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Old 02-11-2013, 05:57 AM  
La literatura La literatura is offline
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Pope Benedict XVI to Retire

http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/be...aratio_en.html

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Dear Brothers,

I have convoked you to this Consistory, not only for the three canonizations, but also to communicate to you a decision of great importance for the life of the Church. After having repeatedly examined my conscience before God, I have come to the certainty that my strengths, due to an advanced age, are no longer suited to an adequate exercise of the Petrine ministry. I am well aware that this ministry, due to its essential spiritual nature, must be carried out not only with words and deeds, but no less with prayer and suffering. However, in today’s world, subject to so many rapid changes and shaken by questions of deep relevance for the life of faith, in order to govern the barque of Saint Peter and proclaim the Gospel, both strength of mind and body are necessary, strength which in the last few months, has deteriorated in me to the extent that I have had to recognize my incapacity to adequately fulfill the ministry entrusted to me. For this reason, and well aware of the seriousness of this act, with full freedom I declare that I renounce the ministry of Bishop of Rome, Successor of Saint Peter, entrusted to me by the Cardinals on 19 April 2005, in such a way, that as from 28 February 2013, at 20:00 hours, the See of Rome, the See of Saint Peter, will be vacant and a Conclave to elect the new Supreme Pontiff will have to be convoked by those whose competence it is.

Dear Brothers, I thank you most sincerely for all the love and work with which you have supported me in my ministry and I ask pardon for all my defects. And now, let us entrust the Holy Church to the care of Our Supreme Pastor, Our Lord Jesus Christ, and implore his holy Mother Mary, so that she may assist the Cardinal Fathers with her maternal solicitude, in electing a new Supreme Pontiff. With regard to myself, I wish to also devotedly serve the Holy Church of God in the future through a life dedicated to prayer.

From the Vatican, 10 February 2013
BENEDICTUS PP XVI
On one hand, I am floored by the news. On the other hand, I am glad he is able to rest and enjoy retirement. I think this will set a healthy precedent.
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Old 02-11-2013, 12:37 PM   #106
mnchiefsguy mnchiefsguy is offline
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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
Certainly not as Pope did he participate in those actions. Will he be judged for his reforms of the Church wrt reporting and child protection, too? I hope so.
Given his role in the child molestation cover-up, one could certainly question whether he should have been appointed Pope in the first place.
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Old 02-11-2013, 12:37 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy View Post
Actually, I think it will completely be fair. I do not care what the rules were, he had a moral obligation to protect children from bad Priests, and instead he participated in actions that allowed those Priests to repeat their crimes ad nausea m. He will be judged by God and history for that.
He didn't believe the reports. That was due to his experience with the communists running Poland. They would make false reports about priests to weaken the Church. Like it or not, that was his psychological make-up on the issue.
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Old 02-11-2013, 12:40 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
He didn't believe the reports. That was due to his experience with the communists running Poland. They would make false reports about priests to weaken the Church. Like it or not, that was his psychological make-up on the issue.
That excuse might have been valid the first time he moved a Priest to a different location. After moving a Priest multiple times because of this, I just do not think that the excuse holds water anymore. The fact that these Priests were moved allowed their vile and evil acts to be repeated multiple times, and that is inexcusable.
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Old 02-11-2013, 12:42 PM   #109
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Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy View Post
That excuse might have been valid the first time he moved a Priest to a different location. After moving a Priest multiple times because of this, I just do not think that the excuse holds water anymore. The fact that these Priests were moved allowed their vile and evil acts to be repeated multiple times, and that is inexcusable.
Who PJP or the Rat?

I thought the moving or priests was done by each archdiocese. I know for a fact that many here were sent to a clinic in the DC area to try to cure them. They at least tried that and were promised they could be changed too. But the psychiatrists had them look at reams of child porn for the cure.
So they got even more of a problem.
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Old 02-11-2013, 12:47 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy View Post
Given his role in the child molestation cover-up, one could certainly question whether he should have been appointed Pope in the first place.
He really wasn't a person who made the decisions to move priests around. At the heyday of child molestation, he was a professor of theology. When he was at the CDF, and allegations started coming in, they were never addressed by Ratzinger, whose focus was more doctrinal than institutional. It's not as if he orchestrated the practice of moving priests around. No doubt his failure was not actively pursuing the allegations earlier, but how much he could have done is uncertain.
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Old 02-11-2013, 12:57 PM   #111
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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
He did not. When he was aware of them, he followed internal Church regulations related to these crimes. These regulations in the Canon Law were completely deficient, incomplete, and ended up hurting a lot of people. But turning them over to authorities was not part of the procedure. It was an institutional failure, not Joseph Ratzinger's.
Then he covered them up. He should have reported them to the authorities not the church. He is complicit in the crimes of molestation of these children.
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Old 02-11-2013, 01:01 PM   #112
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Originally Posted by dirk digler View Post
Then he covered them up. He should have reported them to the authorities not the church. He is complicit in the crimes of molestation of these children.
Uh, no. The crimes happened years before he became the head of the Congregation.
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Old 02-11-2013, 01:11 PM   #113
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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
Uh, no. The crimes happened years before he became the head of the Congregation.
That does not matter. When he became knowledgeable of horrible, heinous crimes that had been committed against children, he chose to look the other way, cover them up...call it whatever you want, but what he did was clearly and unequivocally wrong.
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Old 02-11-2013, 01:16 PM   #114
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Good. This guy was a miserable Pope for allowing children to be harmed in such a way. Of course you could say that about Pope John Paul as well.
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Old 02-11-2013, 01:17 PM   #115
La literatura La literatura is offline
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Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy View Post
That does not matter. When he became knowledgeable of horrible, heinous crimes that had been committed against children, he chose to look the other way, cover them up...call it whatever you want, but what he did was clearly and unequivocally wrong.
Yes, it does matter. And it's not what Ratzinger did, the issue is what the office did not do, which was be more pro-active in pursuing the claims. If we're going to charge Ratzinger with complicity in child molestation, we better have evidence that shows he knew it was occurring and allowed it to happen.
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Old 02-11-2013, 01:18 PM   #116
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Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco View Post
Good. This guy was a miserable Pope for allowing children to be harmed in such a way. Of course you could say that about Pope John Paul as well.
Neither "allowed" children to be harmed. Both Popes served well after the incidents of child abuse that rocked the Church. It is not right to say that the people who opened the overstuffed-closet were the ones who made the mess in the hallway.
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Old 02-11-2013, 01:25 PM   #117
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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
Neither "allowed" children to be harmed. Both Popes served well after the incidents of child abuse that rocked the Church.
Whatever, they got into a meeting with evidence and decided to not hold these "people" accountable. There is consistent evidence of the outright refusal of the Catholic Church to report their abusive priests to the proper authorities. In fact the Catholic Church prefers to shift these predators to other places, where they can attack more children. Stop making excuses for the corrupt nature of the Catholic Church. It's pathetic. Since the Bishop of Rome is the head of the Catholic Church...these Popes are responsible.
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Old 02-11-2013, 01:32 PM   #118
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Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco View Post
Whatever, they got into a meeting with evidence and decided to not hold these "people" accountable. There is consistent evidence of the outright refusal of the Catholic Church to report their abusive priests to the proper authorities. In fact the Catholic Church prefers to shift these predators to other places, where they can attack more children. Stop making excuses for the corrupt nature of the Catholic Church. It's pathetic. Since the Bishop of Rome is the head of the Catholic Church...these Popes are responsible.
They aren't responsible for the sexual abuse of children at all. Your premises are true, but they don't lead to your conclusion.
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Old 02-11-2013, 01:37 PM   #119
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Originally Posted by La literatura View Post
They aren't responsible for the sexual abuse of children at all. Your premises are true, but they don't lead to your conclusion.
Is the Pope the head catholic church? yes

Then he's just as responsible as every other administrator in the Catholic Church. Unless you're argument is that they are incompetent.
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Old 02-11-2013, 01:41 PM   #120
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Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco View Post
Whatever, they got into a meeting with evidence and decided to not hold these "people" accountable. There is consistent evidence of the outright refusal of the Catholic Church to report their abusive priests to the proper authorities. In fact the Catholic Church prefers to shift these predators to other places, where they can attack more children. Stop making excuses for the corrupt nature of the Catholic Church. It's pathetic. Since the Bishop of Rome is the head of the Catholic Church...these Popes are responsible.
100% agree. Their outright refusal to report their abusive Priests is akin to an endorsement of said behavior, as it encouraged said Priests to continue their heinous acts, since there were no consequences for them, other than moving to a new town every few years.

If the CEO of a major corporation acted in the same manner as the Pope, said CEO would be criminally charged.
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