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Old 01-28-2013, 06:36 PM  
Tribal Warfare Tribal Warfare is offline
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Teicher:New Chiefs assistant Toub’s goal is to win games on special teams

New Chiefs assistant Toub’s goal is to win games on special teams
By ADAM TEICHER
The Kansas City Star
Dave Toub built his reputation in nine seasons with Chicago as one of the NFL’s best special-teams coaches in part because the Bears had kick returner Devin Hester and other players who were strong in the kicking game.

But there was more to Toub’s success, and he plans to bring that part of it to the Chiefs as their new special-teams coordinator.

“Our mentality when we were in Chicago was that we were going to win games on special teams,” Toub said Monday. “That’s something Lovie (Smith) instilled in us early on. We felt like we had the personnel to be able to do it, especially when we picked up Devin in ’06. But even before that, we kind of got that philosophy going and kind of instilled that into our guys that we were going to win games with field position. …

“That was our goal up there and I definitely think it made a big difference.”

The Chiefs haven’t returned a kick for a touchdown since Dexter McCluster brought back a punt for a score in the season-opening game in 2010. They’ve allowed four kicks to be returned for a touchdown since then.

Meanwhile, the Bears returned 22 kicks for touchdowns in Toub’s nine seasons while allowing just three scores in the kicking game.

“It’s got to be important to be on special teams,” Toub said. “They’ve got to feel privileged to be on special teams. We put a lot of emphasis on it and we create a competitive atmosphere out there to where if you’re a starter on special teams, you’ve really earned it.

“Then when you start scoring and you start blocking punts and you start blocking field goals and you actually win games for your team, it just kind of snowballs and grows for you.”

Chiefs punter Dustin Colquitt, who kicked in the Pro Bowl on Sunday in Honolulu, has a contract that is set to expire in March. But Colquitt said he’d like to work out a long-term contract with the Chiefs at least in part for the chance to work with Toub.

“I’d obviously love to work with Dave,” Colquitt said. “He’s got a great reputation, regarded as one of the best. It helps when you have veteran kickers and punters and a guy like Devin Hester. But we’ve watched them on film and the scheme is there. He’s got people buying in, making blocks, beating blocks, doing everything. That goes back to scheme more than anything. You’ve got to have the talent, the punter, the kicker, the return guy to make the first guy miss, but you can tell what he was able to do in Chicago was very special.

“I’m interested to see how that translates into Kansas City football.”

For his part, Toub returned the compliment.

“I like the punter,” Toub said. “I like him a lot. I never really had a punter than bombed the ball like this. He’s going to bomb the ball and give you good hang time and distance.”

The Chiefs have tried a variety of return specialists in recent seasons, including McCluster, Javier Arenas and Devon Wylie. McCluster scored the touchdown in his first NFL game but otherwise the Chiefs haven’t been able to get the game-changing return.

“We certainly have three guys we’re going to let battle it out with Arenas, Wiley and McCluster,” Toub said. “McCluster is somebody that’s very intriguing to me. He can really make you miss. I think he’s got a lot of untapped potential as a punt returner.”
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Old 01-28-2013, 08:44 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Tribal Warfare View Post
Let's be honest he's no where near Lowery, Stoyanovich, and Anderson. Succop is decent at his best.
Stoyanovich career kicking percentage: 79.5%
Lowery career kicking percentage: 80%
Gary Anderson career kicking percentage: 80.1%
Morten Andersen career kicking percentage: 79.7%



Ryan Succop career kicking percentage: 81.5%

If you're at 80 percent as a kicker you're doing just fine and don't need to be replaced.
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Old 01-28-2013, 08:49 PM   #17
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I've never understood this idiocy that Succop needs to be replaced.

Our kickers are always terrible until they go to other teams and find success. Then we're stuck finding new guys to run through. Then that new guy will "need to be replaced."

We've got a good kicker. A GOOD kicker. Not great, but good. That's all you ****ing need. The moment you dick around with finding a better kicker is the moment you get burned by a terrible one that will lose you games.
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Old 01-28-2013, 08:54 PM   #18
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They're actually going to coach these guys up? What a concept.

It sounds like a culture change on special teams. Making it something guys want to do because they're allowed to be playmakers instead of a last resort just to make the team.

Toub sounds perfect to me.
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Old 01-28-2013, 08:54 PM   #19
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I've never understood this idiocy that Succop needs to be replaced.

Our kickers are always terrible until they go to other teams and find success. Then we're stuck finding new guys to run through. Then that new guy will "need to be replaced."

We've got a good kicker. A GOOD kicker. Not great, but good. That's all you ****ing need. The moment you dick around with finding a better kicker is the moment you get burned by a terrible one that will lose you games.
Succop did lose us some games , he's decent and that's it.
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Old 01-28-2013, 08:56 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Tribal Warfare View Post
Succop did lose us some games , he's decent and that's it.
Which ones? I've never seen him lose a game for us.
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Old 01-28-2013, 08:58 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Tribal Warfare View Post
Succop did lose us some games , he's decent and that's it.
He's good enough to win a Super Bowl and does not need to be replaced. Period.
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Old 01-28-2013, 09:11 PM   #22
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Which ones? I've never seen him lose a game for us.
Pittsburgh, San Diego'11, Raiders . The guy is decent but I wouldn't say good.
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Old 01-28-2013, 09:42 PM   #23
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You do know that Nick Lowery was cut by something like 5 teams before he finally stuck with the Chiefs?

You also know that as "good" as he was, he missed a lot of clutch opportunities?
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Old 01-28-2013, 09:43 PM   #24
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I've sat in my house just about every Sunday for the last 3 years watching Chiefs games. Occasionally this one friend of mine comes over. Every time Arenas goes back to return a punt I say "he's gonna take this to the house." Kind of a running joke now. I really hope Arenas houses some next yaer.
Arenas is decent in punt return. He just sucks major ass on kick returns.
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Old 01-28-2013, 09:48 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Tribal Warfare View Post
Pittsburgh, San Diego'11, Raiders . The guy is decent but I wouldn't say good.
WTF was he supposed to do that game? Curve the ball around the free rusher?

And no, he didn't lose us those other 2 games either. He made the FG to send the game into overtime for the Pittsburgh game. And Matt Cassel threw the game losing INT in the Chargers game.
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:06 PM   #26
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WTF was he supposed to do that game? Curve the ball around the free rusher?

And no, he didn't lose us those other 2 games either. He made the FG to send the game into overtime for the Pittsburgh game. And Matt Cassel threw the game losing INT in the Chargers game.
Looks like Tribal just got told
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:06 PM   #27
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Succop is fine. Toub basically said as much, just wants his kicking guy to work with him.

Like Colquitt said, best guy with the worst football name.
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:14 PM   #28
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You know what's cool?

The Chiefs have lost a LOT of games since Succop was drafted. Usually a kicker loses one or two games for an AVERAGE team in the span of 4 seasons.

You can BARELY make a case for one loss being pinned to Succop. He has never lost a game by missing a field goal.

That's all you can expect out of your kicker. If your guy misses a kick when you're ahead, it's the defense's job to close the door. If your guy misses a kick when you're behind but there's still time, it's the TEAM'S job to get a stop and then go score.

Blaming one of those losses on the kicker is like the Donks fans who still bitch about that no-clipping call on Dante Hall in the 2003 game. The refs missed the penalty, but there was 8 minutes left in the game.

Real teams don't hide behind kickers. And Succop has been in a LOT of positions where if he screws up, the team would hide behind him. Out of those possible scenarios, you can point to ONE that has any kind of case behind it (and even then, it's a bad one).

**** replacing our kicker. It's a waste of ****ing time, money, and effort finding a new guy.
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:17 PM   #29
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Which ones? I've never seen him lose a game for us.
Succop is crap.

And yes, he's lost several games since he was drafted.

Connor Barth FTW, Pioli.
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:17 PM   #30
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Succop is a better kicker than Lawrence Tynes was when he was here...and Tynes was good enough to play for the Giants for the last six years...so **** all of you.
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