't find anything.
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:30 PM   #93
Iowanian Iowanian is offline
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Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
I know absolutely nothing about coal mining, so bear with me:

1. Why does it have to be mined?
2. Can't they drill out for coal or dig for it?
3. How does Clean Coal work?
4. Is Clean Coal a sustainable resource or limited?
5. Why aren't we investing in more nuclear power plants?

1. It has to be mined because it's a sub-surface solid deposit.
2.Coal runs in "veins" not vertical wells, so there are 2 main ways to get it....strip mining which is heavily frowned upon by environmentalists. It destroys a lot of area and is very expensive to "fix" when they're done. The 2nd way is mining, and I think you're being a little obtuse on purpose.

3. Clean coal has more to do with the technologies to combust it and turn it into usable power. The emissions are significantly less than traditional coal burning facilities.

4. clean coal isn't a thing that is mined. There are significant untapped coal resources in the continental United States, technology has evolved the cleans the way it is burned and significantly reduces carbon emissions, but even that isn't good enough for environmentalists.

5. Nuclear is the most efficient, but it is fought at every turn due to concerns about accidents, misinformation about the process and environmental whackos.


I work in some of the green energy areas. There is a lot of good, but the expense and efficiency of wind and solar in particular leave a lot to be desired at this time.
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:35 PM   #94
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Originally Posted by Iowanian View Post
1. It has to be mined because it's a sub-surface solid deposit.
2.Coal runs in "veins" not vertical wells, so there are 2 main ways to get it....strip mining which is heavily frowned upon by environmentalists. It destroys a lot of area and is very expensive to "fix" when they're done. The 2nd way is mining, and I think you're being a little obtuse on purpose.

3. Clean coal has more to do with the technologies to combust it and turn it into usable power. The emissions are significantly less than traditional coal burning facilities.

4. clean coal isn't a thing that is mined. There are significant untapped coal resources in the continental United States, technology has evolved the cleans the way it is burned and significantly reduces carbon emissions, but even that isn't good enough for environmentalists.

5. Nuclear is the most efficient, but it is fought at every turn due to concerns about accidents, misinformation about the process and environmental whackos.


I work in some of the green energy areas. There is a lot of good, but the expense and efficiency of wind and solar in particular leave a lot to be desired at this time.
Thanks, Dude. With utmost sincerity, I had absolutely no idea how coal was mined and why. It makes sense that there are "veins" of coal but does it cause too much environmental damage to just dig up the entire area instead of mining it?

I've seen a few news broadcasts in my life about coal mining accidents and I have no idea how guys can mine coal. I'd be so freaking claustrophobic I probably wouldn't be able walk more than five feet in.
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:35 PM   #95
Saul Good Saul Good is offline
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I would do away with marriage altogether. Civil unions for consenting adults. Charges can symbolically recognize whatever marriages they want.

Abortion wasn't part of the major Republican narrative. I will concede rape, incest, and life/serious health of the mother. That's as far as I will go.
Lefties? What do you say? Do we have a deal?
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:35 PM   #96
KILLER_CLOWN KILLER_CLOWN is offline
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While I dont agree with Amnesty, i do agree that this needs to be addressed. What baffles me is how the Republicans completely ignored it and overwhelmingly lost the latino vote.

Latinos don't care about Obama. They don't care that he's black (like black people do), they're going to vote for the guy who actually takes the time to acknowledge them and put forth the effort to fix this problem.

If Romney would've came out and said Immigration reform was a priority, and gave an outline on how he could make a pathway to citizenship for these people, he would've won the Latino vote.

Instead, he ignored them. Naturally, they vote Obama for the small pin hole sized light of hope that he gives them, opposed to Romney who did nothing.
The Latinas that work for me don't care, they have it engrained to always vote democrat. I've argued with them until I was blue in the face and they won't change. It would take some pretty monumental concessions to get them to switch their vote.
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:38 PM   #97
Iowanian Iowanian is offline
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I am taking off to go hunting, but I'd be happy to talk about energy, mining and other related topics in depth in another thread later. there are also some other informed individuals on these topics who are members here. You could get at least 3 perspectives on wind energy and I'm sure that many on coal mining in general.

There are several key reasons for mining accidents, some structural or geology related reasons, some caused by human error....explosions to to improper venting of combustible or noxious gases that collect in mines.

When I have more time, I'll try to explain some of it better.
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:38 PM   #98
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Abortion wasn't part of the major Republican narrative. I will concede rape, incest, and life/serious health of the mother. That's as far as I will go.
It was in the 2012 Republican National Platform pdf which can be found online.

There were talks of a Constitutional Admendment outlawing abortion of any kind AND in vitro fertilization.

As someone who is close with several couples who have children via in vitro, I find it appalling that the Republican party wanted to have federal law against it.
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:41 PM   #99
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Originally Posted by Iowanian View Post
I am taking off to go hunting, but I'd be happy to talk about energy, mining and other related topics in depth in another thread later. there are also some other informed individuals on these topics who are members here. You could get at least 3 perspectives on wind energy and I'm sure that many on coal mining in general.

There are several key reasons for mining accidents, some structural or geology related reasons, some caused by human error....explosions to to improper venting of combustible or noxious gases that collect in mines.

When I have more time, I'll try to explain some of it better.
Thanks, Man! I have a close friend from junior high and high school that I keep in touch with that's currently in his last semester of university for a degree in Green Engineering. He's a huge proponent. He was an engineer on a nuclear submarine a decade or so and has always been a proponent of that as well.

I plan to see him during the Christmas holiday and I'm anxious to pick his brain. I find Green Energy to be a very interesting topic.
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:42 PM   #100
KILLER_CLOWN KILLER_CLOWN is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iowanian View Post
I am taking off to go hunting, but I'd be happy to talk about energy, mining and other related topics in depth in another thread later. there are also some other informed individuals on these topics who are members here. You could get at least 3 perspectives on wind energy and I'm sure that many on coal mining in general.

There are several key reasons for mining accidents, some structural or geology related reasons, some caused by human error....explosions to to improper venting of combustible or noxious gases that collect in mines.

When I have more time, I'll try to explain some of it better.
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:45 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
Thanks, Dude. With utmost sincerity, I had absolutely no idea how coal was mined and why. It makes sense that there are "veins" of coal but does it cause too much environmental damage to just dig up the entire area instead of mining it?
Thatís strip mining. Yes, it creates a big ole mess, monstrous pit in the ground. Google strip mines, thereís pictures all over the net. Strip mining is the cheap way to go after it but the expensive way to clean it back up afterwards.

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I've seen a few news broadcasts in my life about coal mining accidents and I have no idea how guys can mine coal. I'd be so freaking claustrophobic I probably wouldn't be able walk more than five feet in.
Same here. Fantastic Caverns is about as close as I can come to cave crawling.
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:48 PM   #102
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IMO:

The main problem with wind energy is that people tend not to live in extremely windy places.

The main problem with solar energy is that it's very inefficient and expensive to set up.

The main problem with nuclear energy is that it sounds scary.
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:48 PM   #103
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Thatís strip mining. Yes, it creates a big ole mess, monstrous pit in the ground. Google strip mines, thereís pictures all over the net. Strip mining is the cheap way to go after it but the expensive way to clean it back up afterwards.



Same here. Fantastic Caverns is about as close as I can come to cave crawling.
Thanks, Dude!
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:50 PM   #104
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Exactly.

The Republican will never win another national election where the party line includes no abortion for victims of rape, incest or the mother's life or the outlawing of In Vitro Fertilization.
Why do you keep bringing up in vitro fertilization as if banning it is some kind of mainstream GOP/conservative position? I understand that it's opposed by the Catholic Church, but from what I can tell it's more like contraception than abortion in the sense that it's effectively a dead letter with the rank and file. I certainly don't remember any big pushes by the GOP to ban it in the last decade or two (in contrast to the abortion issue).
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Old 11-07-2012, 12:52 PM   #105
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Green energy its fine as long as you don't mind paying more for your electricity and want to be even more uncompetitive in the global economy than we already are.
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