McGwire Denied - Page 2

Eleazar · 01-09-2007, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Logical

I don't think you will find an MLB rule against them prior to a couple of years ago.

No. It was never tested for until 2002, but it was always illegal.

duncan_idaho · 01-09-2007, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Logical

I don't think you will find an MLB rule against them prior to a couple of years ago.

Not against steroids specifically, but MLB has long had a rule against using drugs deemed illegal by the federal government.

Steroids were outlawed under U.S. law long before their use became prevalent in baseball.

Stinger · 01-09-2007, 01:28 PM

The Baseball Writers Association is so full of themeselves. I wish there was another process of voting players into the Hall.

I am not saying MacGuire should get in but this whole selection process is idiotic. One writer, Paul Ladewski, puts in a blank ballot to insure that no current player will ever get in a unanimous since Babe Ruth or Ty Cobb didn't. His theory was since no one in the post modern era was never choosen on unanimous in the first ballot, that the modern players should not either. But he would probably vote to put them in on the second or third if they are still up for vote. (This is paraphrased from his interview on Mike and Mike in the Morning on ESPN Radio.)

The idea for the interview was brought from Mr. Ladewski's column below.
http://www.dailysouthtown.com/sports...81LAD2.article

01-09-2007, 01:31 PM

I think having an interstate named after you is much bigger than being in the HOF anyway.

Mecca · 01-09-2007, 01:31 PM

There are people in the HOF that did far worse things that roids......it's very hypocritical.

**BigRedChief** · 01-09-2007, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca

There are people in the HOF that did far worse things that roids......it's very hypocritical.

My point exactly.
At least say from this point on we are going to make moral judgments on your charecter along with your on the field accomplishments. But we are also not going to go back and use that moral judgment on the people already in. They get grandfathered in.

01-09-2007, 01:46 PM

I don't know where the line is drawn only that a line needs to be established so the Hall doesn't have 50 writers imposing their 50 different opinions on the voting process.

I don't care where the line is, only that one needs to be established.

Mecca · 01-09-2007, 01:47 PM

I basically think the roids thing shouldn't matter seeing as it's pretty much a common belief that all the players that are going to be considered for the HOF were doing them......

Also they weren't against baseballs rules, that's baseballs fault, it doesn't give a writer a job to go "oh well I think this is wrong" and then start policing things.

Frazod · 01-09-2007, 01:55 PM

I have no great love for McGwire, but I think he'll get into the Hall eventually. Even though they were roided to the gills, Mac and Sosa did a great deal for the game by restoring interest lost after the strike.

Unfortunately, Mac never really did much for the Cardinals. Sure he hit his dingers, but he damn sure wasn't clutch, and the Cards didn't do jack shit while he was in St. Louis. In fact, at the end, he was the biggest liability on the team and an absolute guaranteed out.

But even at his best, he couldn't hold Pujols' jock.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 01-09-2007, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frazod

I have no great love for McGwire, but I think he'll get into the Hall eventually. Even though they were roided to the gills, Mac and Sosa did a great deal for the game by restoring interest lost after the strike.

Unfortunately, Mac never really did much for the Cardinals. Sure he hit his dingers, but he damn sure wasn't clutch, and the Cards didn't do jack shit while he was in St. Louis. In fact, at the end, he was the biggest liability on the team and an absolute guaranteed out.

But even at his best, he couldn't hold Pujols' jock.

So, so true. Any cards fan will admit that they wanted him nowhere near the plate during the 2001 LDS against the Diamondbacks. He was horrendous.

Brock · 01-09-2007, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frazod

I have no great love for McGwire, but I think he'll get into the Hall eventually.

I doubt it. These writers have long memories.

**BigRedChief** · 01-09-2007, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frazod

I have no great love for McGwire, but I think he'll get into the Hall eventually. Even though they were roided to the gills, Mac and Sosa did a great deal for the game by restoring interest lost after the strike.

Unfortunately, Mac never really did much for the Cardinals. Sure he hit his dingers, but he damn sure wasn't clutch, and the Cards didn't do jack shit while he was in St. Louis. In fact, at the end, he was the biggest liability on the team and an absolute guaranteed out.

But even at his best, he couldn't hold Pujols' jock.

Yep, I don't think any Cardinal fans on here hold him in much high esteem. He hit homers but he just didn't help the team that much. And yes...........

even at his best, Mac couldn't hold Pujols' jock.

Logical · 01-09-2007, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Yep, I don't think any Cardinal fans on here hold him in much high esteem. He hit homers but he just didn't help the team that much. And yes...........

even at his best, Mac couldn't hold Pujols' jock.

Why would he want to hold another player's jock?

**BigRedChief** · 01-09-2007, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Logical

Why would he want to hold another player's jock?

He's from Orange County Calafornia. They swing both ways out there you know.

Eleazar · 01-09-2007, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frazod

Unfortunately, Mac never really did much for the Cardinals. Sure he hit his dingers, but he damn sure wasn't clutch, and the Cards didn't do jack shit while he was in St. Louis. In fact, at the end, he was the biggest liability on the team and an absolute guaranteed out.

But even at his best, he couldn't hold Pujols' jock.

Pujols is a complete player. 6, 8, 10 more years of this and he's first ballot. McGwire shouldn't make it even without the roid controversy.

McGwire/Sosa/Bonds symbolize the darkest era of any in the modern history of American sports. They should go down as pariahs for the credibility of the game.

I don't think we should let Bonds in on the basis that he "would have" gotten there anyway without the roids. If you let people in based on what they "would have" done, then there's no requirement for longevity anymore. A guy whose great career lasted 5 years and then was derailed by injury or something else could say, "well I would have had a great career if not for XYZ."

01-09-2007, 01:28 PM	#3
Stinger Bazinga Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Springfield, MO Casino cash: $2024507	The Baseball Writers Association is so full of themeselves. I wish there was another process of voting players into the Hall. I am not saying MacGuire should get in but this whole selection process is idiotic. One writer, Paul Ladewski, puts in a blank ballot to insure that no current player will ever get in a unanimous since Babe Ruth or Ty Cobb didn't. His theory was since no one in the post modern era was never choosen on unanimous in the first ballot, that the modern players should not either. But he would probably vote to put them in on the second or third if they are still up for vote. (This is paraphrased from his interview on Mike and Mike in the Morning on ESPN Radio.) The idea for the interview was brought from Mr. Ladewski's column below. http://www.dailysouthtown.com/sports...81LAD2.article __________________
Posts: 10,319

01-09-2007, 01:31 PM	#4
Phobia Guest Casino cash: $	I think having an interstate named after you is much bigger than being in the HOF anyway.
Posts: n/a

01-09-2007, 01:31 PM	#5
Mecca Hockey Town Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Kansas City, Missouri Casino cash: $-502950	There are people in the HOF that did far worse things that roids......it's very hypocritical.
Posts: 115,252

01-09-2007, 01:46 PM	#7
Phobia Guest Casino cash: $	I don't know where the line is drawn only that a line needs to be established so the Hall doesn't have 50 writers imposing their 50 different opinions on the voting process. I don't care where the line is, only that one needs to be established.
Posts: n/a

01-09-2007, 01:47 PM	#8
Mecca Hockey Town Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Kansas City, Missouri Casino cash: $-502950	I basically think the roids thing shouldn't matter seeing as it's pretty much a common belief that all the players that are going to be considered for the HOF were doing them...... Also they weren't against baseballs rules, that's baseballs fault, it doesn't give a writer a job to go "oh well I think this is wrong" and then start policing things.
Posts: 115,252

01-09-2007, 01:55 PM	#9
Frazod Did you hear what I said? Join Date: Aug 2000 Casino cash: $-566615	I have no great love for McGwire, but I think he'll get into the Hall eventually. Even though they were roided to the gills, Mac and Sosa did a great deal for the game by restoring interest lost after the strike. Unfortunately, Mac never really did much for the Cardinals. Sure he hit his dingers, but he damn sure wasn't clutch, and the Cards didn't do jack shit while he was in St. Louis. In fact, at the end, he was the biggest liability on the team and an absolute guaranteed out. But even at his best, he couldn't hold Pujols' jock.
Posts: 121,710