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Old 06-05-2012, 12:15 PM  
The Rick The Rick is offline
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Court Says Gay Rights Trump Religious Rights


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Court Says Gay Rights Trump Religious Rights
By Todd Starnes

The New Mexico Court of Appeals upheld a ruling by the state’s Civil Rights Commission that a Christian photographer who refused to take pictures of a gay couple’s commitment ceremony violated the state’s discrimination law.

“Elane Photography may not discriminate in its commercial activities against protected classes as the basis for expressing its religious freedom,” Judge Tim Garcia wrote in a 45-page ruling.

The case dates back to 2006 when Vanessa Willock tried to hire Elane Photography for a “same-gender ceremony.” New Mexico law does not recognize either marriage or civil unions between persons of the same sex.

Elane Hugenin declined to accept the job and explained to Willock that because of their Christian beliefs the studio only handled “traditional weddings.”

In 2008 the New Mexico Human Rights Commission found Elane Photography guilty of “sexual orientation” discrimination. The studio is owned by a young Christian husband and wife who based their refusal on their religious beliefs.

The Court of Appeals determined that a photo studio is considered a public accommodation – much like a restaurant or a store. As such, the photo studio may not refuse services based on sexual orientation or gender identity – even if doing so would violate the religious principles of the owners.

“The owners of Elane Photography must accept the reasonable regulations and restrictions imposed upon the conduct of their commercial enterprise despite their personal religious beliefs that may conflict with these government interests,” Garcia wrote.

The Alliance Defense Fund, a Christian legal advocacy group, represented the photography studio. They plan to appeal the ruling.

“Americans in the marketplace should not be subjected to legal attacks for simply abiding by their beliefs,” senior counsel Jordan Lorence said in a statement. “Because the Constitution prohibits the state from forcing unwilling artists to promote a message they disagree with, we will certainly appeal this decision to the New Mexico Supreme Court.”

But the court ruled that once a business offers a service publicly, they must do so “without impermissible exception.”

Elane Photography posed a hypothetical situation to support its argument – imaging what would happen if an African-American photographer refused to photograph a Ku-Klux-Klan rally because the photographer “wanted to refrain from using her photography to communicate a message that she finds deeply offensive.”

However, Judge Garcia said the argument fails as a matter of law.

“The Ku-Klux-Klan is not a protected class,” he wrote. “Sexual orientation, however, is protected.”

The court ruled that the Christian photography company must pay fines totaling nearly $7,000.

You can read the entire court decision by clicking here.

Todd is the author of “Dispatches From Bitter America.” The book is endorsed by Sarah Palin, Mark Levin and Sean Hannity. Click here to get your copy!
http://radio.foxnews.com/toddstarnes...us-rights.html
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Old 03-25-2013, 05:39 PM   #181
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Lol the klan is so desperate if you are white you could get in. I am guessing they are taking Jews at this point I think inner breeding has almost killed them off~
On this topic, I do not doubt that you know what you are talking about.
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As long as Jesus Christ was the president of the US and approved of it Yes.
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Old 03-25-2013, 05:39 PM   #182
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
They don't have to work for Disney if they don't like it.

Disney has a right to fire them for not doing their job too. There is no right to a job.

This is the conundrum such laws have created. The Constitution didn't create this problem. You progs did.
There are worker rights.

If by "prog," you mean people that understand we don't live in the 1800s, yes you are correct.
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Old 03-25-2013, 05:42 PM   #183
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Originally Posted by RNR View Post
No because the employee did not perform the task in his or her job description. He or she does not set policy for Disney. They agreed to follow the policy when accepting the job~
And when you open a public accommodation business, you agree to abide by the law which is what this photography group did, and the law says you cannot discriminate due to sexual orientation.
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Old 03-25-2013, 05:43 PM   #184
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Originally Posted by KChiefer View Post
There are worker rights.
Which are also not fundamental natural rights but positivist rights.

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If by "prog," you mean people that understand we don't live in the 1800s, yes you are correct.
No progs, who grow state power in a fascist manner because they ignore a fundamental right to private contract and property. These things were still protected even in the 19th century and early 20th before the intellectuals changed from those of the Enlightenment to those steeped in Marx.
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Old 03-25-2013, 05:47 PM   #185
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Originally Posted by KChiefer View Post
And when you open a public accommodation business, you agree to abide by the law which is what this photography group did, and the law says you cannot discriminate due to sexual orientation.
Yet, the Supreme Law, trumps your positivist laws and it protects religion and free speech. I don't see any worker's rights in the Constition's Bill of Rights. That idea came from Marx.

BTW what laws protect sexual orientation? By that I mean nationally, as you seem to imply.
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Old 03-25-2013, 05:51 PM   #186
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Originally Posted by KChiefer View Post
And when you open a public accommodation business, you agree to abide by the law which is what this photography group did, and the law says you cannot discriminate due to sexual orientation.
See posts 116 and 126 as to how I feel about the issue. I do not disagree that refusing service to someone for color,if they are gay or pray to a different invisible man. I do think the government should stay the **** out of private businesses and our private life. If you receive funding from them they have the right to stick their nose in, otherwise the can **** clear off~
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Old 03-25-2013, 06:00 PM   #187
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Originally Posted by RNR View Post
See posts 116 and 126 as to how I feel about the issue. I do not disagree that refusing service to someone for color,if they are gay or pray to a different invisible man. I do think the government should stay the **** out of private businesses and our private life. If you receive funding from them they have the right to stick their nose in, otherwise the can **** clear off~
I agree with this too. But often, most of that money is not valid either. It's a means of control.
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Old 03-25-2013, 06:01 PM   #188
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Originally Posted by Brock View Post
I want the right to refuse service to any person for any reason.
wellll as long as you are not open to the public, find and dandy.

You server the public, the SCOTUS says the constitution dictates that you can't discriminate based on race, creed or religion. It's clear that America feels that discrimination of gay's just because their gay is wrong. I think the constitution and the SCOTUS interpretation will say the same. The tide of history has decided. Done deal. Print em.
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If it's effective, who are you, me, or anybody else to call it abuse? I worked with a guy back in Moberly who would shove a finger up his son's ass each time he had anything worse than a C on his report card. If he came home with 2 D's and an F, that's 3 fingers (and this was a big dude). Does that sound hideous and disgusting? Absolutely. Did the kid ever get anything worse than a C after this rule was implemented? Not a chance.

I'm not saying it's morally right or wrong, but does it make the child because of it? Think about that for a second.
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Old 03-25-2013, 06:02 PM   #189
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
BTW what laws protect sexual orientation? By that I mean nationally, as you seem to imply.
There isn't...yet. But they're protected in New Mexico. Deal with it.
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Old 03-25-2013, 06:04 PM   #190
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Originally Posted by KChiefer View Post
There isn't...yet. But they're protected in New Mexico. Deal with it.
I gave my position on this. Deal with it.
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Old 03-25-2013, 06:06 PM   #191
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Originally Posted by BigRedChief View Post
wellll as long as you are not open to the public, find and dandy.

You server the public, the SCOTUS says the constitution dictates that you can't discriminate based on race, creed or religion. It's clear that America feels that discrimination of gay's just because their gay is wrong. I think the constitution and the SCOTUS interpretation will say the same. The tide of history has decided. Done deal. Print em.
You do not speak for America. Not everyone agrees and most don't even understand the Constitution or have ever read it. They respond with their gut on issues like this.

As for "public" the definition of that has spread too far.
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Old 03-25-2013, 06:08 PM   #192
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Originally Posted by BigRedChief View Post
wellll as long as you are not open to the public, find and dandy.

You server the public, the SCOTUS says the constitution dictates that you can't discriminate based on race, creed or religion. It's clear that America feels that discrimination of gay's just because their gay is wrong. I think the constitution and the SCOTUS interpretation will say the same. The tide of history has decided. Done deal. Print em.
This is stupid because I can simply say I refused service because they had bad breath. I am just saying I shouldn'thave to lie to avoid a lawsuit because I choose not to do business with _______________.
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Old 03-25-2013, 06:11 PM   #193
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
You do not speak for America. Not everyone agrees and most don't even understand the Constitution or have ever read it. They respond with their gut on issues like this.
I understand the principle of its my business, I get to do whatever the **** I want. I get to decide who I do business with and who I tell to GTFO. I understand that idea and that "gut feeling" that this is mine and **** you and your rules.

However, I don't want my country to sign off on racism. That anyone can say to a public customer or put up a sign saying GTOFO n-word. And the bottom line is that most Americans and the SCOTUS agree that ensuring the minority's constitutional right strump your right to run your business as you see fit.
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Originally Posted by Bufkin View Post
If it's effective, who are you, me, or anybody else to call it abuse? I worked with a guy back in Moberly who would shove a finger up his son's ass each time he had anything worse than a C on his report card. If he came home with 2 D's and an F, that's 3 fingers (and this was a big dude). Does that sound hideous and disgusting? Absolutely. Did the kid ever get anything worse than a C after this rule was implemented? Not a chance.

I'm not saying it's morally right or wrong, but does it make the child because of it? Think about that for a second.
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Old 03-25-2013, 06:13 PM   #194
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Originally Posted by Brock View Post
This is stupid because I can simply say I refused service because they had bad breath. I am just saying I shouldn'thave to lie to avoid a lawsuit because I choose not to do business with _______________.
And that would be perfectly legit and legal, But, if its found out that only black people have "bad breath" and are refused service, thats the line thats crossed.
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Originally Posted by Bufkin View Post
If it's effective, who are you, me, or anybody else to call it abuse? I worked with a guy back in Moberly who would shove a finger up his son's ass each time he had anything worse than a C on his report card. If he came home with 2 D's and an F, that's 3 fingers (and this was a big dude). Does that sound hideous and disgusting? Absolutely. Did the kid ever get anything worse than a C after this rule was implemented? Not a chance.

I'm not saying it's morally right or wrong, but does it make the child because of it? Think about that for a second.
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Old 03-25-2013, 06:16 PM   #195
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Originally Posted by BigRedChief View Post
I understand the principle of its my business, I get to do whatever the **** I want. I get to decide who I do business with and who I tell to GTFO. I understand that idea and that "gut feeling" that this is mine and **** you and your rules.
What's with all the swearing?

Quote:
However, I don't want my country to sign off on racism. That anyone can say to a public customer or put up a sign saying GTOFO n-word. And the bottom line is that most Americans and the SCOTUS agree that ensuring the minority's constitutional right strump your right to run your business as you see fit.
Here's where you misunderstand this issue—at least from the limited govt pov that many on the right have. Signs used to be put up as shown below before. How did it end? It ended by the market when the same businesses couldn't find enough people for labor. Somehow, without the federal govt's interference the practice of discriminating against the Irish for jobs ended. The market is powerful because it punishes such businesses. This has nothing to do with your "country" signing off on racism. As for the south, regarding lunch counters, it was state govts that made those rules when there were private businesses who wanted to integrate. You read too much PC history.


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