Home Mail MemberMap Chat (0) Wallpapers
Go Back   ChiefsPlanet > The Lounge > D.C.

View Poll Results: I'm socially ________ and fiscally ________. (fill in the blanks)
I'm socially LIBERAL and fiscally CONSERVATIVE 23 57.50%
I'm socially LIBERAL and fiscally LIBERAL 4 10.00%
I'm socially CONSERVATIVE and fiscally CONSERVATIVE 11 27.50%
I'm socially CONSERVATIVE and fiscally LIBERAL 1 2.50%
I don't know what I am. I'll let Gaz decide. 1 2.50%
Voters: 40. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-28-2013, 11:31 AM  
patteeu patteeu is offline
The 23rd Pillar
 
patteeu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Casino cash: $5000
I'm socially ________ and fiscally ________. (fill in the blanks)

We've all heard others describe themselves as socially liberal and fiscally conservative. Most of us have described ourselves that way at some point. I've done it before, but I've started avoiding that phrase because I think it means radically different things to different people.

For example, in petez28's recent thread (So, you say you aren't just a party line type of person?), here's a list of people who embrace the description (so far):

Rain Man
Dave Lane
Mr. Flopnuts
chiefzilla1501
crispystl420
AustinChief
FishingRod
Amnorix

That's a pretty varied group of ideologies. So, vote in the poll and let's find the socially conservative, fiscally liberal people.
Posts: 75,744
patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 12:23 PM   #16
patteeu patteeu is offline
The 23rd Pillar
 
patteeu's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2002
Casino cash: $5000
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzzer99 View Post
Also that article is incredibly stupid. The 2000-2006 republican–controlled Congress was an orgy of pork spending. When the National Review comes out and lasts a Republican Congress, you know they gone off the deep end. The Republicans never cared a lick about the debt ceiling until Obama took office. If the author is unwilling to realistically address these sudden changes of heart, than he's just another partisan hack.

The Ryan budget doesn't call for any decreases in defense spending. That's just not realistic. Why does the author not mention Eisenhower's famous quote about the military-industrial complex? When republicans show some balls on cutting defense spending, then I will consider taking their rhetoric about the debt and debt ceiling seriously. Until then I just have to assume they will keep bloviating about the debt until a Republican takes office again, and then forget about it like they always do - ala Dick Cheney: "deficits don't matter".
What was stupid about it, Bob?
__________________


"I'll see you guys in New York." ISIS Caliph Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi to US military personnel upon his release from US custody at Camp Bucca in Iraq during Obama's first year in office.
Posts: 75,744
patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 12:33 PM   #17
patteeu patteeu is offline
The 23rd Pillar
 
patteeu's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2002
Casino cash: $5000
BTW, out fiscal problems weren't caused by defense spending. Over the past several decades, defense spending has generally been declining as a fraction of both GDP and the federal budget. Entitlement spending and interest payments on the debt are where the budget busting growth comes from.
__________________


"I'll see you guys in New York." ISIS Caliph Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi to US military personnel upon his release from US custody at Camp Bucca in Iraq during Obama's first year in office.
Posts: 75,744
patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 12:38 PM   #18
Predarat Predarat is offline
Run Chiefs fans, run!!
 
Predarat's Avatar
 

Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Nashville, TN
Casino cash: $6178
Where is the option for "I'm I'm socially awkward and fiscally irresponsible."?
Posts: 9,118
Predarat is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Predarat is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Predarat is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Predarat is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Predarat is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Predarat is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Predarat is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Predarat is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Predarat is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Predarat is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Predarat is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 12:39 PM   #19
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
Bless FSU!
 
BucEyedPea's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: None of your business
Casino cash: $23741
patteeu, using the GDP is sleight-of-hand. That gets used to make something seem less bad because it's just a percentage. GDP includes govt spending, and is itself a phony stat, and gets used for such shenanigans.
__________________
“The power to declare war, including the power of judging the causes of war, is fully and exclusively vested in the legislature.” ~ James Madison, Father of the Constitution

“We do not believe in aggressive or preventive war. Such war is the weapon of dictators, not of free democratic countries like the United States.”~ Truman, Sept 1, 1950
Posts: 59,903
BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 01:17 PM   #20
Chocolate Hog Chocolate Hog is offline
Winner
 
Chocolate Hog's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: My house
Casino cash: $14037
Liberal and conservative
Posts: 35,399
Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.Chocolate Hog has parlayed a career as a truck driver into debt free trailer and jon boat ownership.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 01:21 PM   #21
cosmo20002 cosmo20002 is offline
Debunking your bullshit
 
cosmo20002's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: KC area
Casino cash: $22838
Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
BTW, out fiscal problems weren't caused by defense spending. Over the past several decades, defense spending has generally been declining as a fraction of both GDP and the federal budget. Entitlement spending and interest payments on the debt are where the budget busting growth comes from.
This is usually the kind of argument you make fun of--spending has increased, but it decreased as a percentage of something or other, so therefore the increase in spending, or the spending itself, doesn't matter.
Posts: 20,580
cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 01:27 PM   #22
blaise blaise is offline
Gonzo = Sexy Bitch
 

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Plano, TX
Casino cash: $545
For cosmo it just comes down to aligning his beliefs with Obama's.
Posts: 21,107
blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 01:45 PM   #23
patteeu patteeu is offline
The 23rd Pillar
 
patteeu's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2002
Casino cash: $5000
Quote:
Originally Posted by cosmo20002 View Post
This is usually the kind of argument you make fun of--spending has increased, but it decreased as a percentage of something or other, so therefore the increase in spending, or the spending itself, doesn't matter.
No, that's not correct. I'm not suggesting that defense spending has been cut over the past few decades. Try again.
__________________


"I'll see you guys in New York." ISIS Caliph Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi to US military personnel upon his release from US custody at Camp Bucca in Iraq during Obama's first year in office.
Posts: 75,744
patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 01:47 PM   #24
cosmo20002 cosmo20002 is offline
Debunking your bullshit
 
cosmo20002's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: KC area
Casino cash: $22838
Quote:
Originally Posted by blaise View Post
For cosmo it just comes down to aligning his beliefs with Obama's.
Ouch, that hurt.
Posts: 20,580
cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 01:53 PM   #25
cosmo20002 cosmo20002 is offline
Debunking your bullshit
 
cosmo20002's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: KC area
Casino cash: $22838
Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
No, that's not correct. I'm not suggesting that defense spending has been cut over the past few decades. Try again.
I never said you did. What you did do was dismiss defense spending as a fiscal issue because such spending "has generally been declining as a fraction of both GDP and the federal budget." As if that means it is not a spending issue.

Spending on something could have increased exponentially, but if as a precentage of something else, it went down--then it is not an issue to you.
Posts: 20,580
cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 02:03 PM   #26
A Salt Weapon A Salt Weapon is offline
Veteran
 
A Salt Weapon's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Alaska
Casino cash: $8146
I would consider myself socially libertarian and fiscally conservative.
Posted via Mobile Device
Posts: 1,806
A Salt Weapon is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.A Salt Weapon is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.A Salt Weapon is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.A Salt Weapon is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.A Salt Weapon is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.A Salt Weapon is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.A Salt Weapon is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.A Salt Weapon is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.A Salt Weapon is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.A Salt Weapon is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.A Salt Weapon is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 02:08 PM   #27
patteeu patteeu is offline
The 23rd Pillar
 
patteeu's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2002
Casino cash: $5000
Quote:
Originally Posted by cosmo20002 View Post
I never said you did. What you did do was dismiss defense spending as a fiscal issue because such spending "has generally been declining as a fraction of both GDP and the federal budget." As if that means it is not a spending issue.

Spending on something could have increased exponentially, but if as a precentage of something else, it went down--then it is not an issue to you.
You don't seem to know what you're talking about here. If entitlement spending had declined as a fraction of GDP and the federal budget like defense spending has, we'd either be running massive surpluses or we'd have a balanced budget with dramatically lower tax rates.

The defense budget is not a source of our fiscal problems. At all. Principles of good government demand that we constantly review our defense budget against evolving requirements so we can cut unnecessary or wasteful spending and reallocate funding toward effective programs, but there is absolutely no justification for cutting defense in reaction to the fiscal problems we face.
__________________


"I'll see you guys in New York." ISIS Caliph Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi to US military personnel upon his release from US custody at Camp Bucca in Iraq during Obama's first year in office.
Posts: 75,744
patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 02:14 PM   #28
cosmo20002 cosmo20002 is offline
Debunking your bullshit
 
cosmo20002's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: KC area
Casino cash: $22838
Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
You don't seem to know what you're talking about here. If entitlement spending had declined as a fraction of GDP and the federal budget like defense spending has, we'd either be running massive surpluses or we'd have a balanced budget with dramatically lower tax rates.

The defense budget is not a source of our fiscal problems. At all. Principles of good government demand that we constantly review our defense budget against evolving requirements so we can cut unnecessary or wasteful spending and reallocate funding toward effective programs, but there is absolutely no justification for cutting defense in reaction to the fiscal problems we face.
Put aside the actual issue of defense. You are saying that X is not a fiscal issue/problem, despite spending inceases in X, BECAUSE spending on X as a percentage of Y went down. That's a silly argument, and one you have attacked before.
Posts: 20,580
cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.cosmo20002 is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 02:35 PM   #29
Amnorix Amnorix is offline
In BB I trust
 
Amnorix's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2003
Location: Boston, Mass.
Casino cash: $12444
Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
Here's a Jonah Goldberg column on the subject that might apply to some of you:
The article doesn't fit me, FWIW, because the following aren't true (for me at least).

Quote:
And, Bob, you think Republicans are acting crazy-pants on the debt ceiling. You don’t really follow all of the details, but you can just tell that the GOP is being “extreme,” thanks to those wacky tea partiers.
The tea party is whacky, I'll admit that.

Quote:
So, Bob, as a “fiscal conservative,” what was so outrageous about trying to cut pork — Fisheries in Alaska! Massive subsidies for Amtrak! — from the Sandy disaster-relief bill? What was so nuts about looking for offsets to pay for it?
I would agree with cutting those items. Amtrak I would need to examine, but we need to trim pretty much everywhere.

I would honestly agree to a -- pick a percentage -- across the board cut right now. 10% on EVERYTHING, starting tomorrow. That's not a good way to govern, and I don't want to double dip, but that's how strongly I feel about cutting.

Quote:
You’re still spouting this nonsense about being fiscally conservative while insisting that the GOP is the problem. You buy into the media’s anti-Republican hysteria no matter what the facts are. Heck, you even believe it when Obama suggests he’s like an Eisenhower Republican.
errr...no, Obama is not an Eisenhower Republican.

Quote:
Bob, we are that insolvent phantom, you feckless, gormless clod. The year Eisenhower delivered that speech, U.S. debt was roughly half our GDP. But that was when we were still paying off WWII (not to mention things like the Marshall Plan), and the defense budget constituted more than half the U.S. budget (today it’s a fifth and falling). Now, the debt is bigger than our GDP. Gross Domestic Product is barely $15 trillion. The national debt is over $16 trillion and climbing — fast. The country isn’t going broke, Bob, it is broke.
Actually, it's not broke, but it's rapidly heading that way. Very rapidly.

Quote:
When George W. Bush added nearly $5 trillion in national debt in two terms you were scandalized. When Obama added more than that in one term, you yawned. When, in 2006, then-senator Obama condemned Bush’s failure of leadership and vowed to vote against raising the debt ceiling, you thought him a statesman. Obama, who wants to borrow trillions more, now admits that was purely a “political vote.”
I haven't yawned, though I do acknowledge the difference in circumstances when Obama came into office, and the classical economic theory that you don't want to go into frugality mode while heading into a recession. Many European countries have introduced austerity, and now are thoroughly rethinking that because it has tanked their economy.

That said, there should be a very define and specific plan to reduce spending, raise taxes, and head back to fiscal solvency. Right now we're a runaway freight train heading for the cliff.

Quote:
Yet when Republicans actually have the courage of Obama’s own convictions, you condemn them.
Not really. Republicans cherry pick what they want to attack, want to ignore the other side of the fiscal coin (taxes) and pretend that somehow there's a plan to return to a balanced budget. Their plan is ever so slightly better than the Democrats', because they are at least acting like they want to do *something*, but it's not much of a plan to be honest.

Romney's math never added up. Never came close. You can't really balance the deficit without touching military spending or taxes.

Quote:
Anyone who calls himself a fiscal conservative understands we have a spending problem. Do the math. A two-earner couple who retired in 2011 after making $89,000 per year will have paid about $114,000 into Medicare over their lifetimes but will receive $355,000. When will it dawn on you that Obama doesn’t think we have a spending problem? I ask because when he said “we don’t have a spending problem,” it seemed to have no effect on you.
I could quibble with these numbers, but we do have a spending problem.

Quote:
Eisenhower would take a flamethrower to today’s Washington.
I wonder what Ike, he of the military-industrial-complex, would say about basically unlimited military spending that the Republicans think is an untouchable third rail. Not much.

I tend to agree Ike would take a flamethrower to Washington, but it wouldn't just be the Democrat side of the aisle he would torch...

Quote:
I don’t expect you to vote Republican, never mind admit you’re simply a liberal. But please stop preening about your fiscal conservatism, particularly as you condemn the GOP for not being fiscal conservatives, even when they are the only fiscal conservatives in town.[/indent]
I did vote Republican. Both Romney and Scott Brown.

So yeah, **** off Mr. Goldberg. Your smarmy, know-it-all, condescending article isn't accurate for me, just as it isn't accurate for many other socially liberal / fiscal conservatives who have no party of their own but are lost between two clueless parties who seem hellbent on fiscal insanity.
__________________
"I love signature blocks on the Internet. I get to put whatever the hell I want in quotes, pick a pretend author, and bang, it's like he really said it." George Washington
Posts: 34,026
Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.
  Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2013, 02:36 PM   #30
Amnorix Amnorix is offline
In BB I trust
 
Amnorix's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2003
Location: Boston, Mass.
Casino cash: $12444
Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
Yeah, I don't really think they fit anyone very well.

I'm anxious to find someone who describes themselves as a fiscal liberal.

Just "liberal" would fit the bill.
__________________
"I love signature blocks on the Internet. I get to put whatever the hell I want in quotes, pick a pretend author, and bang, it's like he really said it." George Washington
Posts: 34,026
Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.
  Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:50 PM.


This is a test for a client's site.
A new website that shows member-created construction site listings that need fill or have excess fill. Dirt Monkey @ https://DirtMonkey.net
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.