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Old 01-25-2013, 05:27 PM  
BigRedChief BigRedChief is offline
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***OFFICIAL*** 2013 STL Cardinals Thread

From Bernie's column:

People have asked me why weíre not more emotional,Ē Matheny said in his office after Sundayís game. ďThey say that we look subdued, always intense. That our actions are methodical, robotic at times. Thatís what got us here. This isnít the time to change it.Ē

Itís hard to argue with the managerís assessment. The Cardinals finished with 97 victories, most by a Cards team since 2005, and tied with Boston for No. 1 in the majors this year.


Their 54-27 showing at Busch Stadium matches the 1985 team for the best single-season home winning percentage (.667) by the Cardinals since 1944.

A postseason theme has emerged, and it echoes the mantra that surfaced before the start of 2013: remember the fall of 2012. Remember falling to San Francisco in the NLCS.


The Cardinalsí veterans still havenít forgotten. They still arenít over it. Itís why Matheny resists GM John Mozeliakís urgings to smile and put on a happier face.


Here's the most impressive aspect of the Cardinals' division championship: they prevailed over two other outstanding teams, Pittsburgh and Cincinnati.



The 97-win Cardinals were better this year (regular season) than they were in 2011, when they won 90 games, and 2012, when they won 88.
Here are a few numbers that help put the Cardinals' Central title and No. 1 NL seed in perspective:



* Since MLB switched to a three-division format in each league in 1994, this was only the sixth time that a division had three 90-plus win teams. St. Louis won 97, Pittsburgh 94, and Cincinnati 90.
* Since the format change, this was only the second time that an NL division had three 90-win teams. In 2002 the NL West had Arizona (98 wins), San Francisco (95) and Los Angeles (92).
* The 2013 Cardinals faced more esteemed and difficult competition at the top of the division than any of the division-winning teams managed by Tony La Russa.

The Pirates were hardly pushovers; the Cardinals had to work like mad and kick in with a strong finish to put the division away, and didn't clinch until Game No. 160.



The Cardinals went 9-10 against Pittsburgh this season and were 11-8 vs. Cincinnati.


The Cardinals won only three of 10 games at PNC Park in Pittsburgh and split the 10 games at Cincinnati. The Cardinals were 6-3 against both teams at Busch Stadium.


The Cardinals (1st), Pirates (3rd) and Reds (5th) ranked among the top five in wins in the NL. The three teams were among the top 11 in wins in MLB. All three teams finished in the top five in the majors for best overall ERA, and each were in the top five MLB for best starting-pitching ERA.


The original purpose to this piece was to point out that the Cardinals managed to finish with the league's best record while competing in a division that had three 90-win teams for only the second time in the last 19 years of National League baseball.



The Cardinals really earned this.
Thanks for reading ...
ó Bernie

Last edited by BigRedChief; 10-02-2013 at 09:16 PM..
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Old 03-26-2013, 06:59 PM   #211
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It's certainly debatable, but Adams can only play 1 position; at least Taveras can play all 3 outfield positions.
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Old 03-26-2013, 07:15 PM   #212
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If they start Taveras this year its highly likely they are going to trade him. No way they give up a year of control for a couple of months of baseball.
It doesn't mean they'll trade him. It could mean that they'll eventually work out deals similar to the ones that guys like Pedroia and Youkilis signed shortly after establishing themselves as good, young ballplayers. If you lock a player up early enough (like we did with Waino and Yadi some time ago before their recent expiration) you'll pay more in the initial years while saving significantly down the road, likely keeping them away from FA for at least two years.
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Old 03-26-2013, 07:45 PM   #213
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It doesn't mean they'll trade him. It could mean that they'll eventually work out deals similar to the ones that guys like Pedroia and Youkilis signed shortly after establishing themselves as good, young ballplayers. If you lock a player up early enough (like we did with Waino and Yadi some time ago before their recent expiration) you'll pay more in the initial years while saving significantly down the road, likely keeping them away from FA for at least two years.
Most of those deals you only get one year maybe two past the years the team controls their movements.

If Taveras is as advertised, in 6 years he will want a Pujols sized contract. and the Cardinals will not be in any better financial situation to give him $250-$300 million.
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Old 03-26-2013, 08:14 PM   #214
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Most of those deals you only get one year maybe two past the years the team controls their movements.

If Taveras is as advertised, in 6 years he will want a Pujols sized contract. and the Cardinals will not be in any better financial situation to give him $250-$300 million.
Which is why you try to extend him at the end of year two, thus buying up his age 28-30 years at a discount, and then let some rube like Artie Moreno overpay for his decline years.
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Old 03-26-2013, 09:18 PM   #215
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Fox Sports gives the love to the Cardinals
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/s...aseball-032613

a interesting part of the article
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
For us, we have so many players that have come up together. And not only did they come up together, but they experienced success along the way. When they got to the big leagues, they expected that.”

It’s true. When I asked Craig about this phenomenon one day this spring, he suggested Game 6 of the 2011 World Series — one of the best games in any of our lifetimes — had some roots in a postseason event that probably wasn’t on your radar: the 2009 Pacific Coast League finals between the Memphis Redbirds and Sacramento River Cats.


The Redbirds’ lineup in that series included three players — Jay, Craig and Freese, a 2007 trade acquisition — who have become essential everyday players in St. Louis. Descalso and Boggs had significant roles on the team, too. And the Game 1 pitcher against Sacramento was Jaime Garcia, who started twice in the World Series for La Russa two years later. “We were the youngest team in the league — by far,” Jay recalled. “We all started off slow. Then we figured it out.”

Naturally, Memphis swept Sacramento in three.

“We were stacked,” Craig said. “That’s one thing we took pride in, winning that league championship in 2009. Then in the World Series, you look and I was in left, Jay was in center, and Daniel was at third for the final out. Freeser was in the game, too, and obviously did what he did. That’s one of the things that made the World Series extra special.


“We all had a common goal, to get to the big leagues. It wasn’t like we were trying to fight each other to get there. We just came up together as a group. We’d talk about it. We didn’t get presumptuous, but it was always like, ‘When we get to the big leagues, we want to do great things. We want to win.’ We always just fought for that opportunity and talked through things. We’ve gone a long way as a collective group.”


Notice the number of times the word “we” appeared in that quotation. It’s the sort of thing a high school or college coach would love. It also works. Whether the Cardinals’ players have great makeup (scouting term) or understand the process (nerdy jargon), the idea is the same: They get it. And the winning ethic of the Cardinals’ homegrown core — with a major assist from Carlos Beltran — explains how they were able to lose La Russa and Albert Pujols after winning the 2011 World Series and finish with close to the same record last year.


Craig believes the cohesion created in Memphis — and the minor-league stops before — “absolutely” has influenced the way the present-day Cardinals respond to October pressure. Jay sensed the same connectedness in the dugout before the ninth inning of the decisive Game 5 in Washington last year. The Nationals led, 7-5, before the tying and winning singles by Descalso and Kozma, respectively — each with two out.
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Old 03-27-2013, 05:43 PM   #216
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5 years, $97.5 million for Wainwright.

Jesus. Think we may have overpaid.
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Old 03-27-2013, 05:58 PM   #217
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5 years, $97.5 million for Wainwright.

Jesus. Think we may have overpaid.
Certainly did.

That said, I think they're leaning on cost-controlled excellence from Miller, Rosenthal, Wacha and Martinez to weather the last couple of years of WWs and Molina's contracts.

This isn't a smart economic deal at all, IMO. He needs to prove he's back to 2010 form before he's worth that, but we gave him the deal just assuming that he will.

I don't like it. At the same time, I do like the idea of my favorite current Cardinal being a cardinal for life.
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Old 03-27-2013, 06:03 PM   #218
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5 years, $97.5 million for Wainwright.

Jesus. Think we may have overpaid.
If you want to live up to the first part of your user name and extract every drop of financial value out of every transaction, you can certainly make that case.

Nevertheless, I don't believe that it's anathema to slightly overpay your guys who have been good soldiers, dependable players and great teammates. If anything, I think it sets a good example for the rest of the locker room, and it's an entirely different notion than dropping the same bank for a player as a FA.

Ironically enough, despite my hate for Pioli and all things Patriot, there is some merit to the idea of a winning culture. Where Pioli got it wrong was in the assumption that old brokedicks, locker room snitches, and Gestapo tactics is what made it. It's not. It comes from having guys like Tom Brady, Chris Carpenter, and Adam Wainwright.

Look at what the latter two did for our young pitchers this offseason. There's real value in that that can never be measured on a Fangraphs page of what the player would receive in a FA market where everyone is overpaid as a consequence of the market's inherent irrationality.
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Old 03-27-2013, 06:47 PM   #219
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If you want to live up to the first part of your user name and extract every drop of financial value out of every transaction, you can certainly make that case.
What the **** was that for?

And I do understand the skepticism on the deal as Wainwright will be 33 in 2014. How many 33 year old pitchers are worth that today?
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HOLY MOTHER OF **** THIS NEVAR HAPPENS TO US!! HOW THE **** DID WE WIN THIS? I'M SIGGING MYSELF UP FOR THIS ONE.
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Old 03-27-2013, 07:52 PM   #220
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If you want to live up to the first part of your user name and extract every drop of financial value out of every transaction, you can certainly make that case.
Dude, come on man.
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Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins View Post
Look at what the latter two did for our young pitchers this offseason. There's real value in that that can never be measured on a Fangraphs page of what the player would receive in a FA market where everyone is overpaid as a consequence of the market's inherent irrationality.
I'm okay with the contract because he brings that intangible that doesn't show up in any box score. He is a die hard Cardinal. Talks constantly about the way that Cardinal pitchers behave, work out, help each other etc. He walked the walk. After Miller spent the weekend with him last year, he turned over a new leaf and now he is prospering again.

These young pitching studs need a great example of how to pitch at the major league level. How to train to stay at the big league level. How to maintain that fire to win.

When I went to the Atlanta playoff game last year, Waino was all over the practice field and during batting practice talking, joking with players and small groups. They all seem to listen and joke around with him. It was as obvious as it could be that he was viewed with respect by his teammates.

Waino is a leader that everyone respects. I'm damn glad I don't have to see another one of my favorite players in another uniform. That curveball to Beltran, I got to see him win a World Series for my team in person. Damn glad he is a Cardinal for life.
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Old 03-27-2013, 08:37 PM   #221
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Dude, come on man.
I
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What the **** was that for?

And I do understand the skepticism on the deal as Wainwright will be 33 in 2014. How many 33 year old pitchers are worth that today?
It was an intentionally off-color, tongue-in-cheek joke. JR isn't a rabbi.
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Old 03-27-2013, 08:43 PM   #222
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It was an intentionally off-color, tongue-in-cheek joke. JR isn't a rabbi.
Nor Jewish. Surprisingly (to most) two of my favorite posters on this site are Frazod and Hamas.

No offense taken from me.
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Old 03-27-2013, 08:45 PM   #223
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I was 99.5% sure you weren't Jewish either. I always thought you were Mr. Plow.
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Old 03-27-2013, 08:47 PM   #224
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I was 99.5% sure you weren't Jewish either. I always thought you were Mr. Plow.
That was my old Gamertag that I used to have in my sig, name was already taken here.
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Old 03-27-2013, 08:49 PM   #225
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So... if Motte is out an extended amount of time, do you guys think Rosenthal is eventually given the closer's role? I know Boggs has had some success, but he doesn't seem like the slam-dunk guy Rosenthal could be.
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