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Old 12-16-2012, 10:35 PM  
Direckshun Direckshun is online now
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Let's research gun violence.

I've said this in a couple other threads, but I don't believe that gun control is going to get any traction in Congress. Some Democrats will push for it, some other Republicans will table it, some pro-gun control folks like myself will cry foul, and yet another Congress will pass without any gun control measures seeing the light of day.

But here's one thing that maybe we can start doing: better educate ourselves on gun violence, so we can stop stabbing in the dark as to what we can better do to mitigate it.

The problem is that for a couple decades now, the government has not been able to produce any information on gun violence because the NRA has been threatening war if Congress failed to choke off all funding for gun-related research.

The CDC and NIH used to conduct research for decades, but around the time of the late 90s, the NRA became so powerful it was able to prevent these agencies from granting funds to researchers on those topics. McClatchy DC:

Quote:
The CDC and NIH award billions in grants. They fund research into cancer, brain injury, tobacco use, obesity, AIDS, abortion, hearing loss, allergies, infectious diseases, back pain and virtually everything else related to human health. But gun violence is the one area that carries that specific language. The effect has been to limit federal funding into research that could be used to shape policy.
This is irresponsible. We pass hundreds of gun-related laws across the country every few years. Like all laws, we should be able to research the impact of the laws we pass, so we can make decisions based on more than pure ideology.

Anyway, there's a ton of stories on this, but here's a really good one from last year in the Times.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/26/us...anted=all&_r=0

N.R.A. Stymies Firearms Research, Scientists Say
By MICHAEL LUO
Published: January 25, 2011

In the wake of the shootings in Tucson, the familiar questions inevitably resurfaced: Are communities where more people carry guns safer or less safe? Does the availability of high-capacity magazines increase deaths? Do more rigorous background checks make a difference?

The reality is that even these and other basic questions cannot be fully answered, because not enough research has been done. And there is a reason for that. Scientists in the field and former officials with the government agency that used to finance the great bulk of this research say the influence of the National Rife Association has all but choked off money for such work.

“We’ve been stopped from answering the basic questions,” said Mark Rosenberg, former director of the National Center for Injury Control and Prevention, part of the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which was for about a decade the leading source of financing for firearms research.

Chris Cox, the N.R.A.’s chief lobbyist, said his group had not tried to squelch genuine scientific inquiries, just politically slanted ones.

“Our concern is not with legitimate medical science,” Mr. Cox said. “Our concern is they were promoting the idea that gun ownership was a disease that needed to be eradicated.”

The amount of money available today for studying the impact of firearms is a fraction of what it was in the mid-1990s, and the number of scientists toiling in the field has dwindled to just a handful as a result, researchers say.

The dearth of money can be traced in large measure to a clash between public health scientists and the N.R.A. in the mid-1990s. At the time, Dr. Rosenberg and others at the C.D.C. were becoming increasingly assertive about the importance of studying gun-related injuries and deaths as a public health phenomenon, financing studies that found, for example, having a gun in the house, rather than conferring protection, significantly increased the risk of homicide by a family member or intimate acquaintance.

Alarmed, the N.R.A. and its allies on Capitol Hill fought back. The injury center was guilty of “putting out papers that were really political opinion masquerading as medical science,” said Mr. Cox, who also worked on this issue for the N.R.A. more than a decade ago.

Initially, pro-gun lawmakers sought to eliminate the injury center completely, arguing that its work was “redundant” and reflected a political agenda. When that failed, they turned to the appropriations process. In 1996, Representative Jay Dickey, Republican of Arkansas, succeeded in pushing through an amendment that stripped $2.6 million from the disease control centers’ budget, the very amount it had spent on firearms-related research the year before.

“It’s really simple with me,” Mr. Dickey, 71 and now retired, said in a telephone interview. “We have the right to bear arms because of the threat of government taking over the freedoms that we have.”

The Senate later restored the money but designated it for research on traumatic brain injury. Language was also inserted into the centers’ appropriations bill that remains in place today: “None of the funds made available for injury prevention and control at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention may be used to advocate or promote gun control.”

The prohibition is striking, firearms researchers say, because there are already regulations that bar the use of C.D.C. money for lobbying for or against legislation. No other field of inquiry is singled out in this way.

In the end, researchers said, even though it is murky what exactly is allowed under this provision and what is not, the upshot is clear inside the centers: the agency should tread in this area only at its own peril.

“They had a near-death experience,” said Dr. Arthur Kellermann, whose study on the risks versus the benefits of having guns in the home became a focal point of attack by the N.R.A.

In the years since, the C.D.C. has been exceedingly wary of financing research focused on firearms. In its annual requests for proposals, for example, firearms research has been notably absent. Gail Hayes, spokeswoman for the centers, confirmed that since 1996, while the agency has issued requests for proposals that include the study of violence, which may include gun violence, it had not sent out any specifically on firearms.

“For policy to be effective, it needs to be based on evidence,” said Dr. Garen Wintemute, director of the Violence Prevention Research Program at the University of California, Davis, who had his C.D.C. financing cut in 1996. “The National Rifle Association and its allies in Congress have largely succeeded in choking off the development of evidence upon which that policy could be based.”

Private foundations initially stepped into the breach, but their attention tends to wax and wane, researchers said. They are also much more interested in work that leads to immediate results and less willing to finance basic epidemiological research that scientists say is necessary to establishing a foundation of knowledge about the connection between guns and violence, or the lack thereof.

The National Institute of Justice, part of the Justice Department, also used to finance firearms research, researchers said, but that money has also petered out in recent years. (Institute officials said they hoped to reinvigorate financing in this area.)

Stephen Teret, founding director of the Johns Hopkins Center for Gun Policy and Research, estimated that the amount of money available for firearms research was a quarter of what it used to be. With so much uncertainty about financing, Mr. Teret said, the circle of academics who study the phenomenon has fallen off significantly.

After the centers’ clash with the N.R.A., Mr. Teret said he was asked by C.D.C. officials to “curtail some things I was saying about guns and gun policy.”

Mr. Teret objected, saying his public comments about gun policy did not come while he was on the “C.D.C. meter.” After he threatened to file a lawsuit against the agency, Mr. Teret said, the officials backed down and gave him “a little bit more leeway.”

C.D.C. financing for research on gun violence has not stopped completely, but it is now mostly limited to work in which firearms are only a component.

The centers also ask researchers it finances to give it a heads-up anytime they are publishing studies that have anything to do with firearms. The agency, in turn, relays this information to the N.R.A. as a courtesy, said Thomas Skinner, a spokesman for the centers.

Invariably, researchers said, whenever their work touches upon firearms, the C.D.C. becomes squeamish. In the end, they said, it is often simply easier to avoid the topic if they want to continue to be in the agency’s good graces.

Dr. Stephen Hargarten, professor and chairman of emergency medicine at the Medical College of Wisconsin, used to direct a research center, financed by the C.D.C., that focused on gun violence, but he said he had now shifted his attention to other issues.
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:43 PM   #286
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Is your gun supposed to match your belt?
Most of my rifles have the option to have a 'modern' look to them...i.e. Evil Black Rifle...or wood furniture for a more classic look. Which one I put on depends upon my mood before I go shooting. Sometimes I feel more classic, sometimes I feel like blowing up zombies!
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:44 PM   #287
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Why own so many guns? I mean, I understand the different types of guns for hunting, but why would you need more than one pistol?
Sometimes I want to hunt grouse or shoot at cans/targets, therefore a semi-auto .22 fits the bill, sometimes I want to carry 9mm, sometimes .40. Sometimes I feel a .357 will be adequate for protection sometimes a .44, lots of different circumstances. Sometimes I want a revolver, sometimes I want a semi. Sometimes I want a larger gun, sometimes I want a smaller one.

Why do you need/want more than one type of vehicle?
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:47 PM   #288
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:47 PM   #289
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Nope. Apparently they no longer sell guns. That must be a very recent development.
Or they are so backlogged that they don't think they can get shipped soon on what they have ordered. So they are suspending orders until they deal with the backlog. I got this in e-mail from buds today even though I have nothing on order from them(I bought some accessories a couple weeks ago).

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We are sending this email to any and all customers who have placed an order on www.BudsGunShop.com in the past month. Many of you have been customers of ours for years, have placed multiple orders with us, and therefore understand that any delays in shipping or customer service you may have experienced recently are not normal for Buds. The combination of a presidential election, extremely disturbing events in the media, and also the upcoming Christmas season has resulted in our complete inability to communicate with every customer attempting to contact us or ship orders as timely as we normally would.
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:47 PM   #290
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I have come to the conclusion that gun control is really only a major problem when it is being talked about. I think that some of you are being a little paranoid to think things are going to drastically change now. The only thing I could see changing, and rightfully so in my opinion, is limitations on people who have close relatives or people living with them with severe mental disabilities. Not even necessarily not letting them purchase them, but perhaps limiting the types, the numbers, or the amount of ammo (just thinking out loud on that). I am sure most of you know better than I what would be appropriate and agreeable limitations for people in these unfortunate circumstances.
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:49 PM   #291
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And BTW, Luv, you can legally purchase an oozie. It will just be a semi-automatic oozie.
Yes, but in the event one gets an oozie, it can be cured.

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Old 12-18-2012, 12:50 PM   #292
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My only experiences holding a gun were 1) when I worked at a convenience store when I was 19, and the on duty reserve police officer (small town) took the magazine out, put the safety on, and let me hold it, and 2) a guy I dated over the summer showed me how to take his apart and how to hold it to shoot it. They were heavier than I expected, especially the cop's, and that was without a magazine.

My only experiences every shooting a gun were 1) Duck Hunt on NES, and 2) my first ever attempt at playing COD Black Ops 2 a few weeks ago (which is the first time I've played a video game in about 15 years...lol).
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:50 PM   #293
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I confirmed with my local dicks sporting goods too, that they are no longer carrying AR-15's or their accessories.
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:51 PM   #294
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Driving by a gunsmith about a block away on the same street there is an elementary school. Never an incident with a gun at that school yet its pretty accessible to get a gun and head to that school. Just shows there are more law abiding citizens than crazies and if you take guns away there will just be another weapon at their disposal. Hell bats are a common weapon for murder. 600+ deaths a year by a blunt object. So do we ban the sale of bats, golf clubs, and tire irons?
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:51 PM   #295
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Sure.

Hey that matches! Now if this doesn't define 'evil looking' AR I don't know what does!

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Old 12-18-2012, 12:52 PM   #296
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Originally Posted by mr. tegu View Post
I have come to the conclusion that gun control is really only a major problem when it is being talked about. I think that some of you are being a little paranoid to think things are going to drastically change now. The only thing I could see changing, and rightfully so in my opinion, is limitations on people who have close relatives or people living with them with severe mental disabilities. Not even necessarily not letting them purchase them, but perhaps limiting the types, the numbers, or the amount of ammo (just thinking out loud on that). I am sure most of you know better than I what would be appropriate and agreeable limitations for people in these unfortunate circumstances.
Everybody has a crazy relative. Seems like a slippery slope.
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:53 PM   #297
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I confirmed with my local dicks sporting goods too, that they are no longer carrying AR-15's or their accessories.
Looks like CTD just nonchalantly announced it on their facebook. No explanation...and people are PISSED.

https://www.facebook.com/cheaperthan...51295765484324
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:54 PM   #298
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I confirmed with my local dicks sporting goods too, that they are no longer carrying AR-15's or their accessories.
So they no longer carry Black Rifles anymore? What do they only carry white rifles now????

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Old 12-18-2012, 12:56 PM   #299
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Looks like CTD just nonchalantly announced it on their facebook. No explanation...and people are PISSED.

https://www.facebook.com/cheaperthan...51295765484324
Yep they sure are and rightfully so IMO.

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So they no longer carry Black Rifles anymore? What do they only carry white rifles now????

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Old 12-18-2012, 01:14 PM   #300
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Originally Posted by InChiefsHell View Post
Looks like CTD just nonchalantly announced it on their facebook. No explanation...and people are PISSED.

https://www.facebook.com/cheaperthan...51295765484324
I have no tolerance for this shit. Screw them.
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