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Old 03-07-2013, 11:13 PM  
KILLER_CLOWN KILLER_CLOWN is offline
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Chris Hedges: Update On Anti-NDAA Lawsuit Vs. Obama



'It's frightening how hard Obama is fighting against us.'

Outstanding interview. Chris Hedges outside the hearing for the second circuit court of appeals in the Hedges v Obama NDAA lawsuit. NDAA gives Obama the power to indefinitely detain any American any time for virtually any reason.

http://dailybail.com/home/chris-hedg...-vs-obama.html

He makes some good points and then throws out climate change... ah well.
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Old 03-08-2013, 02:00 PM   #2
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Only a Constitutional Amendment can give the President that power.
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Old 03-08-2013, 02:09 PM   #3
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Wow, while the concept has always been in front of me and assumed, Hedges verbalizes the concept perfectly and succinctly in 4 words: "Obama is a brand".

He is 100% accurate.
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Old 03-08-2013, 02:53 PM   #4
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This one is quite humorous, in a sick twisted way.

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Old 03-08-2013, 03:15 PM   #5
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I like this guy in the first video. Here's, the thing, I do not believe the govt via its SC is capable of restraining its own ( aka the govts') powers. So we are in a military dictatorship partially already.

The conservative judges like Alito, are for supporting executive power particularly related to war—even though undeclared. They've never decided on the declaration of war issue as Carter issued an amnesty, or on the Iraq resolution being a transfer of power by Congress to the president for the WoT. Roberts didn't even strike down ACA based on the fact that it did NOT originate in the House when he changed it to revenue (tax) legislation willy-nilly. I am surprised Ginsburg said "no" on lifting Obama's stay request on the injunction...and even Scalia's refusal. WTF? Both are off base. Bring back Justice Taney!

So NO, trusting a govt entity like the SC to limit Federal power is dubious.
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Old 03-08-2013, 03:22 PM   #6
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Oh, and the man in the first vid is absolutely correct that there's been continuity from Bush to Obama when Obama promised change from Bush.
Many on the left say nothing but defend it.
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Old 05-06-2014, 10:34 AM   #7
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Supreme Court rejects hearing on military detention case
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he U.S. Supreme Court on Monday handed a victory to President Barack Obama's administration by declining to hear a challenge to a law that allows the U.S. military to indefinitely detain people believed to have helped al Qaeda or the Taliban.

The high court left intact a July 2013 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals decision that journalists and others who said they could be detained under the law, did not have standing to sue.

The provision in question is part of the National Defense Authorization Act, which the U.S. Congress passes annually to authorize programs of the Defense Department.

It lets the government indefinitely detain people it deems to have "substantially supported" al Qaeda, the Taliban or "associated forces."

Journalists and activists whose work relates to overseas conflicts, including Pulitzer Prize winner Chris Hedges and an Icelandic spokeswoman for the Wikileaks website, said that the law could subject them to being locked up for exercising constitutionally protected rights. They also said the threat of enforcement violated their right to free speech.

In September 2012, U.S. District Judge Katherine Forrest of New York issued a permanent injunction preventing the United States from invoking the part of the law authorizing indefinite detentions.

The appeals court said the challengers had no standing because they could not show the provision has any bearing on the government's authority to detain U.S. citizens.

The court said the plaintiffs who were not U.S. citizens lacked standing to sue because they did not show "a sufficient threat that the government will detain them" under the provision.

The case is Hedges v. Obama, U.S. Supreme Court, No. 13-758
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Old 05-06-2014, 05:53 PM   #8
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This is shameful by the court for both liberals and conservatives and especially for the Chief Justice who has considerable over their agenda for what cases to take--especially one of this importance.

No standing? Why because the journalist was not yet taken in the middle of the night from his home; then sent into rendition and tortured. Geez! To my knowledge that's only one way there is standing. What about the chilling effects any journalist or govt critic is sitting under right NOW with this law? That's supposed to be standing too.

Then the SC claims it didn't refer to "citizens" when the Fifth Amendment uses "persons." That right there is another usurpation, however subtle. I won't even address how vague and broad the language of the NDAA is. It's a flawed decision.

Guess will have to wait for someone to get a knock on their door in the middle of the night. Welcome to the fascist United States.
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“We do not believe in aggressive or preventive war. Such war is the weapon of dictators, not of free democratic countries like the United States.”~ Truman, Sept 1, 1950
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Old 05-06-2014, 06:07 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
This is shameful by the court for both liberals and conservatives and especially for the Chief Justice who has considerable over their agenda for what cases to take--especially one of this importance.

No standing? Why because the journalist was not yet taken in the middle of the night from his home; then sent into rendition and tortured. Geez! To my knowledge that's only one way there is standing. What about the chilling effects any journalist or govt critic is sitting under right NOW with this law? That's supposed to be standing too.

Then the SC claims it didn't refer to "citizens" when the Fifth Amendment uses "persons." That right there is another usurpation, however subtle. I won't even address how vague and broad the language of the NDAA is. It's a flawed decision.

Guess will have to wait for someone to get a knock on their door in the middle of the night. Welcome to the fascist United States.
actually the chief justice does not have any particular power over what cases are taken up by the court...

it takes the vote of 4 of the 9 justices to hear a case... http://www.uscourts.gov/educational-...rocedures.aspx
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Old 05-06-2014, 06:32 PM   #10
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US Supreme Court Refuses to Uphold the Constitution: Allows Indefinite Detention
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The court ignored the fact that the co-sponsors of the indefinite detention law said it does apply to American citizens, and that top legal scholars agree.

The courts’ Orwellian reasoning may sound – at first blush - like it might be a good thing. After all, both the Court of Appeal and the Supreme Court said that there’s no indication that the indefinite detention provision will be applied against U.S. citizens.

However, by refusing to strike down the law and insist that any future laws explicitly exempt U.S. citizens, it leaves discretion in the hands of the executive branch.

The effect of the decision will be to allow the U.S. government to kidnap and indefinitely detain U.S. citizens who protest or dissent against the government … and the courts will never hear any legal challenge from the prisoners.
Quote:
Daniel Ellsberg notes that Obama’s claimed power to indefinitely detain people without charges or access to a lawyer or the courts is a power that even King George – the guy we fought the Revolutionary War against – didn’t claim. And former judge and adjunct professor of constitutional law Andrew Napolitano points out that Obama’s claim that he can indefinitely detain prisoners even after they are acquitted of their crimes is a power that even Hitler and Stalin didn’t claim.
http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews...wful-detention
Quote:
This pernicious law poses one of the greatest threats to civil liberties in our nation’s history. Under Section 1021 of the NDAA, foreign nationals who are alleged to have committed or merely “suspected” of sympathizing with or providing any level of support to groups the U.S. designates as terrorist organization or an affiliate or associated force may be imprisoned without charge or trial “until the end of hostilities.”

The law affirms the executive branch’s authority granted under the 2001 Authorization for Use of Military Force (AUMF) and broadens the definition and scope of “covered persons.”

But because the “war on terror” is a war on a tactic, not on a state, it has no parameters or timetable. Consequently, this law can be used by authorities to detain (forever) anyone the government considers a threat to national security and stability — potentially even demonstrators and protesters exercising their First Amendment rights.
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Old 05-06-2014, 07:47 PM   #11
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The 5th applies to "persons" under our jurisdiction--not just citizens. Citizens is covered in the 14th.
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Old 05-06-2014, 09:06 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
The 5th applies to "persons" under our jurisdiction--not just citizens. Citizens is covered in the 14th.
the due process and equal protection clauses in both amendments refer to persons...

the 14th also has language pertaining to citizenship which can be acquired through birth or naturalization, overruling dred scott case which held that persons descended from slaves could not be citizens...

i'm not sure why this distinction is important in the ndaa case, could you elaborate?
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Old 05-06-2014, 09:42 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by planetdoc View Post
Daniel Ellsberg notes that Obama’s claimed power to indefinitely detain people without charges or access to a lawyer or the courts is a power that even King George – the guy we fought the Revolutionary War against – didn’t claim. And former judge and adjunct professor of constitutional law Andrew Napolitano points out that Obama’s claim that he can indefinitely detain prisoners even after they are acquitted of their crimes is a power that even Hitler and Stalin didn’t claim.
That dang Obama...just to be clear, George W Bush claimed the same thing, correct?

The reference to Hitler and Stalin is plain old ****ing stupid. They didn't "claim" it? OK, they just did it, and a lot more...I guess that's better.
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Old 05-06-2014, 10:28 PM   #14
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I suspected there is a lot more to this than an Obama thrist for imprisoning citizens, and that appears to be correct. I don't feel like research this all night, so I'll just leave this here if any cares to look into it.

Short version--the detention stuff was already part of the law since 2001 and the WH didn't think it necessary in the NDAA. The WH actually threatened a veto over the language, but Rs insisted on not putting llimitations on presidential authority. A compromise did drop a requirement of military detention for terrorism suspects arrested in the US.


From Wikipedia, for what it's worth--

"The detention sections of the NDAA begin by "affirm[ing]" that the authority of the President under the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Terrorists (AUMF), a joint resolution passed in the immediate aftermath of the September 11, 2001 attacks, includes the power to detain, via the Armed Forces, any person, including a U.S. citizen,[12][20] "who was part of or substantially supported al-Qaeda, the Taliban, or associated forces that are engaged in hostilities against the United States or its coalition partners", and anyone who commits a "belligerent act" against the United States or its coalition allies in aid of such enemy forces, under the law of war, "without trial, until the end of the hostilities authorized by the [AUMF]".

Addressing previous conflicts with the Obama Administration regarding the wording of the Senate text, the Senate-House compromise text, in sub-section 1021(d), also affirms that nothing in the Act "is intended to limit or expand the authority of the President or the scope of the Authorization for Use of Military Force".

The White House threatened to veto the Senate version of the Act,[11] arguing in an executive statement on November 17, 2011, that while "the authorities granted by the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Terrorists, including the detention authority...are essential to our ability to protect the American people...(and) Because the authorities codified in this section already exist, the Administration does not believe codification is necessary and poses some risk".

The statement furthermore objected to the mandate for "military custody for a certain class of terrorism suspects", which it called inconsistent with "the fundamental American principle that our military does not patrol our streets".[11] The White House may now waive the requirement for military custody for some detainees following a review by appointed officials including the Attorney General, the secretaries of state, defense and homeland security, the chairman of the military’s Joint Chiefs of Staff and the director of national intelligence.[33]

After a Senate-House compromise text explicitly ruled out any limitation of the President's authorities, but also removed the requirement of military detention for terrorism suspects arrested in the United States, the White House issued a statement saying that it would not veto the bill.[38]
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Old 05-06-2014, 11:56 PM   #15
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damn that obama!

trying to sneak that past us like that...
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