Something that disturbed me greatly tonight

[keg in kc]

My fiance and I were driving around tonight looking at potential homes to buy, as we've (or actually, more accurately, she's) just been approved for a mortgage. Some of the homes were in KC, and since neither of us are that familiar with the actual city itself, we weren't too successful at finding where we needed to be. Eventually, we found ourselves on Prospect Avenue. It was not a part of Kansas City I'd ever really seen before, and she had not either. We had both heard rumors, but nothing prepared us for what was really there. It was ugly and I literally felt an air of anger and a sense of violence in the air. There were spray painted messages (stenciled, by the way, and not grafitti) with things like "die pigs" and "black power" periodically. Seriously, I'm not kidding. There were a number of people "congregating" on the street corners, and the entire area looked run-down and delapidated. For lack of a better word, we'd stumbled across KC's ghetto.

Now, just to clarify some things about myself and my fiance, I am, as you may or may not know, a white male, 27 years of age from a small town in West Virginia. My fiance, Tracy, is a black female, 24, from the Washington D.C. metropolitan area. We were both greatly disturbed by what we saw, and were extremely uncomfortable. The question we both asked was "why the hell is there a place like this here?"

That's the question that keeps reverberating through my mind tonight. Why? Why in this country with weath and supposed goodness are there Prospect Avenues? What is it that makes this happen and what can we do to fix it?

Now I'm not naive, I've seen a good bit of the world and I've frequented cities across the country, from NYC to Boston to DC to Miami to LA and San Francisco, and there are places like this in every one. Again, why?

And why do we just accept it?

I'm not talking about welfare, here, and I'm not talking about social services. I'm no so-called liberal that people say wants to throw around hard-earned tax dollars, but my god, something has to be done. Why do these places exist?

I guess I don't have much else to say. I wanted to get this out why I still [i]felt[/i] it and I don't want to cheapen it by making some grand, evangelical diatribe about loving your fellow man, and I don't want to sit down and write some long drawn out treatice. This pissed me off tonight and that's my raw feelings on it. It's wrong that a beautiful city like Kansas City has to have a deep, dark hidden place. Somehow we've got to do better. I just don't know how.

[Yosef_Malkovitch]

Bravo, Luz. Bravo!

This is America. Anyone who really wants to better themselves can. Before people go saying that I'm just some rich white kid whose parents put him through school, well, I'm not. I had to sacrifice and suffer to get through school, and when I graduate in August, I can look in the mirror and know that I WORKED for every bit of it, and nobody gave me a thing. The closest thing I got to people giving me money was the loans I took out. And those loans are available to anyone who cares to fill out the paperwork.

White or black, the help is out there if you want to get an education and better yourself. In fact, there's probably more help for blacks than for whites because of all the minority scholarships available.

Lbedrock1-- the tax codes are written for the rich?!? Is that why they pay 39%?!? lol that is the most absurd thing I've ever heard.

Our system of taxation is unfair, yes, but it's unfair to the poeple who are rich. Why should you punish me for becoming a success? Why should I pay more than my neighbor down the street who refuses to do anything with his paycheck other than spend it on beer?

And just so everyone knows, I made less than 10k last year. I'm not defending the rich because I'm one of them (although I hope to be someday) but because I think our society of victims has gone too far. "I don't make enough money because Joe Richdude down the street has taken it all." lol whatever.

[Mark M]

keg--
Prospect has been that way for a long time. Like Luz said, families have been in that neighborhood for a long time.

And I know what you're feeling. I lived just outside of Anacostia in D.C. when I was there. There I was, a 25 year-old skinny white kid from the midwest living in one of the largest, scariest neighborhoods in America. If your wife is from DC, I am sure she can let you know that the Southeast section is not a pleasant place ... I believe it has one of the largest murder rates in the country.

IMO, the problem lies in the people who live there. You don't need much money to pick up the trash, to put a coat of paint up or to just generally care about where you live. I live in Independence in a typical working class neighborhood. Some houses are very nice, but some (like the one right across the street from ours) have old TVs, ACs and other trash sitting on the side of their house. The guy behind us has anywhere from 2-4 "cars" (in quotes since they are more like lawn ornaments than modes of transport) along the fence line.

It just comes down to having pride in your surroundings ... and in most cities there are some neighborhoods that just have none. It can be brought back, but most people would rather move to the burbs than take the time and energy to revitalize an area that, in most cases, have a rich history. I find that very, very sad.

MM
~~Suggests Brookside or Waldo.

[Ugly Duck]

Here's a social offshoot of what Luz was saying....The Take Pride in Diversity campaign has had some interesting, yet disturbing repercussions. When the gansta rap genre went mainstream, the look and feel jumped to other subcultures. Now we have suburban white kids in baggy pants making signs with their hands as they speak. The language is often foul, and the cadence is decidedly gangsta. That isn't too bad, but there also seems to be a reverence for illiteracy, rejecting school, disdain for the mainstream. It may be cool, but the mannerisms that they are developing is going to make it tough to fit into the business world when its time to leave home. People expect mainstream speech and mannerisms in the workplace, not handwaving and chopped English. Its kinda like these children of the relatively affluent are voluntarily stepping down a notch in the business world. We hear a lot about assisting underpriveleged kids to acquire the skills and tools to join the mainstream, and now we see a set of priveleged kids voluntarily jumping ship.

[BIG_DADDY]

I think the reason for this is quite simple. We are a captalist society. A capitalist society is not designed to be "fair" in the sence that we are going to continue to try and level the playing field for everyone ( what would be the good of getting ahead then?) The rules are the same for everyone but peoples ability to play the game and take advantage of the rules is not. The more you try to make it "Fair" for everyone the further you get away from being a free society. Socialism and communism try in theory to make things fair for everyone and you can see your freedoms get thrown right out the window with it. They do not reward the ones who will go the extra yard and are willing to educate themselves, work hard and figure out how best to play the game. Capitalism rewards the performers in our society and they are the only ones in any form of goverment who can actually end up being FREE. I would not change it for anything. Unfortunately there is a downside to everything and our slums look the same as everyone elses. I also agree with the racecard being pulled on this issue as well. It is not a race issue but rather a performance issue.

[oleman47]

Capitalism is like monopoly. But are the citizens going to content with that winner?

[DiscoJones]

Keg - If you would like to see the other side of the coin, I would invite you (and anyone else who reads this) to take your fiance down to the neighborhood of 18th and Vine - the Jazz District. There you will find the Jazz Museum, Gem Theater and the Negro Leagues Baseball Hall of Fame along with other shops and retaraunts. You will see a very nice neighborhood that wasn't always that nice. In fact, the 18th and Vine neighborhood was VERY similar to neighborhoods along Prospect during the '80s. With a concerted effort by former Mayor Emmanuel Cleaver and countless others, the neighborhood has been rejuvenated and is now a jewel in the crown of Kansas City. Former Mayor Cleaver had a vision for this city, especially the run-down areas, that hopefully has not been lost to the current Mayor Kay Barnes. His plan included such simple things as building city parks and memorials along with adding lights along the roads.

Interestingly, here are some of the more notable board members and staff for the Negro Leagues Baseball Hall of Fame:

John "Buck" O'Neil - Chairman and all-around wonderful person (you may even be lucky enough to meet him if you visit the museum)
Ernie Banks
Colin Powell
Frank White, Jr. (A.K.A. Academy)
Danny Glover
Pellom McDaniels, III
Bob Kendrick

I mean no disrespect toward any of the other officers or staff and blatantly display my ingorance, so if you would like to see the full list, check out:

[url]http://www.nlbm.com/[/url]

Or, more specifically,

[url]http://www.nlbm.com/board.html[/url]


I stongly urge you to go to 18th and Vine. You will see that things can be improved; bad neigborhoods can be made better. Fortunately for Kansas City, some people saw the treasure that was buried beneath the dilapidated buildings and garbage.

I would also like to add that the people living in these areas are not always capable of improving the areas' appearances. Often times these neighborhoods don't have the higher property taxes that contribute to the broad, new roads and sidewalks that many nicer areas have, and thus their appearance is not as nice. Sure, you can say that people didn't vote for a higher tax, but when you're sacrificing food to pay your bills, a higher property tax is not high on the aganda. A good example of this kind of restructuring may be seen in the Waldo District. Prior to successful baby-boomers (of all races) moving to Waldo (because of it's downtown and Plaza proximity), the area was getting worse and worse. As property values declined, so did the conditions of everything in the neighborhood down to the roads themselves.

[BIG_DADDY]

47,

I disagree because all forms of goverment have their oligarchies. I don't think you can blame capitalism for that. The question is what happens to everyone else. If you don't have a system that encourages and rewards competition then all of the truely intelligent people will migrate their intellectual properties and production to countries that are more business freindly. You want to talk about having a national disaster. We are already beginning to see some of that. That is why is not as simple as the rich don't need a tax breaks as some would have you believe.

[Archie F. Swin]

Luz,

In response to #12

I may be senselessly editing your post to see the potential evil within, but I interpret it as saying Malcom Little and Louis Farakahn didn't/don't present themselves as well educated, well spoken, presentable leaders and that they glorify the hood and thier platforms were rooted in anti-success

throw me a bone mister!

[Edited by Chief Red Pants on 02-21-2001 at 03:04 PM]

[keg in kc]

Thanks everyone for your input and candor.

Now some thoughts and clarification on my part...

First of all, I have seen much worse than Prospect. I'm not naive to poverty nor do I think it's limited to black neighborhoods. Remember first that I'm from West Virginia, where the slow death of the coal industry has left a number of economically devastated areas. I've seen people living in particle-board shanties with no electricity and no water. I've seen entire coal towns that are now nothing but ghost towns. I've seen a lot of things that I'd imagine many of you have not, and I've known some of the people who lived there. Prospect shocked me because I didn't expect to see it. That's the sole reason. It's almost hidden, something that you just don't talk about in KC, and that's what angers me.

And for those of you considering this to be a racial issue, well, I'm quite familiar with white families on welfare. Let me share some of my experiences with you. Families who say they can't feed or clothe their kids, but somehow manage to consolodate their government checks into funds for leasing a new truck every two years. Families who shop at the goodwill for shoes, but always have a fully stocked gun cabinet with top of the line weapons and ammo. The saddest part is that more than half the time, the kids have just followed in the footsteps of the parents. Kids I grew up with now have families of 6 and 7 with shiny new toys in the driveway, but their toddlers run around ratty, tattered clothes.

Don't try to tell me I'm a "babe in the things of the world."

I've spent a good amount of time in New York, Boston and D.C. too. I know the urban world. I've seen the homeless on the streets and on the subways. I've smelled the stench of piss in the air on Times Square. I've even been mugged. Twice. And the second time it was a drunk and/or stoned guy trying to hold me up with a banana. I kid you not. I've seen the folks pushing the grocery carts around and people sleeping on park benches using newspapers for blankets. I've seen a lot, believe me.

You can believe "there are no victims, only volunteers" if it makes you sleep better at night, I guess. The fact is, however, everyone [b]can't[/b] be anything they want in this great plutocracy of ours. People think it's a matter of racism or performance and don't realize the real dividing line is class. That's the problem as I see it. It's the old addage of the "haves" and the "have nots." You can talk all you want about how people can work and have their dream, but honestly, how many people do you know have made the jump from the bottom rung of the lower class to the upper crust of society? I sure can't think of many, and I know people from all walks of life in all parts of the US, black, white, hispanic, asian, and otherwise. Don't try to tell me that, well, that's just because none of those people want to work hard enough to move up. Bullshit!! Upward mobility is a myth for 99% of the population.

And I think we do all have a responsibility, but probably not in the way you seem to imply I somehow inferred into my message. Fix welfare, first of all, and don't let it be a crutch any more. Second, find a way to weasel the common man back into the government. This country is no longer of the people, by the people and for the people. Career politicians have turned this into a farsical doppleganger of a democracy where the fat cats rule and the rest of us are kept just healthy enough not to care about it. Call it an oligarchy, call it a plutocracy, call it what you will, just don't try to tell me this is a democracy. Business interests run the United States now, and the needs of lobbyists clearly outweighs that of the mere constituents.

I know why there are places like Prospect. Greed really is a part of that. I'm greedy. You're greedy. We're all greedy. Hatred is a part of it too, and it's not just hatred from the inside, no matter what you may think. Fear is a big part, too, obviously - you can't really have hatred without fear. Economics is certainly a part. There's lots of reasons why Prospect is where it is, and rural West Virginia, and New York, too. Frankly, if I stop to think about it, none of those reasons are good enough.

You know, the saddest part is, I'm much more ambivalent about this now than I was just twelve hours ago. I suppose another day or two from now, the fire will completely fade and I'll go back to living my clean, safe, middle-class life and forget about what I saw. I really am part of the problem, I guess. Comes with that helpless feeling I get whenever I see something that I consider to be wrong.

[Luzap]

CRP,

I wasn't commenting on their personal presentation. I was commenting on their message.

The men you mention are articulate. Isn't it ironic that their message doesn't support the same behavior in others?

Luz
assimilation doesn't mean the abandondment of heritage...

[HC_Chief]

<i>Call it an oligarchy, call it a plutocracy, call it what you will, just don't try to tell me this is a democracy. </i> - common misconception: the United States of America is a Capitalist Republic - <i>not</i> a democracy.

[keg in kc]

Just turning a phrase, HC, I know it's a republic. That's not the point, however.

[Luzap]

keg,

I guess you and I just disagree on some fundimental issues.

I would love to have a conversation with you about class because that is another issue that is not pc to discuss in this country (and I agree with you that it plays a major role in our discussion today). I have spent much time in South America and other third world areas and have definite opinions on the subject.

There is one thing you said, however, that I take definte issue with:
"how many people do you know have made the jump from the bottom rung of the lower class to the upper crust of society?"

The answer is...

More than in any other nation in the history of our planet.

Luz
there are really quite a few and yes, it is possible...

[keg in kc]

I will agree, conservatively, with "More than in any other nation in the history of our planet."

My question in return is, "Is that good enough?"

[HC_Chief]

Kyle: I figured as much - however, I did want to point out a lot of people do believe this country to be something it is not: a 'true' democracy. As a free-market, 'representative democracy' i.e., Republic, those who ambitiously pursue their goals - within the parameters of 'acceptable behavior' - tend to be most successful. 'Acceptable behavior' is determined by society as a whole - enforced by laws in many instances, but mostly enforced by position in the work force.