Cardinals ***Official 2015 STL Cardinals Thread III.*** - Page 58

**BigRedChief** · 05:00 PM

2011 World Series Championship
2012 NLCS. One win from another WS appearance.
2013 World Series. Two wins from another World Series Championship
2014 NLCS. Three wins from another WS appearance
2015 Central Division title. Won 100 games. Lost in the NLDS.

Made the postseason 11 times in the last 15 seasons.
Only 1 losing season since 2000.
Reached the World Series 4 times since 2004 and won as many championships (two) the past eight seasons as it did from 1965 to 2005.
Made the NLCS 9 times including the last 4 years 2011-2014
Three million attendance? Take it to the bank.
65 post season wins since 2004. 22+ wins more than any other team.

Pasta Little Brioni · 12-10-2015, 10:49 AM

Thanks DJ. Glad I wasn't the only one who noticed the empty numbers this guy put up. I knew it was bad, but wow...

DJ's left nut · 12-10-2015, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry

I can think of one game where Heyward's glove won the game for you guys. I was there in person to see that one.

I can think of two instances; the Cubs game where he pegged Rizzo at home to change the course of the inning and then a game where he made a sliding catch going towards the wall to save a couple of runs.

Then again, I think can think of 2 games where Bourjos' running from 3b won a game for us as well. And there's no doubt in my mind that our biggest problem last year was the complete lack of run production from the 3 and 4 spots in the order.

Justin Upton's bat at 4 would win as many games for us as Heywards glove in RF would.

Theo has pulled his Red Sox tricks - he's driven the price up on Heyward to a level far beyond what is sane. **** it - let him have him. The Cardinals are not in a position to play this game. They have to be smarter than other clubs, they can't just outspend them.

To this point, the Cubs can outspend the Cards AND they've been smarter. We're going to reap what we've sown over the last 5 years and there's just no avoiding that. Time to get a hell of a lot smarter and hope to get a little bit lucky.

O.city · 12-10-2015, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

I can think of two instances; the Cubs game where he pegged Rizzo at home to change the course of the inning and then a game where he made a sliding catch going towards the wall to save a couple of runs.

Then again, I think can think of 2 games where Bourjos' running from 3b won a game for us as well. And there's no doubt in my mind that our biggest problem last year was the complete lack of run production from the 3 and 4 spots in the order.

Justin Upton's bat at 4 would win as many games for us as Heywards glove in RF would.

Theo has pulled his Red Sox tricks - he's driven the price up on Heyward to a level far beyond what is sane. **** it - let him have him. The Cardinals are not in a position to play this game. They have to be smarter than other clubs, they can't just outspend them.

To this point, the Cubs can outspend the Cards AND they've been smarter. We're going to reap what we've sown over the last 5 years and there's just no avoiding that. Time to get a hell of a lot smarter and hope to get a little bit lucky.

If in fact the cardinals are going to sign heyward, they must beleive they have the ability to unlock some of what he was billed to he coming out.

With what we have in our coaching aystem, they probably dont, but that's what it says to me about their following him like this.

I'm not a fan of upton, I think he's a bit of a malcontent that's put up numbers on bad teams, but I'm not sure that's something that matters in baseball as much as other sports.

Ultimately, I don't really think heyward signing here is what makes or breaks the cards beating th cubs, like said here before, they're gonna have to have grichuk become a star in center and or Piscotty be adrian Gonzales lite at firSt base, or Holliday 2.0 in left with Chris davis at first.

**BigRedChief** · 12-10-2015, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Justin Upton's bat at 4 would win as many games for us as Heywards glove in RF would.

Or he will strike out at Reynolds levels and kill rallies.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Theo has pulled his Red Sox tricks - he's driven the price up on Heyward to a level far beyond what is sane. **** it - let him have him.

Baseball salaries are getting really stupid. It's not going to level out anytime soon. They are just going to keep going up. What are we supposed to do then? Just sit out this era? Whine and moan that we can't compete? We have $115 million more coming in that will allow us to maintain a top 10-12 payroll. Thats close enough to the top to allow us to remain competitive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Theo has pulled his Red Sox tricks - he's driven the price up on Heyward to a level far beyond what is sane. **** it - let him have him. The Cardinals are not in a position to play this game. They have to be smarter than other clubs, they can't just outspend them.

To this point, the Cubs can outspend the Cards AND they've been smarter. We're going to reap what we've sown over the last 5 years and there's just no avoiding that. Time to get a hell of a lot smarter and hope to get a little bit lucky.

Mo is one of the best GM's in baseball. You know this or should.

The Cubs have been drafting at the top of the draft for years. It's a helluva lot easier to get high upside picks there than at the bottom of the draft order where we usually pick.

jd1020 · 12-10-2015, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

Giants are apparently out on heyward, down to cubs and cards

Where are you hearing this? The last rumor I saw was that the Cubs and Cards are finalists, "among others."

At this point I have to wonder how interested the Cubs actually are. They were never thought to be in on Zobrist and the Castro trade seemingly came out of thin air. All of their moves have been kept quite but they are apparently loud and clear about Heyward.

DJ's left nut · 12-10-2015, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

Or he will strike out at Reynolds levels and kill rallies.
Baseball salaries are getting really stupid. It's not going to level out anytime soon. They are just going to keep going up. What are we supposed to do then? Just sit out this era? Whine and moan that we can't compete? We have $115 million more coming in that will allow us to maintain a top 10-12 payroll. Thats close enough to the top to allow us to remain competitive.
Mo is one of the best GM's in baseball. You know this or should.

The Cubs have been drafting at the top of the draft for years. It's a helluva lot easier to get high upside picks there than at the bottom of the draft order where we usually pick.

Signing Soler, trading for Arrieta, securing Maddon, trading for Russell, getting a good season and free draft pick out of Fowler, trading for Rizzo - NONE of that had to do with the Cubs draft position. None of it.

Cardinals fans are wanting to chalk the massive disparity in performance by the front offices to the fact that the Cubs were bad for so long, but at least 1/2 of the outstanding moves they made are moves that the Cardinals could have made. The Cardinals could also have made a more aggressive bid for Kang, Moncada or Tomas. They could have packaged guys like Ramsey and Kaminsky for an actual good baseball player instead of doling them out piecemeal for replacement level crap like Masterson and Moss.

Mozeliak has been pantsed by Theo over the last 3-5 years. He may be among the better GMs in baseball, but Theo's proving that he's substantially better.

jd1020 · 12-10-2015, 11:39 AM

At the end of the day Heyward probably ends up in Anaheim.

I think Heyward in Chicago would come down to a Castroesque deal with Soler but the pitchers they've inquired about in a deal for Soler (Miller/Salazar) haven't gone any where.

DJ's left nut · 12-10-2015, 11:46 AM

Salazar for Soler....Damn, that deal makes a frustrating amount of sense for both sides.

I like Salazar a ton and if he ends up in Chicago, they'll iron out the rough edges on that slider of his. His fastball/changeup combination is as good as there is in baseball, he just needs one more consistent weapon to be a borderline CY candidate, IMO.

The Cubs are spinning straw into gold with some regularity in their pitching staff. If they could get their hands on Salazar, he'd be a pretty obvious counter for Martinez. Suddenly the Cubs would have an edge at 1-5 in the rotation (though Garcia vs. Hammel at 4 I'd probably edge Cards when Garcia is healthy...he's just never healthy) and pretty much every spot on the diamond.

**The Franchise** · 12-10-2015, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city

Chapman to the dodgers. NL central fans rejoice.

Until you realize they now have Jensen and Chapman at the back of that pen.

Well that shit is officially dead now.

O.city · 12-10-2015, 12:59 PM

I'd be interested if we have enough to go get Todd Frazier s d if he could play an adequate first base.

Marco Polo · 12-10-2015, 01:29 PM

According to FOX Sports' Jon Morosi, the Angels are among the finalists for Jason Heyward.
This seems to be coming to a head, with the Cardinals and Cubs acting as the other serious parties currently diving for the finish line. Heyward is expected to make a decision by the end of the week, and perhaps as Thursday evening. The 26-year-old Gold Glove outfielder figures to land something close to $200 million over nine or 10 years. He slashed .293/.359/.439 with 13 home runs, 60 RBI, and a career-high 23 stolen bases in 154 games this past season for St. Louis.

jd1020 · 12-10-2015, 01:30 PM

If anyone is going to go full reerun for Heyward, it would be the Angels.

jd1020 · 12-10-2015, 02:05 PM

Hearing talk that Jason Heyward isn't looking for 10 years at $20M/year. More like $24M/year for 8 or 9 years.
— Jayson Stark (@jaysonst) December 10, 2015

Don't think I would give Heyward the same AAV that the Orioles are offering Chris Davis.

**BigRedChief** · 12-10-2015, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

Don't think I would give Heyward the same AAV that the Orioles are offering Chris Davis.

No way Mo is going to pay $24 million for 8-9 years. Only the Angels would do that. He's gone.

DJ's left nut · 12-10-2015, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

No way Mo is going to pay $24 million for 8-9 years. Only the Angels would do that. He's gone.

If the AAV is 24 million, you suspect there's at least a little backloading in there (SOP in Anaheim).

So they'll be paying nearly $90 million for Trout, Heyward and Pujols in 2018? Throw in Simmons and you're over $100 million for 4 guys.

Then again, when you figure that he's already paying Hamilton $50 million over the next 2 seasons, he's already approaching nearly $100 million for Trout, Pujols, Hamilton and CJ Wilson so clearly Arte gives zero ****s.

I really do hate that guy.

More shiny baubles for Carlota and the rest of the Angels 'fans'...

10-12-2015, 08:54 PM
BigRedChief Has a particular set of skills Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: On the water Casino cash: $-631038 VARSITY	*Official 2015 STL Cardinals Thread III.* 2011 World Series Championship 2012 NLCS. One win from another WS appearance. 2013 World Series. Two wins from another World Series Championship 2014 NLCS. Three wins from another WS appearance 2015 Central Division title. Won 100 games. Lost in the NLDS. Made the postseason 11 times in the last 15 seasons. Only 1 losing season since 2000. Reached the World Series 4 times since 2004 and won as many championships (two) the past eight seasons as it did from 1965 to 2005. Made the NLCS 9 times including the last 4 years 2011-2014 Three million attendance? Take it to the bank. 65 post season wins since 2004. 22+ wins more than any other team. Last edited by BigRedChief; 10-14-2015 at 05:00 PM..
Posts: 81,276

12-10-2015, 10:49 AM	#856
Pasta Little Brioni Consuming CP souls Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: U.S.A. Casino cash: $328880	Thanks DJ. Glad I wasn't the only one who noticed the empty numbers this guy put up. I knew it was bad, but wow... __________________ **Official TFWdemB Trivia Commisioner**
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12-10-2015, 11:39 AM	#862
jd1020 In Search of a Life Join Date: Nov 2010 Casino cash: $7042645	At the end of the day Heyward probably ends up in Anaheim. I think Heyward in Chicago would come down to a Castroesque deal with Soler but the pitchers they've inquired about in a deal for Soler (Miller/Salazar) haven't gone any where.
Posts: 24,502

12-10-2015, 11:46 AM	#863
DJ's left nut Sauntering Vaguely Downwards Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Columbia, Mo Casino cash: $-700901	Salazar for Soler....Damn, that deal makes a frustrating amount of sense for both sides. I like Salazar a ton and if he ends up in Chicago, they'll iron out the rough edges on that slider of his. His fastball/changeup combination is as good as there is in baseball, he just needs one more consistent weapon to be a borderline CY candidate, IMO. The Cubs are spinning straw into gold with some regularity in their pitching staff. If they could get their hands on Salazar, he'd be a pretty obvious counter for Martinez. Suddenly the Cubs would have an edge at 1-5 in the rotation (though Garcia vs. Hammel at 4 I'd probably edge Cards when Garcia is healthy...he's just never healthy) and pretty much every spot on the diamond. __________________ "If there's a god, he's laughing at us.....and our football team..." "When you look at something through rose colored glasses, all the red flags just look like flags."
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12-10-2015, 12:59 PM	#865
O.city In Search of a Life Join Date: Jul 2009 Casino cash: $-585936	I'd be interested if we have enough to go get Todd Frazier s d if he could play an adequate first base.
Posts: 84,172

12-10-2015, 01:29 PM	#866
Marco Polo Veteran Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: 41°59.4′N 87°39.6'W Casino cash: $3968908	According to FOX Sports' Jon Morosi, the Angels are among the finalists for Jason Heyward. This seems to be coming to a head, with the Cardinals and Cubs acting as the other serious parties currently diving for the finish line. Heyward is expected to make a decision by the end of the week, and perhaps as Thursday evening. The 26-year-old Gold Glove outfielder figures to land something close to $200 million over nine or 10 years. He slashed .293/.359/.439 with 13 home runs, 60 RBI, and a career-high 23 stolen bases in 154 games this past season for St. Louis.
Posts: 2,540

12-10-2015, 01:30 PM	#867
jd1020 In Search of a Life Join Date: Nov 2010 Casino cash: $7042645	If anyone is going to go full reerun for Heyward, it would be the Angels.
Posts: 24,502

12-10-2015, 02:05 PM	#868
jd1020 In Search of a Life Join Date: Nov 2010 Casino cash: $7042645	Hearing talk that Jason Heyward isn't looking for 10 years at $20M/year. More like $24M/year for 8 or 9 years. — Jayson Stark (@jaysonst) December 10, 2015 Don't think I would give Heyward the same AAV that the Orioles are offering Chris Davis.
Posts: 24,502