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Old 03-08-2012, 11:50 AM  
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Neighborhood watch captain shoots innocent black youth and doesn't even get arrested

http://news.yahoo.com/family-florida...044537742.html




ORLANDO, Florida (Reuters) - The family of a 17-year-old African-American boy shot to death last month in his gated Florida community by a white Neighborhood Watch captain wants to see the captain arrested, the family's lawyer said on Wednesday.

Trayvon Martin was shot dead after he took a break from watching NBA All-Star game television coverage to walk 10 minutes to a convenience store to buy snacks including Skittles candy requested by his 13-year-old brother, Chad, the family's lawyer Ben Crump said.

"He was a good kid," Crump said in an interview, adding that the family would issue a call for the Watch captain's arrest at a news conference on Thursday. "On his way home, a Neighborhood Watch loose cannon shot and killed him."

[Related: Fla. teen avoids deportation]

Trayvon, who lived in Miami with his mother, had been visiting his father and stepmother in a gated townhome community called The Retreat at Twin Lakes in Sanford, 20 miles north of Orlando.

As Trayvon returned to the townhome, Sanford police received a 911 call reporting a suspicious person.

Although names are blacked out on the police report, Crump and media reports at the time of the shooting identified the caller as George Zimmerman who is listed in the community's newsletter as the Neighborhood Watch captain.

Without waiting for police to arrive, Crump said, Zimmerman confronted Trayvon, who was on the sidewalk near his home. By the time police got there, Trayvon was dead of a single gunshot to the chest.

"What do the police find in his pocket? Skittles," Crump said. "A can of Arizona ice tea in his jacket pocket and Skittles in his front pocket for his brother Chad."

Zimmerman could not be reached for comment on Wednesday evening at a phone number listed for him on the community's newsletter.

Crump said the family was concerned that police might decide to consider the shooting as self defense, and that police have ignored the family's request for a copy of the original 911 call, which they think will shed light on the incidents.

"If the 911 protocol across the country held to form here, they told him not to get involved. He disobeyed that order," said Ryan Julison, a spokesman for the family.

"He (Zimmerman) didn't have to get out of his car," said Crump, who has prepared a public records lawsuit to file on Thursday if the family doesn't get the 911 tape. "If he never gets out of his car, there is no reason for self-defense. Trayvon only has skittles. He has the gun."

Since Trayvon, a high school junior who wanted to be a pilot, was black and Zimmerman is white, Crump said race is "the 600 pound elephant in the room."

"Why is this kid suspicious in the first place? I think a stereotype must have been placed on the kid," Crump said.

(Editing By Cynthia Johnston and Peter Bohan)

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Old 12-10-2012, 03:38 AM   #3721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
No, it isn't.

You are saying that the act of pursuit is what caused this incident.

I am saying that the line is not crossed yet at simply pursuit.

There is a huge difference between pursuit and asking a question and the HUGE RED LINE of physical combat, which can easily spiral out of control.

What I am saying is the CAUSE is not the pursuit by Zimmerman, but whoever crossed that huge red line, into the zone of physical combat.


You keep saying the opposite.
Do I? (This is all within the last page, mind you.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefspants
There's a difference, we have solid evidence of what was said to Zimmerman before the confrontation. What we do not have, is evidence of how Zimmerman approached Trayvon and how that conflict escalated.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefspants
This means that we do not know if Zimmerman's confrontation of Trayvon was legal or illegal
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefspants
How did I imply Zimmerman's guilt with any of this? We know he killed someone, that's a fact, what we don't know is whether or not what he did will convict him of murder.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefspants
Excuse me, but that isn't evidence of the actual conversation between the two men. We have no idea if Zimmerman threatened Trayvon (or said THE POLICE are coming) to cause the situation to explode.

We simply don't know what happened here, and we likely won't know any further details until this case hits trial.

Until then, we're simply going to have to wait and see.
What you are misunderstanding, Pawn, is that I said it was moronic for Zimmerman to pursue Trayvon, and in doing so he invited himself to this horrendous situation. However, what I have continuous asserted that the determination of his innocence or guilt will be what sparked the initial escalation of this confrontation.

Okay, I'm done.

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Old 12-10-2012, 03:54 AM   #3722
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefspants View Post
Do I? (This is all within the last page, mind you.)
You are seriously making me do this. **** you for wasting my time.

Jesus H Christ.

You claimed the 'cause' was the pursuit by Zimmerman, many times...

Why the **** are you now backpeddling?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefspants View Post
He was told that he didn't need to pursue Martin, Mr. Dwight Schrute did anyways, and a person died because of it.

If he simply listened to reason none of this would have occurred.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefspants View Post
No, it isn't horrible logic, when a 911 responder says "YOU DO NOT HAVE TO PURSUE THE SUSPECT." It's safe to assume that the police, who are hired to handle these responsibilities, "might" have it covered.
Zimmerman has deserved absolutely all of the criticism he's received since the night of the shooting.
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Originally Posted by Chiefspants View Post
However, I would NOT keep pursuing the person in question to potentially endanger a potentially innocent suspect or myself in the situation. That's nothing short of common sense, I'd say.
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Originally Posted by Chiefspants View Post
AFTER he was told he didn't have to pursue that person in question and you're the one questioning MY intelligence?
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Originally Posted by Chiefspants View Post
And Zimmerman did, and if he didn't anticipate the potential consequences of that decision [to pursue], that's on him. At the end of the day, this entire situation could have been avoided.


SO are you telling me now that the PURSUIT of Zimmerman is not the cause of the incident? If so I agree.

NOWHERE UNTIL AFTER I QUESTIONED YOU on this stupid line of thought do you in any way , shape, or form acknowledge it could be trayvon's fault, if he was the one who was violent first.....You stupid ****tard.
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:00 AM   #3723
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
You are seriously making me do this. **** you for wasting my time.

Jesus H Christ.

You claimed the 'cause' was the pursuit by Zimmerman, many times...

Why the **** are you now backpeddling?

SO are you telling me now that the PURSUIT of Zimmerman is not the cause of the incident? If so I agree.

NOWHERE UNTIL AFTER I QUESTIONED YOU on this stupid line of thought do you in any way , shape, or form acknowledge it could be trayvon's fault, if he was the one who was violent first.....You stupid ****tard.
.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefspants
What you are misunderstanding, Pawn, is that I said it was moronic for Zimmerman to pursue Trayvon, and in doing so he invited himself to this horrendous situation. However, what I have continuous asserted that the determination of his innocence or guilt will be what sparked the initial escalation of this confrontation.

Okay, I'm done.
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:00 AM   #3724
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefspants View Post
What you are misunderstanding, Pawn, is that I said it was moronic for Zimmerman to pursue Trayvon, and in doing so he invited himself to this horrendous situation.
Your priorities are (once again) messed up. (even though clearly you were saying it was the CAUSE of the incident, and not merely it was dumb...you are just changing your story now...)

But..

Tell me, was it moronic for Trayvon Martin to assault Zimmerman that night?

Which was more moronic....?

1) Zimmerman pursuing MArtin and asking what was going on....

2) Martin beating Zimmerman
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:02 AM   #3725
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Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
Your priorities are (once again) messed up.

Tell me, was it moronic for Trayvon Martin to assault Zimmerman that night?

Which was more moronic....?

1) Zimmerman pursuing MArtin and asking what was going on....

2) Martin beating Zimmerman
.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefspants
What we do not have is evidence of how Zimmerman approached Trayvon and how that conflict escalated.
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:03 AM   #3726
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You weasel out of answering any questions.....

bravo



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Old 12-10-2012, 04:05 AM   #3727
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Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
You weasel out of answering any questions.....

bravo



Coward
I've already answered these questions, (as evidenced by these quotes) you're mere choosing to further your argument out of some kind of forced ignorance to my reasoning.
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:06 AM   #3728
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By the way, unless Martin was a zombie and beat up Zimmerman AFTER he was shot dead, I think it is pretty safe to assume the order of things was

1) Martin was whooping zimmerman's ass

2) Zimmerman shot martin


Unless you think zimmerman pulled his gun 1st and THEN martin kicked his ass a while..

LOL
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:06 AM   #3729
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Originally Posted by Chiefspants View Post
I've already answered these questions, (as evidenced by these quotes) you're mere choosing to further your argument out of some kind of forced ignorance to my reasoning.
You did not say which was more moronic, that is a lie. You did not answer my question.
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:07 AM   #3730
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Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
By the way, unless Martin was a zombie and beat up Zimmerman AFTER he was shot dead, I think it is pretty safe to assume the order of things was

1) Martin was whooping zimmerman's ass

2) Zimmerman shot martin


Unless you think zimmerman pulled his gun 1st and THEN martin kicked his ass a while..

LOL
Did Zimmerman threaten Trayvon in any way or make a threatening action towards him?

Lemme stop you before answering, because you have no idea, and I don't either, and that's what this trial is going to prove.
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:08 AM   #3731
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Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
You did not say which was more moronic, that is a lie. You did not answer my question.
I do not know because both you and I are unaware of the circumstances surrounding the escalation.

Dude, whatever, we're recycling this argument over and over, I'm done for realz now.
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:10 AM   #3732
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:11 AM   #3733
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Originally Posted by Chiefspants View Post
Did Zimmerman threaten Trayvon in any way or make a threatening action towards him?

Lemme stop you before answering, because you have no idea, and I don't either, and that's what this trial is going to prove.
Thats my point you god damn slippery weasel...

YOU are the one saying it was "moronic" to pursue Martin and that that pursuit led to MArtin's death...thats what YOU are ****ign saying you clueless imbecile.

You have no ****ing idea what you are even saying or talking about, because that pursuit is perfectly legal and reasonable.

It is the stuff we don't fully know (because we DO know MArtin Beat Zimmerman) that may implicate or acquit Zimmerman. (The actual blow by blow of the combat)

Thats what I have been trying to pound into your dumb ass head this whole ****ing time.

YOU have no idea.

The pursuit is not the problem here..
..it is what happened in the conflict. You are changing the goalposts and trying to wriggle out of your failed argument. I already ****ign quoted you, you can't possibly be THIS ****ign stupid.
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:12 AM   #3734
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Bottom line... Don't put your hands on people and you will live.
This.Right.Here.

I mean is it really that hard to ****ing understand....?
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:13 AM   #3735
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Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
Thats my point you god damn slippery weasel...

YOU are the one saying it was "moronic" to pursue Martin and that that pursuit led to MArtin's death...thats what YOU are ****ign saying you clueless imbecile.

You have no ****ing idea what you are even saying or talking about, because that pursuit is perfectly legal and reasonable.

It is the stuff we don't fully know (because we DO know MArtin Beat Zimmerman) that may implicate or acquit Zimmerman. (The actual blow by blow of the combat)

Thats what I have been trying to pound into your dumb ass head this whole ****ing time.

YOU have no idea.

The pursuit is not the problem here....it is what happened in the conflict. You are changing the goalposts and trying to wriggle out of your failed argument. I already ****ign quoted you, you can't possibly be THIS ****ign stupid.
He was told he didn't have to pursue him, he did. -That's moronic, and opened him to this whole situation in the first place (ahem, my orignal argument, ahem.) but it doesn't make him guilty. (as I have been saying this entire time)

How have I wavered at all within this argument?
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