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Old 01-25-2013, 04:27 PM  
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***OFFICIAL*** 2013 STL Cardinals Thread

From Bernie's column:

People have asked me why weíre not more emotional,Ē Matheny said in his office after Sundayís game. ďThey say that we look subdued, always intense. That our actions are methodical, robotic at times. Thatís what got us here. This isnít the time to change it.Ē

Itís hard to argue with the managerís assessment. The Cardinals finished with 97 victories, most by a Cards team since 2005, and tied with Boston for No. 1 in the majors this year.


Their 54-27 showing at Busch Stadium matches the 1985 team for the best single-season home winning percentage (.667) by the Cardinals since 1944.

A postseason theme has emerged, and it echoes the mantra that surfaced before the start of 2013: remember the fall of 2012. Remember falling to San Francisco in the NLCS.


The Cardinalsí veterans still havenít forgotten. They still arenít over it. Itís why Matheny resists GM John Mozeliakís urgings to smile and put on a happier face.


Here's the most impressive aspect of the Cardinals' division championship: they prevailed over two other outstanding teams, Pittsburgh and Cincinnati.



The 97-win Cardinals were better this year (regular season) than they were in 2011, when they won 90 games, and 2012, when they won 88.
Here are a few numbers that help put the Cardinals' Central title and No. 1 NL seed in perspective:



* Since MLB switched to a three-division format in each league in 1994, this was only the sixth time that a division had three 90-plus win teams. St. Louis won 97, Pittsburgh 94, and Cincinnati 90.
* Since the format change, this was only the second time that an NL division had three 90-win teams. In 2002 the NL West had Arizona (98 wins), San Francisco (95) and Los Angeles (92).
* The 2013 Cardinals faced more esteemed and difficult competition at the top of the division than any of the division-winning teams managed by Tony La Russa.

The Pirates were hardly pushovers; the Cardinals had to work like mad and kick in with a strong finish to put the division away, and didn't clinch until Game No. 160.



The Cardinals went 9-10 against Pittsburgh this season and were 11-8 vs. Cincinnati.


The Cardinals won only three of 10 games at PNC Park in Pittsburgh and split the 10 games at Cincinnati. The Cardinals were 6-3 against both teams at Busch Stadium.


The Cardinals (1st), Pirates (3rd) and Reds (5th) ranked among the top five in wins in the NL. The three teams were among the top 11 in wins in MLB. All three teams finished in the top five in the majors for best overall ERA, and each were in the top five MLB for best starting-pitching ERA.


The original purpose to this piece was to point out that the Cardinals managed to finish with the league's best record while competing in a division that had three 90-win teams for only the second time in the last 19 years of National League baseball.



The Cardinals really earned this.
Thanks for reading ...
ó Bernie

Last edited by BigRedChief; 10-02-2013 at 08:16 PM..
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Old 06-14-2013, 09:42 PM   #2011
'Hamas' Jenkins 'Hamas' Jenkins is offline
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Well, it was Cuzzi none the less, IIRC, he threw Edmonds out in the 05 NLCS, so we don't exactly jive.
And he was the one who blew the call at first against the Reds on Saturday. This isn't a one time occurrence.

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Old 06-14-2013, 09:46 PM   #2012
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It's likely that a few of these young pitchers won't stick, so knowing that, I wouldn't be terribly upset to move a few if it would allow us to longterm upgrade the SS position or add a LH'd starter.
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Old 06-14-2013, 09:46 PM   #2013
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Thats what I'm thinking about Garcia as well. IMO, shoulder has become a bigger problem than elbow these days anyway.

Gonzalez and/or Kaminski won't likely be with the big club by next year, we need a lefty in there somewhere. It wouldn't be a bad idea to have a lefty be your innings eater.
Wandy Rodriguez will likely be bought out by the Pirates. Can't see them paying him $13 million. He's generally been a 200 IP horse (currently on the DL w/ forearm issue, though).

Kaminski is a HS arm. He won't be with the team until 2018. Gonzalez is the Wacha of this draft--the most ML ready/most likely to be a fast riser.
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Old 06-14-2013, 09:49 PM   #2014
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Wandy Rodriguez will likely be bought out by the Pirates. Can't see them paying him $13 million. He's generally been a 200 IP horse (currently on the DL w/ forearm issue, though).

Kaminski is a HS arm. He won't be with the team until 2018. Gonzalez is the Wacha of this draft--the most ML ready/most likely to be a fast riser.
If we could do it without giving up a power arm, Jason Vargas might be an option if the Halo's keep ass sucking.
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Old 06-14-2013, 09:54 PM   #2015
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If you believe Carpenter is your 2nd baseman of the future, what do you do with Wong? Or do you eventually transition Carpenter to 3rd when Freese departs, which is gonna happen IMO, and just move Wong up>
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Old 06-14-2013, 09:57 PM   #2016
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Carpenter's bat doesn't profile at 3rd. You can ride this decision out for another season before you really have to commit.
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Old 06-14-2013, 09:58 PM   #2017
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I'm guessing they view Siegrist as a pen guy, which is great with me, but it would be nice to have his stuff as a starter.
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Old 06-14-2013, 10:08 PM   #2018
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I'm guessing they view Siegrist as a pen guy, which is great with me, but it would be nice to have his stuff as a starter.
He's done both, but he's only started five games at AA. All the others were in A ball. You can stretch him out over the offseason to see if he could fill that gap, too, but he'd need to work on his change.
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Old 06-14-2013, 10:11 PM   #2019
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He's done both, but he's only started five games at AA. All the others were in A ball. You can stretch him out over the offseason to see if he could fill that gap, too, but he'd need to work on his change.
While I know starters are more valuable than BP guys, sometimes, you gotta do what you gotta do.

He looks like a Taylor made bullpen power lefty. And those, don't seem to easy to find.
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Old 06-14-2013, 10:23 PM   #2020
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Yeah. He's a revelation.

I still think the following guys should compete for the rotation spots next year.

Wacha, Rosenthal, Martinez.

To be honest, it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world to use a modified six man rotation.

You need 12 months of pitching from spots four and five. You could stagger them in such a way that each only handles about four months of a SP load, thus keeping them rested for potential starts in the PS .

Like this:

Wacha pitches April-July, then gets sent down to Memphis and shut down for about four weeks. Then you can slowly build him back up once rosters expand.

Rosenthal breaks camp as the long guy. After pitching in that role for about six weeks you transition him into the rotation, where he can hold that spot down for the remainder of the year.

Martinez starts the in St. Louis then goes down once Rosenthal takes over. You can keep his outings shorter in AAA. Once Wacha gets rest call him back up to take over.

And, should anyone need a DL spot/break, you have guys who can get called up/transition easily to fill it.
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Old 06-14-2013, 10:23 PM   #2021
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Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins View Post
Wandy Rodriguez will likely be bought out by the Pirates. Can't see them paying him $13 million. He's generally been a 200 IP horse (currently on the DL w/ forearm issue, though).

Kaminski is a HS arm. He won't be with the team until 2018. Gonzalez is the Wacha of this draft--the most ML ready/most likely to be a fast riser.
We have too many starters or projected starters and need bullpen help.

Who gets to pitch in the pen or traded for bullpen help?
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WHAT DID I SAY, HUH?!?!?! TELL ME AGAIN?!?! - WHO HAD FAITH IN YOUR TEAM?!?!? WHAT'S MY MOTHER****IN NAME!?!?!
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Old 06-14-2013, 10:26 PM   #2022
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We have too many starters or projected starters and need bullpen help.

Who gets to pitch in the pen or traded for bullpen help?
Not Carlos Martinez.
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Old 06-14-2013, 10:31 PM   #2023
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Not Carlos Martinez.
welllll that narrows it down.We only have 8 more to trade or throw to the pen.

I'll go next. Miller stays where he is.
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Old 06-14-2013, 10:49 PM   #2024
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Well, I've never been a fan of Jenkins. His results have never matched the hype, and now he's on the DL w/ shoulder soreness. I'd be fine with trading him.

I really don't want us to trade Rosenthal or Martinez. Wacha seems like he'll eventually be a solid #3 who can gobble innings, and that's a valuable commodity as well.

I think the organization would be well served to try and find Freese's replacement in the draft. If they want to try and package some of our pitching for a shortstop, great, but I don't see any long-term solutions that aren't major risks.
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Old 06-14-2013, 10:57 PM   #2025
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The Cards have already moved Carson Kelly to 3b and they seem to really like Patrick Wisdom.

Moving Carpenter back to 3b when he's proven average to slightly above defensively at 2b would be foolish. He's been one of the few players you'll ever see to actually make the shift up the defensive spectrum and somehow not take a step backwards.

As far as I'm concerned, Matt Carpenter is a 2b.

Adams and Wong for Tulowitzki? !@#$ing done. The Rox don't have a 2b to speak of and Helton's on the way out. I'd probably include an arm as well if they needed it.

Pick up Tulo and suddenly you have the 3-hole hitter that we need and possibly the premier defensive SS in MLB. Absolute worst case scenario is that he moves to 3b in 3 years to replace Freese when he departs.
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