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Old 01-16-2013, 12:58 AM  
Micjones Micjones is offline
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If not #1, where?

The draftniks keep saying that Geno Smith isn't worth the #1 pick.
None of them say he isn't the top QB in the class though.
If we don't take him at #1 how far is he realistically going to fall?

I see no scenario where he falls out of the Top 10.

So if he's the top QB in a weak class...
QB is our biggest need...
And he's gonna go Top 10 anyway...

Why not at #1?

Am I wrong to say he won't fall out of the Top 10?

Discuss...
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:31 PM   #286
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Originally Posted by DeezNutz View Post
Drafting Gabbert wasn't desperation. Playing him in year one was.
If he wasn't ready to play in Year One, he was over-drafted at the #10 overall position.

Plus, he's just been an awful NFL QB.
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:31 PM   #287
htismaqe htismaqe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
So, you're saying that if Locker and Gabbert were successful QB's, both men would have been fired anyway?

I'm not buying that.
Are you suggesting that if they had passed on Locker and Gabbert and continued winning 6-7 games with the veterans they had, they wouldn't have been?
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:32 PM   #288
htismaqe htismaqe is offline
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Originally Posted by alnorth View Post
They took a swing, and missed. If you don't even try, you'll be fired.
Striking out looking is apparently more desirable than striking out swinging.

Not sure I understand the logic at all.
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:33 PM   #289
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Originally Posted by htismaqe View Post
Are you suggesting that if they had passed on Locker and Gabbert and continued winning 6-7 games with the veterans they had, they wouldn't have been?
I think it's possible, especially if they hadn't reached on QB's the year prior, yes. Reaching for a QB shows not only desperation but the fact that said GM can't properly evaluate quarterbacks.

Although Gene Smith had been on shaky ground for a long time.
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:34 PM   #290
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Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
Right.

i'm right...even the laziest look back at coaches and QBs makes that clear

there is no 'risk'...it exists in your mind and your mind only

and it's that obsession with a fake risk that explains the Chiefs 30 decades of failure...and hopefully that bullshit comes to and end this year
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:36 PM   #291
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alnorth View Post
They took a swing, and missed. If you don't even try, you'll be fired.
Really? Where's the proof of that? And don't say Pioli because he sealed his fate the day he sent the #36 overall pick to the Patriots for Cassel.

Do you guys think this is some kind of game? That not choosing a QB in the first round is a fire-able offense?
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:36 PM   #292
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Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
If he wasn't ready to play in Year One, he was over-drafted at the #10 overall position.

Plus, he's just been an awful NFL QB.
He was incredibly young when he was drafted (#8 overall), and I don't necessarily agree that a first-round pick must play week one of year one.

Treat each case differently. But draft for overall talent and upside.
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Last edited by DeezNutz; 01-16-2013 at 02:42 PM..
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:36 PM   #293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
So, you're saying that if Locker and Gabbert were successful QB's, both men would have been fired anyway?

I'm not buying that.
If they were successful QB's the team would've won. Winning masks a lot of issues. If they would have won, no, they wouldn't have been fired.

Yeah, drafting a QB is risky. But the rewards are tremendous.

Every GM/HC has to identify a QB. Every one of them.

How well they are able to identify that QB and then develop him is what keeps their Jobs or gets them fired.
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:37 PM   #294
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Originally Posted by the Talking Can View Post
i'm right...even the laziest look back at coaches and QBs makes that clear

there is no 'risk'...it exists in your mind and your mind only

and it's that obsession with a fake risk that explains the Chiefs 30 decades of failure...and hopefully that bullshit comes to and end this year
First off, you dumb mother****er, NEVER have I stated that the Chiefs shouldn't take a QB with the #1 overall pick. You're as ****ing as retarded as you've always been.

Secondly, it would be outright ****ing STUPID for John Dorsey and Andy Reid to select a quarterback on the sole reason that "It hasn't happened in KC for 30 years".

THAT is ****ing stupid ass logic.
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:38 PM   #295
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Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
Really? Where's the proof of that? And don't say ***** because he sealed his fate the day he sent the #36 overall pick to the Patriots for Cassel.

Do you guys think this is some kind of game? That not choosing a QB in the first round is a fire-able offense?
Not winning is a fireable offense.

Finding and developing your QB is the key to winning.

As someone who has argued this point many times in the past, i find it odd that you feel the need to play contrarian lately.
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:40 PM   #296
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Originally Posted by DeezNutz View Post
He was incredibly young when he drafted (#8 overall), and I don't necessarily agree that a first-round pick must play week one of year one.

Treat each case differently. But draft for overall talent and upside.
If you're drafting a QB #8 overall for talent and upside, my opinion is that you've reached and over-drafted.

It's not 1970 or 1990 or even 2004 anymore. Unless you're team is fully loaded with a QB in place (like the 2005 Packers), it's ridiculous to spend a Top Ten pick on a QB that needs major development before he's ready to play.
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:40 PM   #297
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Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
So, you're saying that if Locker and Gabbert were successful QB's, both men would have been fired anyway?

I'm not buying that.
No, I'm saying the exact opposite.

Let's say you're Gene Smith. You know you're a shitty GM, but really want to keep your job. You have two options:

1) Draft a QB. A delicate process, but one that will keep you in business for years if it works out. A great QB = wins = a job. However, if the QB busts, the shitty job you've done with the team will be exposed and you'll get fired

2) Don't draft a QB. In spite of your shitty record with ALL first rounders, this might have a higher chance of generating a positive contributor to your football team in a QB year like 2011. However, even if your player hits, there's still the issue of the vacancy at QB as well as all the bullshit around that vacant QB you drafted before. You can draft this one guy and he can hit, but you need to do that AT LEAST ten more times before your team starts to play well and you get to keep your job.

So which one would you choose, Gene Smith? If I were that guy, I'd pick option #1. Hit on that QB and your job is gold. Whereas in #2, you can hit on that pick but your job is still in danger.
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:42 PM   #298
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Originally Posted by Detoxing View Post
Not winning is a fireable offense.

Finding and developing your QB is the key to winning.

As someone who has argued this point many times in the past, i find it odd that you feel the need to play contrarian lately.
I'm playing "contrarian" lately because I believe that it's equally possible that Dorsey and Reid either trade for veteran QB (Flynn or Smith), trade back and accumulate picks and draft a QB in the later rounds, as it is that they take a QB #1 overall.

Yet that possibility, when mentioned, is met with disgust, anger and outright hostility, which I also find ridiculous considering none of these guys have been fully evaluated yet.
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:43 PM   #299
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Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
I'm playing "contrarian" lately because I believe that it's equally possible that Dorsey and Reid either trade for veteran QB (Flynn or Smith), trade back and accumulate picks and draft a QB in the later rounds, as it is that they take a QB #1 overall.

Yet that possibility, when mentioned, is met with disgust, anger and outright hostility, which I also find ridiculous considering none of these guys have been fully evaluated yet.
I think they might do this too, Dane. My point is that it will be a major mistake.
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:44 PM   #300
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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No, I'm saying the exact opposite.

Let's say you're Gene Smith. You know you're a shitty GM, but really want to keep your job. You have two options:

1) Draft a QB. A delicate process, but one that will keep you in business for years if it works out. A great QB = wins = a job. However, if the QB busts, the shitty job you've done with the team will be exposed and you'll get fired

2) Don't draft a QB. In spite of your shitty record with ALL first rounders, this might have a higher chance of generating a positive contributor to your football team in a QB year like 2011. However, even if your player hits, there's still the issue of the vacancy at QB as well as all the bullshit around that vacant QB you drafted before. You can draft this one guy and he can hit, but you need to do that AT LEAST ten more times before your team starts to play well and you get to keep your job.

So which one would you choose, Gene Smith? If I were that guy, I'd pick option #1. Hit on that QB and your job is gold. Whereas in #2, you can hit on that pick but your job is still in danger.
I understand what you're saying but I also believe that Gene Smith is a rare circumstance because he had years to draft, develop or trade for a QB but it wasn't until his job was in jeopardy that he actually made the move.

So essentially, he drafted Gabbert out of fear instead of drafting him because he felt he was a franchise QB.
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